Alde 3010 connection failure?

JP2558

I went out this morning just to check the battery level (the panel said 12.5v), since it hasn't been used or charged for a few weeks (2018 TAB 320 CS). However the Alde 3010 panel lit up with the following image. I went into the controls and did a reset. Shut off and turned on the Alde panel and the same message appeared. Thoughts anyone?

JP2558

After I posted this I reviewed the Alde 3010 manual (should have looked there first!) and in there it said, for this error, simply disconnect the 12v power from the battery. I did that and waited a few minutes and plugged it back in, and it's back to normal! We will be using it in a few weeks, but in the meantime I put a reminder on my calendar to check the battery every week. Tomorrow I will be home all day so I intend to plug it in and re-charge it.

Sharon_is_SAM

See, if everything went perfectly every time, we wouldn’t learn how to troubleshoot😂. Alde gremlins struck again!

BrianZ

@JP2558, glad you found the fix.
If we have that issue, I can just flip off the Alde 12V power switch I installed next to the converter..


Since it's usually off unless we're using the Alde, it shouldn't be an issue for us anyway.  At least this switch is readily accessible, so we wouldn't need to pull the 12V plug from the top inside the Alde in your situation.  I installed it as a kill switch to avoid excess "phamperage" drain on the battery from the Alde display circuit that occurs even when the display is "off".

JP2558

@Brianz, thanks. Unplugging mine is quite easy as there is a two outlet ‘wall socket’ already installed. It’s literally as easy as plugging in a lamp at home.

BrianZ

@JP2558, there is also a separate 12V power line that supplies the electronics & control panel.  It's the 12V functions that are the issue, not the 120V supply.
PS:  Or, with the trailer unplugged from 120V power, turn the battery isolation switch off & wait a while before turning back on.

JP2558

@Brianz -Thanks Brian. I spent most of yesterday reviewing the Alde manual and several posts here too. I did find the 12v DC connector inside the Alde (for future reference), and when I did experience the problem last week I used the battery isolation switch in the propane tub to disable the battery, before I unplugged it to reset it. That seemed to work but I will be tinkering again today (and check it) so hopefully all will go well.

BrianZ

That's great, @JP2558!
And for anyone to see the "12V DC" cable we've been talking about, here's a view of the Alde cables, which are labeled twice on ours - both directly under the cables & on the underside of the lid that covers them..

JP2558

Darn. I unplugged my shore power, disconnected the 12v and the 120v, reconnected both, went to get groceries, got back and plugged her in and still got the connection failure error. Hmmmm. Not sure what the next step should be. It worked over Memorial Day weekend.

Sharon_is_SAM

After you unplugged from shorepower, what do you mean that you then disconnected from 12v and from 120v?  You should be turning off the Alde at the panel and then unplugging from shorepower before or after turning the battery switch off.  It sounds like you unplugged the Alde at it’s 120v outlet - you don’t need to do that.

JP2558

@Sharon_is_SAM, I turned off the Alde at the panel. Then disconnected hte shore power. Then I disconnected the 12v and reconnected it inside the Alde itself. At that time I also disconnected and reconnected the 120v (as that was what worked last week). We then went grocery shopping so it had about 1.5 hours to discharge any remaining current before we returned home at which time I connected the shore power and turned on the Alde panel and got the error message.

Bayliss

@JP2558, is there any possibility that one of the small glass Alde fuses blew?  I wouldn't think so since the display is showing a connection error, but you may want to check anyway just as a part of your trouble-shooting.  Be sure you have disconnected all power to the trailer before removing (or replacing) the fuses, and also be sure that you block the gap behind the Alde tank before you remove the fuses so they don't accidentally fall into that gap.  The only other thing I could think of is that one of those cables to the Alde are just not completely seated, so double-check that as well.  Good luck!!

JP2558

@Bayliss, I did reseat the the connection to both the 12v dc and to the alde panel. I didn’t think of checking the glass fuses but will do so tomorrow. And I’ve read numerous post advising how to properly remove them without losing them! Wish me luck, and thank you again for all your input.

Bayliss

Good luck! @JP2558.  We're all rootin for you.

JP2558

Well replacing the fuses with the two spares I had did not work, but I noticed the bag the spares were in was already open, so I guess they could be suspect, so I ordered some new ones. I will test with those and after that if I still have a problem I will contact Alde directly.

ScottG

When glass fuses are blown it's usually obvious that the wire inside is broken. If in doubt a quick check with a multimeter's continuity setting will remove any guesswork. Unfortunately, I suspect your problem is not as simple as the fuses.

I wonder if there is not a loose connection at the panel itself. Can you pop it off somehow and check whatever wires or harnesses are behind it?

pthomas745

@BrianZ thanks for the photo of the 12v connector at the Alde.  I'm going to borrow it if you don't mind.

I would also suggest that the photo of where this wire is be added to the Fuses For Newbies file.  It comes up in every discussion of the various failures the Alde throws out.

