bear country camping

ChanW

How secure is the Tab itself in bear country? If there are food smells in the Tab, and we've taken off for a day hike, is a bear so bold as to try to get into a camper? 

I've seen a bear break open an aluminum cooler in a National Park CG, and the Tab wouldn't be too much more difficult.

I understand that leaving your cooler in the back of an open pickup is asking for trouble. What about those folks who have a Jeep with a canvas top? In that case, stashing your cooler in the TV would be useless, wouldn't it?

Obviously, I'm new to camping in bear country....

Mercator

Several methods of keeping food, garbage and smelly items away from bears:

·  You can hang your food pack away from your camping area between two trees. Some parks such as Yosemite do not allow hanging of food on interior camping trips.

·  If you are on a canoe trip with multiple canoes, I have heard of people putting their food pack in one canoe and anchoring it away from shore, tied to a rope so they can pull the rope and retrieve the canoe. This can only be done if you have multiple canoes for two reasons. 1) if the bear gets your food, they will also be near the canoe. 2) if a bear gets your food from the canoe, the canoe may be damaged and may not be in a condition to get you out of the wilderness.

·  Leave your food on an island away from your campsite. I have done this once when there was a small island not too far from camp. We paddled to the island, left the food and then camped on the main land. Bears can swim, but you will be safe to watch from a distance.

·  Strap your bear barrel to a tree away from camp.

·  If you know that the area where are you camping, and there is very little chance you will come across a bear, you can put your sealed food container under a tarp, away from your tent or canoe, so that you have a readily accessible escape route.

·  Many areas that are prone to bears have bear containers on the campsites so that you can safely store food. 

·  If you are car camping, keep your food and anything that has a strong scent.

ChanW

Sounds like you need to treat the situation just as you would tent camping.

But the inside of the Tab will smell like food even if you take all the food away and hang it. Do bears mess with (non-canvas) trailers? 

One national park site said that they're even attracted to stove/lantern fuel, and not to leave it out.

Rad

I think storing food outside a t@b because of bear concerns is a bit of an over reaction.  If you head down that road most scented items need to be removed including items like tooth paste.  Of course a bear that wanted to could rip open a t@b, just like they could get into any house or cabin they wanted to.  

My approach when in an rv or trailer is to keep my camp site free of bear attractions, garbage, bbq's that have been cooked on etc.  

Michigan_Mike

I agree with the above recommendations.  Anything you can do to minimize scent is important when camping in bear country.   You can also be vigilant in your precautionary measures, but could fall victim to another campers irresponsible behavior if you arrive at a campsite where someone else has dumped bacon grease or contents from a cooking pan nearby, etc. thus creating a temptation and attractant for animals to visit.   I've camped in remote areas and in places like Glacier NP where bears do often prowl the camping areas in search of food and haven't had any issues.  I did have a cooler incident in my younger days when a large black bear made itself to home and dined on hotdogs, my coffee creamer and Hershey chocolate used for s'mores for my kids.  

There are accounts of bears trying to get into trailers occupied by campers, but I don't believe that this is by any means a common occurrence and any nuisance bears are normally sought out, trapped and relocated to remote areas away from humans or euthanized, depending on their past history and human contacts.  I button up my campsites before hitting the sack, store all food safely away inside my vehicle or in food storage boxes supplied by the NP system and dispose of any trash generated at the campsite into designated trash containers in the parks.  I also do not leave any cooking utensils outside, use dish washing facilities in the parks as needed and am extra cautious when camping in bear country.  Certainly these predators are attracted to camping areas via scent, but if there is no food source available or that has been made available to them previously your chances of an encounter will be greatly diminished.  I make it a point to ask these types of questions (e.g., have bears been spotted in the area recently or have they encountered problem bears, etc.) when I arrive at a camping area and in many instances they do post bear warnings near the sign-in area via bulletin boards where there are frequent campers.  

ChanW

I guess it's fairly common sense stuff. And asking the locals is sensible too...

Michigan_Mike

Agree....  I've never carried any bear spray, but definitely would if I was off hiking in either Yellowstone or Glacier NP.  

