Trickle charging while storing

Allie

I store my T@B in the garage when not using it.  The battery is hooked up to a Die Hard Battery Charger/Maintainer on the 2A 12V setting.  After the battery is charged, a few days later the red light comes on and the panel in the T@B is blinking and beeping.  Not sure if there was a power fluctuation causing it, the battery, or the charger.  Has anyone else had this problem or thoughts?
Thanks,

Nomad

What red light?

Allie

The red light on the charger.  There are 3 lights on the trickle charger, red, yellow and green.  Red = problem, yellow = charging, green = charged.

Nomad

Ok - Just wanted to make sure you weren't talking about the little red light in the T@B

ChanW

How old is your DieHard charger?

I have a DieHard, a really nice one that cost a bunch and came with great reviews, that after a few years of light use, began exhibiting those exact symptoms.

I'd say we each have a broken DieHard charger...

I hate to get rid of it, cuz sometimes it works, and it came with such great reviews. B-)

Allie

It is at least 3 years old.  Actually, this has been the only time I have used it.  My Scamp battery would stay charged for months on end.  This one doesn't stay charged for more than 3 weeks.  Have heard many use Battery Tender.  Maybe I'll get one and try it out.

Cyclonic

Can you run the T@B on shore power at home?  The converter in the T@B will switch over to a trickle charge mode automatically when the battery is fully charged.  you don't need to place it on a separate charger if you are on shore power.

http://wfcoelectronics.com/product/wf-8740-40-amp/

Nomad

Allie - I could be wrong but there shouldn't be any difference (other than maybe size) between your Scamp battery and a T@B battery. Standard RV batteries. If nothing is drawing power, they should behave the same.

Normfun

I have never had to charge mine when in storage.  Both my group 24 and my 2 golf cart batteries will hold a charge for 5 weeks with only minimum voltage drop.  I do remove the battery fuse when I put it in storage and reinstall the fuse when we take it out of storage.  Last November when my wife broke her ankle in California we left the trailer at my sons for 5 weeks with the battery fuse removed. It was not connected to shore power and when we went to get the trailer after Christmas the battery had only dropped .2 volts.  

Now if you  don't pull the battery fuse it will drain a battery in under a week. depending on your model and what you have running it could be half that.  

Allie

Norman: Where is the battery fuse located?  It has only been out once since I got it in May due to two surgeries within 5 weeks of each other and recovery.  Haven't been able to do much exploring in the unit.

Cyclonic:  yes, i could plug it into shore power.  Just thought it would be easier using battery tender because it is very tight to get to that side of the trailer in the garage to use the plug.

Verna

Allie, the battery fuse is inside the battery box inside a little plastic holder that is on the "+" (positive) wire coming from the positive side of the battery. You will have to loosen the nylon strap and take the lid off of the battery to get to it. 

If it's too hard to get to the electrical plug, you can get a simple Battery Tender (or there are other name brands). It looks like a transformer that plugs into the wall with a cord coming off of it. Be sure to get an extension to it (or use an extension cord) because you will need to plug it into the battery. It comes with a short cord with connectors that you attach to the battery. An accessory (or maybe it comes with it) would be alligator clips that clip to the battery. This will keep the battery trickle charged, whether you disconnect the battery fuse or not. 

vito

Maybe I'm missing something but why bother keeping the battery charged? So far I just let it sit, and if the battery totally runs down its no problem. I hook up shore power from my garage the night before a trip and everything is fully charged and ready to go when I hook up my TV. The only thing I need to remember to do is to re-set the clock on the Jensen system. 

Verna

Yes, Vito, you're missing the point that by continually allowing the battery to drop below 50%. You are damaging the battery beyond it being able to recover.

I'm sure you don't leave your head lights on all of the time on your car/truck, which would require a jumpstart to be able to drive. This is basically what you're doing to your T@B battery. You're draining it with the parasitic battery draws of the Jenson, the TV, the CO detector, the fridge (if you forget to turn it off), etc

here is the chart that shows the minimum voltage you should allow the battery to go. Note that 50% is not 6 volts. . 

vito

Maybe I was misinformed by the technician who gave me the orientation to the T@b at the dealership. He stated that the T@b has a marine battery which is NOT harmed by letting it run totally down, and that either using shore power or by towing it the battery would return to full charge. He stated it is not the same as the car battery which should not be allowed to run down completely repeatedly. I guess the general opinion here is that the technician was wrong in his understanding of the battery. If I continue to do as I have done, I guess the worst that I will face is a premature replacement of the battery. Where I have to park the T@b would require me to run a long extension cord over the very area where my dogs occasionally "do their business". I think I would rather replace a battery than have to clean long cables soiled by my dogs!

