Tailgate down towing on a T@B 320 - with a dirt bike in the bed

blackoaktree

If this is in a post already I apologize - I tried searching with no luck.
I have a shortbed Tacoma pickup and would like to carry a motorcycle in the bed of the truck while pulling my T@B.  I have an Outback model - but I don't think that matters.
I normally have the tailgate down when hauling my bike.
The tongue jack is removable. 
Has anyone tried this or have an idea if there is enough clearance for this to work?
My rough measurements make me believe this is possible, but I'm reluctant to try because my co-pilot is my dog. She won't tell me if I'm doing something stupid.
Thanks for any advice or experiences.

rkj__

With the tongue jack removed, and no spare tire on the tongue, I suspect the Outback would be quite towable with the Tacoma's tailgate down.  The Tacoma has a fairly shallow bed, so the tailgate does not extend that far past the bumper.

I think it is worth removing the tongue jack, and doing a trial before packing and heading out for a trip.  You will want to be able to test the limits in a large parking lot, with no stress.

jgram2

You've likely considered tongue weight, right?

blackoaktree

A parking lot test is a genius idea! Thanks!!!
yes the tongue weight is also a consideration. I think with proper loading of the trailer and carrying bicycles on the rear rack might take care of sway issues. 

Sharon_is_SAM

What about the radius for turning and backing up?

blackoaktree

The turning radius seems like it could work based on a tape measuring and eyeballing.

rkj__

Twojgrams said:

You've likely considered this-increased cargo weight in the bed would lower the tongue weight, right? Thereby increasing the potential for sway if not compensated by increased cargo weight behind the Tab's axle? 

Umm, I don't agree with this at all.

The force the trailer applies downward on the hitch is not affected by how the tow vehicle is loaded with cargo.

Increased cargo weight behind the T@b's axle incrases the likelyhood of sway issues.  

jgram2

I admit I was thinking of our '79 GS 1000 which weighed ~650#, but now I have to go back studying towing dynamics. I'll edit my comment.

Sharon_is_SAM

@twojgrams    I think the whole tow weight capacity/ tongue weight issue is always a bit confusing.  I also tend to think that what is in the rear of the TV impacts tongue weight, but that is incorrect.  I did some digging and learned a better way to think about it.  

Too much weight on the tongue and hitch can bend the tongue and damage the hitch.  It can also effect how the TV handles by pushing down the back end of the TV, taking weight off the front and making steering difficult and potentially less braking power from the front brakes.  This is probably a bigger factor with front TV axle wheel drive TVs. Too light of tongue weight (seems to be a more common occurance) is what causes trailer sway and that is why we always talk about how we load our trailers and have a handy formula for tongue weight based on trailer weight (10-15% of trailer weight).

If you are using a weight distribution system, the weight behind the TV rear axle does count against the tongue weight limits of the hitch.

The TV GAWC and overall weight capacity, I think would be the limiting factor in this scenario.



Sharon

newell

You are talking about a bicycle right, not a motorcycle?  I think the bigger issue is whether the tailgate will hit the T@B in a tight turn.  

ColoradoJon

I carry my dirt bikes in the back of my 2001 Dodge Ram while towing our Outback.  I use a ratchet strap hooked through the tailgate cable to ratchet the tailgate up against the rear wheel of the dirt bikes as I don't want to mess with a removable tongue jack.

I've carried three dirt bikes, ramp, four gas cans, and riding gear in the bed of the truck while towing the Outback and I've never had any problems with turn radius issues, and no interference.  The load in the truck has no effect on the trailer tongue weight and I don't worry about it.

Sharon_is_SAM

@newell Blackoaktree carries his motorcycles in his truck bed.

jgram2

@SAM, thanks. I'm taking remedial gravity lessons from @rkj__ offline to get a grip, and to stop hijacking this thread from the question posed by @blackoaktree to whom I must apologize!

jason330i

I believe you have to watch your rear gross axle weight rating (gawr) when you carry heavy stuff in the bed of your truck. And tongue weight does add on to your rear gawr.

blackoaktree

Thanks for all the great advice and thoughts.
I am carrying a motorcycle not a bicycle.
Most of the time it’s a 250 lb dirt bike that doesn’t impact suspenion or loading unless I drive intentionally fast on bumpy roads that are more appropriate for the fore mentioned dirt bike. I don’t think I’d bring the trailer there... but I have a hunting trip next week that may inspire me to test off road capabilities of the Outback.

