3-way NorCold on Propane Question

T@Buhura

This weekend I finally fired up our NorCold fridge on propane and after a couple of attempts it lit up green. After about 20 min I started noticing the exhaust cap/vent on the outside started getting some soot/blackening with some moisture accumulating. It was cool (low 60s) and overcast. The big question is should there be a faint plastic smell while the fridge is burning propane? The fridge was definitely getting cold inside but outside the T@B we could detect the faint smell of hot/burning plastic. There was what seemed to be some vapor (very light) but with the soot and smell I did worry if something was suffering a "controlled burn". After more than 40 minutes I shut it down.

At no time could we detect any smoke or smell inside. It was just outside and definitely coming out via the exhaust cap/cover in front of our T@B. Is this normal? This is our first camper and have never had a propane powered fridge.

mawebb

I experienced the smell of hot plastic the first time I used my fridge on propane, but never checked the outside vents. Propane should burn clean so if there is soot, then it sounds like the air / fuel mixture may not be set correctly. I assume there is an adjustment that could correct this. The smell I assume is the oil film that is left on the metal parts during the manufacturing process and should diminish with use. 

T@Buhura

I definitely suspect, as with much of the rest of our T@B, that this was the first time the fridge was powered up on propane (or any fuel for that matter - all of the new stickers and hang tag/labels were still in place). The fridge if used at all (we have a 2006) was as storage. It had not wear marks or stains inside and the first time I powered it up on 120v and later 12v we got that faint smell of dust burning off (like a forced air heater powering up for the first time in winter). Even the stove had never been used either. The confirmation/clue, besides the previous owner saying they never cooked in the T@B, was watching the steel grill change colors after I figured out how to light it and keep it burning.  

That's a good thought - re: air/propane mixture - although I've not seen mention of any adjustments except maybe the burner gap (like a spark plug). I had tried taking the plastic cover off to the left of the fridge to figure out if there was anything behind there that may have burned. I didn't see or smell anything inside the T@B but did notice dust - like it had been off-road on a dusty trail. I couldn't figure out how to safely pull the fridge out to inspect more of it. It seems like I'd have to take quite a bit of the cabinet apart to get it to slide out more.

mawebb said: I experienced the smell of hot plastic the first time I used my fridge on propane, but never checked the outside vents. Propane should burn clean so if there is soot, then it sounds like the air / fuel mixture may not be set correctly. I assume there is an adjustment that could correct this. The smell I assume is the oil film that is left on the metal parts during the manufacturing process and should diminish with use.  BTW: jealous of your T@B's name, Capt.  

mawebb

With the fridge having sat for a number of years, it's possible that there are literally cob webs in the burner. Apparently small spiders like to nest in the small air tubes of barbecues etc.  

ChanW

Tabu,  the spiderwebs idea is what came to my mind. You might have to pull off the burner to clean it, if it doesn't clear itself up...

Just be careful if the Capt. asks you into his quarters "to discuss it".

T@Buhura

Are there instructions available for easiest way to safely pull out the fridge?

ChanW said:

Tabu,  the spiderwebs idea is what came to my mind. You might have to pull off the burner to clean it, if it doesn't clear itself up...

Just be careful if the Capt. asks you into his quarters "to discuss it".

mawebb

Recently a link to the manual was posted:
Norcold 3163.  Manual: http://www.thetford.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/1236/636287-Installation-Owners-Manual.pdf

There is information regrading "maintenance" but for me, this may be beyond what I am willing to do, and I consider myself a technical person.

I refer such issues to "Scotty in engineering"; apparently it has something to do with dilithium crystals.

T@Buhura

Ha, I'd seen that too and it didn't seem to give a lot of detail on the installation or removal. I'm certain it depends too much on the specific application. I'll try to give it another look to see if I might be able to use this to figure out where things could connected without having to remove too much of the cabinetry. When I last tried I only got it out about an 1".

The good news is it didn't get to a "she can't take it much longer, captain" situation after firing it up for 40min. The more I think about it, I do think/hope it is nothing more than first burn and debris from lack of use.

mawebb said:

Recently a link to the manual was posted:
Norcold 3163.  Manual: http://www.thetford.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/1236/636287-Installation-Owners-Manual.pdf

There is information regrading "maintenance" but for me, this may be beyond what I am willing to do, and I consider myself a technical person.

I refer such issues to "Scotty in engineering"; apparently it has something to do with dilithium crystals.

source3

T@Buhura said:

Are there instructions available for easiest way to safely pull out the fridge?

A quick search on the internet yields a few good links.  Doesn't matter what the 3163 is installed in.

1. http://www.rialtainfo.com/winnebago/refrigerator.htm
2. http://1705.net/archives/329
   
3. http://www.rialtainfo.com/winnebago/winnebago_images/3163_Service_Manual.pdf
   

ChanW

That's good stuff Andrew, thanks.

I like the middle one that starts out 'you owe it to yourself to pull the Norcold out, just to see what makes it tick'....