Rad

Michigan_Mike said:

Agree....  I've never carried any bear spray, but definitely would if I was off hiking in either Yellowstone or Glacier NP.  

A week before I rode to Glacier to hike solo a guy was killed by a Grizzly and then eaten by her and her cubs.   Not very PC on my part, but I carried more than spray on that solo 14 mile hike.  I saw only one bear on that hike, a huge Grizzly.   The sow and her cubs were found and destroyed. 

I did come around a corner on the narrow trail and found a young woman sitting on the ground sobbing and her boyfriend trying to comfort her.  They had just accidentally startled a Grizzly and were then bluff charged.  The boyfriend was trying to settle her down so they could go back down off the mountain.  I offered to walk them out, she very bravely declined.  

jkjenn

So, here is something I learned last year in Colorado - every spot has different guidance and your best bet is to follow what the CG hosts recommend. If you are boondocking, ask the local forest or BLM rangers. At One Mile near Almont, they said food properly stored inside the T@b was fine. The campground had a bear incident that week due to a pop up leaving a cooler outside with meat in it. When I went to Difficult, near Aspen, a campground known for bear/human interaction, I was urged to put all food that was not refrigerated, as well as anything that had a fragrance in a bear box. When I was at Yellowstone (Madison) in 2013, they said you could use your car as a bear box. I believe the advice varies, because the bear behavior varies by locale.

Michigan_Mike

Agree Jenn, and it depends on how smart the bears are in the respective areas of the US.  I've read about incidents in Yosemite where the bears basically slam a door frame, pry it out, pop the glass and have their way.  

DougandMia

Our bears in Canada are pretty smart.

CodeJunkie

Doug and Mia, cute pic! Caption could read "T@B siting"...lol.

Montalaskan

I grew up in bear country and think of bears as my spirit animal of sorts... how many people do you know who have "held hands" and been "kissed" by a grizzly bear?*

First off, I highly recommend bear spray when hiking in bear country. "The other option" is not an option to me. First off, carrying in a National Park isn't exactly kosher, but do you trust yourself to make an accurate shot with an 200-1600 pound animal running at you at about 30 miles per hour? I'll take my chances with a cloud of pepper spray vs. one bullet.

Bears have better noses than dogs. Think about that. They can smell food from extremely long distances. And they are *smart* — I've seen footage of a bear breaking into a minivan... by using the door handle and sliding the door. They can figure out how to open unlocked doors.

So locking food in your car and/or trailer does *not* prevent a bear from smelling it. Even if it's vacuum sealed and stuck in a fridge. They can probably smell it. Whether it's worth their effort to get to is up to them. Or they may just be curious.

If you are in an area where bear activity has been reported, especially Ursus Arctos Horribilis... aka Grizzly/Coastal Brown Bear/Alaskan Brown Bear, follow what a ranger tells you to the letter. This is for your safety AND the safety of the bear. 

The best policy is to have a bear box/bear barrel to store all the "smelly stuff" - food, the clothes you cook in, toothpaste, etc. and then to store that at least 200 feet from your (and anyone else's) campsite. Yes, this is inconvenient, but it's better than being mauled. Some things you may not consider is that you can have something do double duty - for instance, a YETI cooler with padlocks is bear-proof. And it'll keep your ice cold for a week or two.

Another option is to hang stuff in a tree. Again, it should be away from your campsite and at least 20 feet above ground.

Bears tend to avoid human contact, so if you are at a large camping ground, it's going to be fairly unlikely that they'll come around. This doesn't mean it won't happen though. Hungry bears in late summer stocking up for a winter's hibernation or in spring when they are really hungry really don't care.

It should go without saying but: Never, ever, leave food out in bear country. And for goodness sake, NEVER feed a bear. A fed bear is a dead bear. As soon as they see humans as a source of free food, they'll keep coming back. You just made a "problem bear." Problem bears are "dispatched."

Remember, you are in their yard, so be nice to them! But don't feed them.