Wross

Vito,
sorty to say, the technician at the dealer is completely and absolutely WRONG.
your battery is destroyed if you let it go completely dead, or below about 11.5 volts for 24-36 hours.
i think they ( the dealer) wants to sell you lots of batteries.

walter

Nomad

Vito - Disconnect the battery...or...install a cutoff switch...or...pull the battery fuse - your battery will sit longer and retain enough charge longer without any draw on it. Check it once in awhile and only run the extension cord and charger out when it gets to the "don't go below" charge. Shoo your dongs away for a few hours and you'll save yourself a $100+.
OR, take the battery out and put it where the dogs don't do their doodoo on it :-)

vito

Thanks for advice. I'm not sure I want to have to open the battery case to disconnect a cable since I am currently storing my sewer hose in the battery compartment. Maybe I will just hook it up for charging every week or so. 

Nomad

Your a hard guy to please Vito - I store my hose in the cover also. Takes just a minute to remove. If I was looking at a dead/useless battery that would need replacing, I'd be spending that minute. Or removing the hose and storing it in a bag in the garage. :-)

Michigan_Mike

Allie said:

I store my T@B in the garage when not using it.  The battery is hooked up to a Die Hard Battery Charger/Maintainer on the 2A 12V setting.  After the battery is charged, a few days later the red light comes on and the panel in the T@B is blinking and beeping.  Not sure if there was a power fluctuation causing it, the battery, or the charger.  Has anyone else had this problem or thoughts?
Thanks,

Allie,  I'm curious as to how your charger is hooked to the trailer battery.  Do you use the Zamp solar port or are your charge leads hooked directly to the battery?   My point here is that if you ARE in fact using the Zamp port with a quick disconnect adapter from your Die-Hard battery tender it probably isn't charging the battery properly.  The leads from the Zamp solar port will need to be flipped or the tender leads flipped and re-spliced so that the battery receives a charge from the tender.  You might also consider installing a battery shut-off switch to eliminate any parasitic draw from things like the TV, stereo, LED light circuits, etc.  And as noted in other threads the battery does discharge some while sitting idle and this is a normal phenomena that occurs.  

Allie

Mike, so far I have not delved into the solar world.  I have the quick disconnect adapter from the battery to the Die Hard.  When I disconnect the die hard, then reconnect it, the battery will charge (yellow=charging), when it is completely charged it turns green. My understanding is, that if the power drops from the battery, it should maintain the battery.  Seems like when it drops, it causes an error (red light) on the die hard.  Thats when I disconnect/reconnect again and things are fine again for awhile.

Michigan_Mike

Allie said:

Mike, so far I have not delved into the solar world.  I have the quick disconnect adapter from the battery to the Die Hard.  When I disconnect the die hard, then reconnect it, the battery will charge (yellow=charging), when it is completely charged it turns green. My understanding is, that if the power drops from the battery, it should maintain the battery.  Seems like when it drops, it causes an error (red light) on the die hard.  Thats when I disconnect/reconnect again and things are fine again for awhile.

Good deal Allie as it sounds like things are fine, other than the red error light on your tender.  If you are using the tender alligator clips you are fine and that eliminates having to deal with the Zamp solar port wiring, etc.  

And you are correct, if the battery charge drops the tender will maintain and float the charge accordingly to ensure the health and maintenance of your battery when not in use.  I installed a battery shutoff switch on my battery to eliminate the issue of parasitic drain on the battery from things like LED light circuits, the TV/stereo, etc.  I'm very happy with it and do use it when it's in storage.  

mickietucs

Even though my issue was in a different thread, I thought I'd give an update here since it's under the heading that pertains to my battery and T@B in storage. After a week of it being on the solar trickle charger, it still wasn't any higher so I asked the guys next door at the rv place next to my storage facility to pull it. I realize that if we had a typical AZ week with tons of sun, it might have gone up but wouldn't you know it - we had practically no sun last week (except Fri) - so unusual!  They put it on a charger at their shop and I'll go there after work on Monday for them to reinstall it. Then I'll reinstall the trickle and see if it holds a charge.

