Looking for TV

shane1

My wife and I are thinking of purchasing a small travel trailer. Most likely the TAB 400. We would need a new tow vehicle so I am trying to figure out what the best all around tow vehicle is for long trips. It will also be my everyday driver when not camping. I dont commute as I work part time from home. Originally looked at the BMW X5 but I am thinking that a truck chassis may be better long term?? The number of choices seem overwhelming so I wanted to ask the community for ideas. 

gkreitzburg

Seen a lot of Tacoma, 4runner, frontier, etc. There's even a guy on ut that pulls his with a porsche cayenne. We bought a tundra, which is over-kill but provides lots of extra space; and I don't have to daily drive it much. Just make sure you have 7-ish towing capacity. 5k will do, but get a good WDH.

bergger

We live in Colorado and tow our T@b 400 mostly in the Rockies so we decided to go from a Tacoma to a full size Nissan Titan.  Love the Titan over the Tacoma.  It tows much better and is much more comfortable for long trips.  The added storage space in it is very nice as well.  When it comes to towing there is so much more than just the published tow weight capacity.  And of course that capacity is generally based on flat ground at sea level.  The size and strength of the frame, the brakes, differentials, transmission, engine cooling, torque, hp, wheel base/track, weight of the vehicle.  They all play a role in towing performance.  You can absolutely tow a 400 with a midsize truck or suv and many people do.  But having towed with a mid size and full size truck I absolutely prefer a full size truck for towing a 400.  

RMo

We spend about 4 weeks a year driving with the Tab 400 attached and 48 without so we opted for a very comfy SUV that will do the towing adequately, has plenty of room for gear and is pleasant to drive 52 weeks a year.  No regrets.

TomCanada

We tow with an X3 (m40i) and it's plenty - 4400lb capacity (well within spec - we checked tongue weight and full weight and we're around 320lbs tongue and 3500lbs).  The 6 cylinder (near 400hp and 400lb-ft torque) can accelerate like it has nothing on it.  You could even get by with the 4 cylinder (we towed with a 4 cylinder Q5 for a couple years too) if you don't mind sluggish acceleration.  Keep it at or under 62mph/100kph and you don't need any fancy schmancy WDH or sway bars.  As always, people love the extra safety margin a truck provides and that's fine, but I find that level of overkill unnecessary IMHO.

elbolillo

We pull our '23 Tab 400 with a 2021 Honda Pilot. We have logged 20,000+ miles over the past year and a half. We have traveled over the Berthoud Pass and Wolf Creek Pass in Colorado and other mountain passes in our travels and have not had any problems. We use a Fastway WDH and find it to be the perfect combination with this vehicle.

dragonsdofly

@shane1 do you have a tow pkg on your Jeep Trailhawk? What is your tow capacity and tongue weight limit?

If the Trailhawk has a tow pkg, you may not need a new tow vehicle. Please get back to us with those answers and the group will be able to help direct you-

shane1

The Trailhawk has the tow package with a rating of 4500 lbs and a tongue weight of 440lbs. Payload is about 1000lbs. Tab400 GVWR is about 4000lbs and real world TW will be close to max or over. I want more of a safety margin in all areas. Also looking for more interior and/or bed space to carry luggage/camping items. The Cherokee is a compact size and I am interested in a mid size at minimum. The engine is fairly strong and is a great everyday vehicle albeit a little small.

dragonsdofly

@shane1 thanks for the more detailed info. Although we have a 320, we also wanted much more capacity and capability than the barest minimum. We originally had (and still have) a gmc envoy xl as a tow vehicle. That tv (2 wheel drive) has a 5000 lbs tow max and and 500 lb tongue weight. The full frame is an added plus. We towed almost 40,000 miles through more than 30 states with the envoy and found the extra capacity while traveling to be comforting. We took our last long trip with our chevy silverado 2500hd towing the t@b and found our full crew cab, long bed to be just too much truck. The Behemoth played crack the whip with the t@b. We keep our tow speed pegged at 60 mph and it was not possible to protect the t@b from the heavy weight, stiff suspensioned, long wheel base of the truck.

I'm assuming you are searching for a great balance of tow vehicle to trailer somewhere between minimal and overkill. That balance feels different for everyone. So, good luck with your quest. Enjoy the challenge. It's all part of the adventure! 

rh5555

We towed our 400 with a Trailhawk Elite for several years, and although we never encountered any sway or other issues, the TV was (in our opinion) somewhat under-powered for the task (we had the 2L turbo).  We have since upgraded to the 3L LandRover Defender 110 (4-door) with air suspension, and this has to be the ultimate TV.  It has gobs of power, you can barely feel the trailer is behind you, absolutely no sway issues (no WDH), it self-levels, it is super quiet driving down regular roads and you can go exploring on crazy back roads.  We love it. It also has been totally reliable (I hear several readers gasp) and other than puncturing 2 tires on extra sharp rocks we've never been slowed down.  Expensive, but amazing. and not too huge.