Homebodyatheart

@blackoaktree you mentioned loading bikes (bicycles I'd guess) on the back of the T@b on your Yakima rack, correct? Somewhere on the forum was a discussion about weight limitations of the Yakima rack. If I remember correctly both 70# and 100# total weight load on the rack were mentioned. I don't know which is correct. If your spare is already on the rack you might be overweight on the rack by adding bikes. You could call NuCamp to be sure of the carry weight, though. Good luck!

Sharon_is_SAM

Bike as in motorbike.

rkj__

SAM said:

Bike as in motorbike.

Motorbike in the bed of the truck, and bicycle on the Outback's Yakima rack have both been mentioned in this thread. 

rkj__

blackoaktree said:

 I have a hunting trip next week that may inspire me to test off road capabilities of the Outback.

If you do, take some pictures or videos to share. 

I have thoughts in the back of my mind of taking our regular CS-S down some rough back roads, to access  some free camping on crown land.  I'm hoping to maybe go on a few scouting missions next year, to judge feasibility. 

That said, I can't seem to find any pictures or videos of people actually dragging a T@b Outback / Boondock over anything rougher than a smooth dirt road.  Where is the good You-Tube content at?

An old friend of mine did some gnarly stuff with his off road trailer.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PDYhGZdeWB8

Sharon_is_SAM

Oh, yeah, now I see the comment.

ChanW

@rkj__, is that Georgian Bay in the video? Nuts!

rkj__

ChanW said:

@rkj__, is that Georgian Bay in the video? Nuts!

I was not on the trip that footage is from, but I believe it is all from Ardbeg Ontario, near Black Lake and Round Lake.

blackoaktree

rkj__ said:

blackoaktree said:

 I have a hunting trip next week that may inspire me to test off road capabilities of the Outback.

If you do, take some pictures or videos to share. 

I have thoughts in the back of my mind of taking our regular CS-S down some rough back roads, to access  some free camping on crown land.  I'm hoping to maybe go on a few scouting missions next year, to judge feasibility. 

That said, I can't seem to find any pictures or videos of people actually dragging a T@b Outback / Boondock over anything rougher than a smooth dirt road.  Where is the good You-Tube content at?

An old friend of mine did some gnarly stuff with his off road trailer.

I think I'll wait until the new smell wears off the Tab before I try anything like that. I take my Taco down trails like that, but doing that with a third axle takes skill I don't have. However after a six pack and if I'm too close to the welder, maybe I'll try my skills at put 33's on the Tab. 

Nucamp doesn't read these posts do they... just in case I have a "warranty" issue.

ChanW

Ah... The rocks looked familiar to me.

We spent a lot of time up in that area, near Killbear Park.

Beautiful country.

4ncar

Have you considered just removing the tail gate from the truck? I know this is possible on most PU's.

Tabaz

I've taken my Outback down some fairly rough roads these past two years.  The two mods that really helped with improving ground clearance are the single discharge waste and removable tongue jack by Pop-tab.  Also Google Earth prior to the trip to make sure I have an escape route in case things got too tight.

ColoradoJon

@blackoaktree - is it just one dirt bike you are carrying?  I assume you have a mid-size pickup and not a full size?  On my full size pickup I can load one dirt bike on the driver's side of the bed, tie down the handlebars, then kick the rear wheel over to the right (passenger side) so the tail gate will close.  This only works if you are carrying only one bike, and if the bed of your truck is long enough.

blackoaktree

I tried and it’ll work!

Bert

What type of jack did you buy to replace the standard jack?

blackoaktree

Www.jack-E-up.com
simple device that allows you to take off the jack.

Bill_F

Telescoping trailer tongue option that includes  motorcycle rack that is released with the removal of one additional pin. Retracts to standard length to maintain DMV PTI no registration fee designation.

@Bill_F - please resize your photo.  Moderator