Michigan_Mike

Do you have an AGM style battery Michelle?   If you do, sometimes those batteries will not take a charge regardless of what you do and people toss them thinking they are bad, when in fact they can be restored by tricking them into taking a charge.  The video below can also be accessed in the forum video resource area.  

https://youtu.be/Slqd73ZOQvI?t=3

mickietucs

Michigan_Mike said:

Do you have an AGM style battery Michelle?   If you do, sometimes those batteries will not take a charge regardless of what you do and people toss them thinking they are bad, when in fact they can be restored by tricking them into taking a charge.  The video below can also be accessed in the forum video resource area.  

https://youtu.be/Slqd73ZOQvI?t=3

Thanks Mike - no, not an AGM. Since finding out the fuse had blown (more than likely right when I left Phoenix), replacing that and hooking up to solar trickle charger (no elec available at storage place) it went from 11.99 to 12.13 after a few days. Decided to give it another week. We speculate the battery didn't get charged at all during the drive and even perhaps was low when they pulled it off the shelf (or wherever they got it). Hoping now that it's hooked up to a regular charger it'll be up to where it's supposed to be. I'm keeping the dealer informed so if it doesn't hold a charge, we'll make arrangements for a new battery here in Tucson. Lesson learned - ck battery voltage before departing and again once my tow vehicle has been turned on.  

lavndrblue

I'm new at this RV thing so I have a question as I am about to store my T@B for the winter in a storage lot.  Should I take the battery out and trickle charge it over the winter or should I just leave it in the T@B and charge it up when I pick it up in the Spring?

Allie

Mike, since I have no clue as to what is causing the battery not to charge and remain that way, I contacted Ed, and am taking it to an RV repair here in St. Geo.  Most of my problems thus far have been electrical.  Hope after it's fixed I can go camping without something going wrong.  This is getting old.

Michigan_Mike

lavndrblue said:

I'm new at this RV thing so I have a question as I am about to store my T@B for the winter in a storage lot.  Should I take the battery out and trickle charge it over the winter or should I just leave it in the T@B and charge it up when I pick it up in the Spring?

Since you have a new T@B and taking into consideration that you are going to have parasitic drain via mounted equipment and circuitry I would probably consider the following:

1.  Battery Shutoff Switch  - I would consider mounting a shutoff switch to eliminate the parasitic drain and to help isolate your battery.

2.  Battery Charge - I normally charge up all of my equipment batteries around the house (e.g., lawn tractor, boat battery, etc.) in late fall after I am done using them.  I do not remove these batteries and since they are fully charged this tends to help them through the harsh winters here in Michigan.  I have been doing this for a long time and have never experienced any adverse effects, other than the normal battery replacement that is a result of extended use via age and deterioration.  

3.  Battery Tender -  If you have a power source in the storage area you can use a battery tender to maintain the battery.  If not, go with the above tips or as you noted, remove the battery and hook a tender up to it at your home.  

If you "do not" install a battery shutoff switch the trailer battery is eventually going to be drained via the parasitic drain, even after being fully charged for the season if you are unable to isolate it from the trailer's circuitry.  

Michigan_Mike

Allie said:

Mike, since I have no clue as to what is causing the battery not to charge and remain that way, I contacted Ed, and am taking it to an RV repair here in St. Geo.  Most of my problems thus far have been electrical.  Hope after it's fixed I can go camping without something going wrong.  This is getting old.

Another thing you could do is unhook the battery, take it in to a local AutoZone parts store and have them test and check the battery health for you.  They can easily ferret out the problem and tell you whether or not you have a defective cell in the battery and get to the heart of the problem.  

And as noted in the prior comments above, you could either remove the battery fuse or install a battery shutoff switch to eliminate any parasitic drain as your T@B unit's electrical circuitry and mounted components are definitely drawing power from the battery while idle and adding to the problem.  

The T@B is definitely a horse of a different color and unlike your former Scamp trailer in terms of power drain, so factor in the above and go from there.  

Jimbo

Would I keep the battery in good order if I plugged into shore power for a day every week or so?  Or more often, or less often?  Seems like an easy solution.

wizard1880

For those of you who wish to use the t@b's converter (WFCO, newer models) to keep the battery charged in storage, keep in mind that because of the parasitic draw, the charger will never drop into float charge mode, and the voltage will stay high at 13.8 volts. Overtime say matter of months this will boil water out of the battery. I would recommend using a battery tender because it keeps the battery at 13.2 volts instead and simply disconnect the negative terminal to eliminate the parasitic draw.

Allie

Turned out that the battery was dying because the wire coming from the fuse was not completely covered.  The bare wire must have be hitting on the frame, or some metal.  Fried the fuse and the battery.  I had to pay the difference in price of the original battery and the new battery, plus the 95$ labor charge because the dealer is responsible for the battery.  He is 2 hrs away, and the local RV repair took care of it for me.  Whoever LG has doing their electrical work needs to retrain him.  I have had the trailer out only 3x, and each time had to bring it in for repairs because of electrical problems.