I think I'll wait till mine isn't 'ticking' properly, before I go to the effort to take it out. :-)

leenscottfl

I'm with you ChanW. Only if mine goes out I'll take it to someone who already knows how it ticks.

T@Buhura

Well, I wimped out and took it to dealer to have them verify it. The tech was able to quickly warm it up and keep it running. Within 2 min it started smoking (very lightly with slight condensation forming) and the smell of burning plastic began emitting pretty quickly too. He felt it was likely dirty - as simple as bugs (dirt daubers) - from not having been used in years. I'd rather have a tech look at it at this point and do a thorough inspection/cleaning if necessary so that we can safely rely on it for a long trip. Next time I'm definitely up for pulling it myself. Thanks for the great finds Andrew! I wasn't having as much luck finding good guides on a proper tear down. I think the best one was #2 which seemed to be most generic. Honestly the hard part is getting to work on it without raising the ire of the HOA gods - unfortunately our garage door opening isn't tall enough to let us slide it in for storage. We're technically limited to 2 days of pre and 2 of post trip prep but our neighbors have been gracious and let us push that to as long as 4 days while we ramp up on T@Bdom  

ChanW

Oh dear the HOA.

if I had the HOA thorn, I'd look into lowering the Tab somehow, to get it in the garage.

T@Buhura

Yes in deed! The irony of course is that the biggest reason we picked the hood we live in is for that. Especially given the higher home prices vs our old state. We were finding so many great neighborhoods with the occasional neighbors with the oddest things in the driveway or poking out from over the fence. Things from trailers , boats and campers to large RVs (big tour bus kind) to 40ft yachts (one was taller than the 3 story house it was parked in front of and practically used up the whole driveway) and 22+ foot sailboats with keels and masts in full glory to vintage airplanes! I guess it would be really cool to have a neighbor with a nice vintage bi-plane out front. But some neighborhoods looked like trailer parks in spite of the really nice homes. Oh well!

ChanW said:

Oh dear the HOA.

if I had the HOA thorn, I'd look into lowering the Tab somehow, to get it in the garage.

Ratkity

ChanW said:

Oh dear the HOA.

if I had the HOA thorn, I'd look into lowering the Tab somehow, to get it in the garage.

If it's just by a few inches, I have a truck driver friend that will lower the tire pressure in his rig to go under a problematic local bridge to get to a particular vendor. Of course, he has to re-fill all those semi tires, but he insists that the long way around the bridge has more problems and takes more time than lowering the tire pressures (not flat - but like you'd lower them to drive on a beach). 

I'd tell you to refill them once in the garage, but you might forget to deflate them before taking the T@B back out of it and cream the top of the garage door and your roof+roof vent.

T@Buhura

Mystery solved! It was a bee's nest that had been built deep in the exhaust. The smell was it smoldering and it was also starving the air flow so it was burning rich. 

Does anyone cover the exhaust ports when not in use to avoid nests or other debris from obstructing air flow or causing other problems? Is there a clever way without having to take the cap off each time to plug it? 

Verna

I saw a cover for an exhaust port this weekend in an RV store. I asked about it and apparently, it is very common for Mud Daubbers and bees to build nests inside these openings. Since I'm so allergic to bee and wasp stings ( and, yes, even freak out with Mud Daubbers), that I would spend the money on the vent cover. It was sort of a mesh cover that fit over the outside of the exhaust. This was a rectangular cover, but surely there is one made for the T@B cover--you can't be the only one who has experienced this. 

ChanW

Wish I had a clever way, but I cut the bottoms off two gallon jugs and stick them over the intake/exhaust vents while parked. When on the road, we haven't bothered.

I also screen the exhaust/intake on the Alde, and screen over everywhere else a bug could get in.

I'm afraid the mud daubers, and the ladybugs in the fall, will try to get in there.

T@Buhura

Oh that's an idea! I could take the cap off and put screen over the actual opening then put the cap back on over it. It would keep things from finding their way in (big bugs any way). I'll look into that option!

@Verna - I too am allergic (anaphylactic) to bee stings (yellow jackets, etc) so I'm glad I dropped it off although there certainly wouldn't have been any risk as the nest had been smoldering and the bees had most probably relocated a long time ago.

ChanW said:

Wish I had a clever way, but I cut the bottoms off two gallon jugs and stick them over the intake/exhaust vents while parked. When on the road, we haven't bothered.

I also screen the exhaust/intake on the Alde, and screen over everywhere else a bug could get in.

I'm afraid the mud daubers, and the ladybugs in the fall, will try to get in there.

mawebb

If you use covers, don't forgt to remove them before using the gas appliances. 

ChanW

Screening the Alde or the fridge while they are running might create difficulties for their combustion. The screening might limit the air and exhaust flow just enough to affect it. 

Like the covers on our fridge i/o vents, we remove the screen on the Alde vent when in operation (which is usually not bug season, anyway)