The Alde fuses are the worst for seeing if they are good or not!  I just replace them both at the same time and sort the bad one out with a multimeter later.

Bayliss

@pthomas745, I know I have posted similar photos on other threads, but if you are referring to the photo in this thread, that was posted by @BrianZ.  Regardless, feel free to use any photo I post.

tabiphile

Fuses goodness is easily checked with a Volt Ohm Meter (VOM). If you check the resistance of the fuse (use the ohm setting) and if it shows no path through the fuse (toast, zero reading) the fuse is bad. If you are not comfortable with a VOM they make very easy to use testers with a bulb that lights up when you have a good circuit/fuse. You can buy these at an auto parts for next to nothing.

pthomas745

@Bayliss , thanks, fixed.....

jkjenn

pthomas745 said:

@BrianZ thanks for the photo of the 12v connector at the Alde.  I'm going to borrow it if you don't mind.

I would also suggest that the photo of where this wire is be added to the Fuses For Newbies file.  It comes up in every discussion of the various failures the Alde throws out.

The Alde fuses are the worst for seeing if they are good or not!  I just replace them both at the same time and sort the bad one out with a multimeter later.

Zoom in with your cell phone camera. Who needs cheaters? 😁

pthomas745

Just a few minutes ago I was out playing with the Alde fuse holders and the fuses.  When I needed to read the fuse I had to go inside and grab the magnifying glass!

BrianZ

Sure, @pthomas745, that's why I shared it, so others can see or keep for reference.

JP2558

Here's a current status update:

I sent the following to Alde on Tuesday:

"I have an Alde 3010, which is about three years old and has been used no more than ten times. It worked at the end of May 2020, but now when I plug into shore power I’m seeing the connection failure error on the control panel. The manual says to simply unplug the 12v plug, re-connect it and wait awhile before testing. I’ve done this, along with disconnecting the 120v, changed both the 3.15 fuses (with the control panel plug disconnected beforehand). All of those steps were done with shore power disconnected and the 12v battery disabled. However I still get the connection failure error. Can Alde offer any additional steps for troubleshooting this problem?"

The response I received on Tuesday is:

"Connection failure is a fault that occurs when the heater and control panel have an issue talking to each other . 

I would first of all check the connections , disable the firefly as it may be that interfering . If by unplugging the firefly system and it works ok , there’s the issue . 

If the fault does not go away, even after checking the cable ( loose connections are the most common) from heater to panel then it could be a software issue on the pcb or panel"

My follow up question was:

"What is the firefly?"

So far they have not responded.

Has anyone heard of this "firefly"? What it is/does? And if I disconnect it what functionality is lost?

I doubt it is a software issue. There is no way for the software to have simply "changed" unless support meant issuing a 'reset' via the Alde panel (which I've done twice).

Also I don't understand the "pcb or panel" comment. Is that two different things or the same name for one thing?

Any help would be appreciated.

Verna

I do believe the “firefly” is actually the Airstream system’s interface to everything in the Airstream....an interface that failed miserably (sorry Airstream) in a one year 30’ model. (Airstream has been buying back those models.)

T@B’s do not have this firefly interface. 

JP2558

@Verna - thanks for that valuable piece of information.

Bayliss

@JP2558, "pcb" refers to "Printed Circuit Board" (the electronics with the soldered connections....often times, a green plastic board.)  The "panel" is the Alde display panel.  If you have not done it, pull the cover off the Alde display panel and check to see if you see any obvious issues.  The metal frame comes off easily.

Just for additional info, I found the below info in the 3020 Service Manual.  Pretty much the same thing that the Alde rep wrote:

"CONNECTION FAILURE"

Caused by:

A communication fault between the boiler and control panel.

Likely causes of the fault: 

• Break in the cables for data communication between

the boiler and control panel.

• The ignition spark is striking earth and interfering with

communication.

• Some other electrical device is interfering with communication.

JP2558

@Bayliss - thanks for clearing that up.

Verna

There is one soldered fuse on the Alde circuit board. I think it was @Chan who replaced that fuse. Normally, the repair shop will simply replace the entire circuit board instead of soldering a new fuse in place. 

I have no explanation why my main circuit board went out last fall. But, Austin and his co-workers replaced the circuit board and all is well in the Alde now. 

Bayliss

@JP2558, one more thing to check, just in case.........

https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/10052/alde-display-panel-electrical-connection-pinched-wire-info-only

JP2558

@Verna, I did see that post Chan provided. Hopefully it doesn’t come to replacing the circuit board.

@Bayliss, no pinched wires (yea)!  However I did follow your last suggestion, and got into the backside of the control panel and in there, there is another plug similar to the 12v plug near the fuses. I unplugged it and reseated it and it appears to be working again! I tested it five times by toggling the on/off, and so far, knock on wood, it hasn’t failed. Next week will be the true test as we hit the road for a two night stay about two hours from home.