shane1

Thanks, the Defender is on my list as well as the Discovery. I have been seriously considering the BMW X5/X7, Land Rover, and new Tacoma. I go back a forth between these and possibly other pick ups due to the truck bed ability to easily haul gas, generator, camping gear, etc. The day to day luxury, power, features, quiet cabin, great ride quality, etc. of the BMW and Land Rover are appealing also. I would also get an extended warranty because repairs can be very costly. How has LR reliability been for you? The reputation is not great but many times that is based on select models or lack of maintenance.

rh5555

The Defender has been completely reliable and we're up to 40,000 miles, about 1/3 of that pulling the TAB400.  The only warranty work was for a sticky passenger door.  Service interval is every 21,000 miles, and although dealer servicing is expensive, it doesn't come around that often.  Only downside is that because of the rear swing door and spare tire that's mounted on it, you have to modify the front jack to be removable so that it doesn't interfere when going round corners.  We use the Ultimate Jack

   

dlb

An X5 is more than enough.  We use an Audi SQ5 for ours.  The nice thing is when you are not hooked up it is enjoyable to drive where ever you happen to be.

Maxcamp

If you do look at Tacomas or other trucks, a few thoughts. 

Tacoma and some others dropped V6 for a smaller 2024 V4 with turbo.  We avoided costly and less hardy Turbo and looked for a 2023 3.5L V6 for towing.

Few if any manual transmissions available.  Auto gear programming may be totally unsuited to towing unless has a Tow Mode or you reprogram the computer to maintain higher rpms.
Factory 5th gear at 35mph 1100 rpm and 6th overdrive at 43mph 980 rpm getting on highway is unacceptable!
A Scangauge III on dash helps monitor torque and fluids temperatures. 

Few if any single cabs available.  Dual cab lengthens turning radius dramatically.  I can no longer make needed turns in drive or Uturn the camper.

Few if any "tow ready" trucks come with a Brake Controller.  Have to add one.

Tailgate will not clear center mounted jacks.  Side jack or removable trailer Jack needed.

Our new 2023 Tacoma  handles and tows well.  Need towing mirrors.  Old V4 Tacoma was not up to towing on hills or altitude.

enzo86

we are using a 24 Kia Teluride X-PRO on our 400, 5500lb tow rating, 550lb tongue weight max. Electric Brake controller install was very simple.

TomCanada

dragonsdofly said:

I'm assuming you are searching for a great balance of tow vehicle to trailer somewhere between minimal and overkill. That balance feels different for everyone. 

We should sticky this comment for when the inevitable future discussions on 'how much TV is enough' come up

shane1

Good idea. The wrong tow vehicle can be an expensive mistake. I appreciate everyone’s feedback. I want to make sure I can easily tow the Tab400 or similar and not just be good most of the time.

CharlieRN

enzo86 said:

we are using a 24 Kia Teluride X-PRO on our 400, 5500lb tow rating, 550lb tongue weight max. Electric Brake controller install was very simple.

I'll second the Telluride. We have a 2022 EX-P with "only" a 5,000# rating, and use it  for towing a somewhat lighter 320, but we are barely aware that anything's behind us. I'm sure that will be much the same for towing the 400 with the Telly. We have the Prodigy RF system that is a great alternative to the typical cockpit brake controller. 

The Telluride is a great all-around performer; quiet, capable and comfortable. We were a long-time Volvo family, and the Telly is quite close to an XC-90 in most areas. There's a reason the Telluride has been the CR top pick in the mid-size SUV category for several years running. The one drawback, and it's a big one, is the shoddy Kia dealer network. Telluride build quality is very high (it was designed in the US, in CA, is built in GA, and has a high percentage of North American components), so thankfully, visits to the dealer are infrequent.

TacoDr1ver

Towed our 400 BD to Sugar Creek for maintenance empty with a new '23 Tacoma from NE Tennessee.  As soon as we got back,  went to local Toyota dealership where we bought it and traded. Never been so dissatisfied with a vehicle, underpowered for mountain towing, that wonky transmission and uncomfortable seats.  Thought about a Tundra but seemed too big for us so we got a new '24 Tacoma Limited. Boy do I love this truck. Loaded and also built-in brake controller and trailer assist. Can't say enough about it.

Maxcamp

@TacoDr1ver, was your 23 an automatic V6 six speed?  What gears were you towing in?  If not in D4  you'd have no power on the highway. 

If the smaller V4 engine on a 2024 10 speed is more satisfying than the 2023 V6 6 speed, that just proves appropriate gear selection is the key which you can manipulate manually.

Good info on the rationale for manual override when towing here:

https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/the-tacoma-towing-bible.4031/page-100#post-29733669

Have to say after a lifetime of MT I hate being forced into an  automatic... which doesn't even tell you which gear is active!
Scangauge III is a critical tool to driving this thing and selection of the necessary override gears.