Beginner wire questions

kolmansoifer · May 4

Hi all,
Thanks for the help so far.
I've laid out my simple lithium and solar project and started wiring things up today.
By the way, this is my first dc project but i'm handy and have built stuff all my life.

So, i can't fit 10 agw wire in either of my charge controllers (Victron SmartSolar 100/20 and 75/10).
Did I buy the wrong stranded pure copper wire? Is there a type I should/shouldn't have bought?
I crimped the only ferrule on i could fit, still too big. I mean it's not even close
Do people thin out the stripped end so it can fit? That doesn't sound correct...

Anyway, thoughts? Advice?

Thanks all,
KS

Grumpy_G · May 4

10AWG *should* fit because that's what Victron lists for the terminals, never had an issue with their solar chargers or DC-DC converters. The terminals are somewhat different from the ones typically used in the US (Victron is a Dutch company) so make sure they are all the way "open" before inserting the wire.

Basil48192 · May 4

I have two, Victron charge controllers. The first came with the camper. While working under the driver's side seat last year I kept hearing an electrical 'short' noise. I noticed that the wires coming out of the bottom of the controller had a lot of stray strands handing out...apparently done when the camper was built. If I happended to bump the wiring, some of those strands would touch and 'spark'. Obviously, I pulled them out, straightened them, then remounted them. I do remember it being very tight...but I don't think I trimmed any strands to get them to fit.
I installed a second controller for my suitcase solar panel. I honestly don't remember having trouble fitting them in, but I'll double check the wire size for you later today.

Maxcamp · May 4

Do not thin down the wires.
You don't need the ferrule.
Check there are no loose strands after tightening gently and pull testing for firm hold.

elbolillo · May 4

@kolmansoifer I used 8 awg wire between my solar controllers and batteries, so 10 awg will definitely work. Are you absolutely certain that you have completely loosened the screws to allow the wire to be seated? There should be plenty of wiggle room.

ColMag · May 4

My 75/15 manual doesn't say anything about whether to use ferrule crimps or not. Victron being European (Dutch), and ferrules considered being a European "thing", and ferrule usage considered being neat and good practice, as a technician, I wanted to use them. However at one point I found a written comment by a Victron employee in a forum that said not to use them in their terminals since their terminals were designed not to need/use them. So I did not use them, but the fit is quite snug for the recommended 10 AWG bare wire that the terminals are supposedly designed for. The wire ends must be formed very neatly and need a very steady hand inserting them. If you are tired of retrying and ended up with just 1 or 2 strands** sticking out, not a big deal I think... Either squash them in tight to the terminal or trim them off. All this said, I later found it recommend by a respected American Victron distributor/installer who preferred using ferrules. But when I tried using them mine were just a bit too big to fit in... Maybe shifting in the crimper jaw and crimping a 2nd time might make it small enough.

**EDITED: note that I am referring to wire that I added for additional controllers; I used premium marine grade wire with 100 strands; thus 1 or 2 strands less are not a significant loss; personally, in my case I draw the line at 3 strands or more, which I keep retrying till it was 2 or less. If you are using wire with fewer strands it may not be acceptable to trim even 1 strand

pthomas745 · May 4

I've used ferrules on the ends of my controllers (not Victron) for several years. Why Victron would say this about ferrules (I've found the same post) is very hard to understand.

RTWCTS · May 4

Two things that were beneficial to me over several Victron controller installs:
1. It was easiest to have the controller free from the mounting surface when installing wires. Orient it face down. This will let gravity pull the lug down and provide the best opening to install a well-formed wire. Plus, you'll be in a less awkward position trying to complete the task.
2. After the install is completed and everything has some time to 'rest' go back and retighten the lugs (This is something I repeat on occasion in case road related vibration loosens things up- it happened to me).

ColMag · May 4

For anyone interested in this topic/thread, please see my edited clarified comment. Thanks

elbolillo · May 4

Victron MPPTs use the rising clamp terminal, so ferrules are not required. They also specify stranded wire that has fine strands for better contact. I imagine that is why they don’t recommend ferrules. Regardless, I have had no problems with all the strands fitting even with 8 awg wire.

donmontalvo · May 5

pthomas745 said:

I've used ferrules on the ends of my controllers (not Victron) for several years. Why Victron would say this about ferrules (I've found the same post) is very hard to understand.

The Victron page on Facebook has 300K members, and a mix of pro/anti ferrule opinions.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/victronenergyusergroup/

I opened a ticket with Victron and their response is both work. Bare wire vs farrules, they don't have any hard rules, it's up to the person doing the wiring.

I personally use ferrules on my Victron charge controllers. Why? Because.

pthomas745 · May 5

Thank you for that research!

Long story, but my controllers are not "mounted" anywhere inside the trailer. One of the big issues with having a controller flopping around the campsite is "strain relief", just keeping those wires from flexing and pulling out of the weird little "boxes" the controllers have. (Again...why?) Ferrules really helped secure the wiring, and, bonus, made it a snap to simply reconnect them.

Some owners here also had "stand alone" controllers, and their examples of small electronic enclosures, with holes drilled for gland nuts that keep the wiring from pulling away, have helped me quite a lot. My controllers have "permanent" wires attached with short SAE pigtails with ferruled ends into the controller. It takes me just a moment or so to attach the solar cables and the cables to the battery.

kolmansoifer · May 6

Thanks for the replies everyone. I ended up using ferrules and got everything connected. There were some tight fits but i got it to work. Learning new things everyday on this project. Appreciate everyone's feedback.

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