When hiking, things to remember - bears attack when:

• They are starving/sick. (This is rare, but happens. Google "grizzly Soda Butte" for a case study.)
• They are protecting their own food source/kill. If you see fresh scat or the carcass of a deer/elk/whatever, turn around and go home.
• They are protecting their young. Worst place to ever be: Between Mama and her cub(s). Pay attention to your surroundings.
• They are surprised/scared. This is the theory behind bear bells (which I find annoying.) Talk to your hiking buddies or sing a song. Yell out "HEY BEAR" over and over.

The good news is that if a grizzly charges at you, the first run will likely be a bluff. Make yourself big. Put your arms up. And if you have spray, wait until it is close(r) and use it.

If they do actually attack you and your spray didn't work, play dead. Curl up in a ball and cover your head/neck the best you can with your arms. This is when you start praying if you are so inclined.

Black bears are different. They can climb trees - did you know that? The good part is that they are significantly smaller. If they attack you, you can fight back. Punch them in the nose. Yell. Scream. Maybe you end up with a cool story sometime.

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Obviously some of this info is not applicable to camping in your T@B. But I hope it helps. Lots of scary stuff in here, so let's end with a joke.

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How do you tell the difference between black bear and brown bear (grizzly) scat?

Black bear scat is smaller, has lots of berries and small bones in it. Grizzly scat has berries, small bones, bigger bones, and bells in it and smells like pepper spray.

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* She was a captive bear saved and raised in captivity. I was given the opportunity to feed her. She took a shine to me, so the keeper asked if I wanted to "hold her hand." So I put my hand up near the opening of the enclosure and she put her paw against my hand. By the way, grizzly claws are longer than my fingers. Scary. Then the keeper asked if I wanted a kiss. How often do you get to do that? So as frightening as it was, I put my face out there for her, and she licked me. Grizzly tongues are like very large cat tongues. Very "prickly." And grizzly saliva? The consistency of rubber cement. Don't ask about her breath. She needed that toothpaste we talked about earlier.

jkjenn

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LAicNbgR4o4

Montalaskan

Oh, those wacky Canadians. One thing they didn't mention - black bears have a flat face, griz have a scooped nose and nearly circular face when you see them straight-on.

They did mention the varying colors of "black bears." They even come in white ("spirit bear" or Kermode), so the name is all kinds of confusing.

Trivia:

• The Grizzly got it's latin name from a mistranslation. The "grizzly" name comes from it's fur and how it often stands on end and is "grizzled." It was thought of as "grisly" as in a horrible death, so became Ursus Arctos Horribilis.
• The only difference between a coastal brown bear and a grizzly is its proximity to a coastline.
• Grizzlies and Polar Bears (Ursus Arctos) can mate and end up with Pizzlies or Grolars.
• The largest brown bears are in Kodiak and Katmai National Park, Alaska. They get so big by eating a steady diet of salmon.
• Bears in Denali are actually smaller than bears in Yellowstone due to the shorter eating season and a diet.
• I like bears, a lot. Obviously. Yet I'm a Montana State Bobcat through and through, so I hate Grizzlies.

jkjenn

This guy took turns between feasting on and sleeping n top of a Bison while I was in Yellowstone. It was fun to watch him ay there sleeping, while snow accumulated on him.

Montalaskan

I hope that's either a crop from a much larger pic or shot with a 600mm.

I took this in Denali.



And for these, I cheated... Alaska Wildlife Conservation Center:

Handsome Boy


Snuck up on this girl... not really. Promise.


Bears can be goofy. This one looks like a guy wearing a bear costume to me. Someday I'm going to make a funny card from it

Mercator

What are the regulations travelling throughout US with a can of bear spray?  Legal to have even in urban areas?

Montalaskan

I suppose you'd have to check with local authorities. I carry mine in a custom holster on my backpack and fortunately have never had reason to use it. 

I know this much, it makes Mace seem tame. I wouldn't want to see it used in an enclosed space. 

I do know it is not legal to fly, even in checked baggage. UDAP and the other manufacturers have to love selling fresh to everyone who arrives in ANC needing some. 

I am also not sure about borders. On my trip to AK, I may have to leave behind a can in Montana, get some for Canada, then do the same going into AK. Not sure. 

Nomad

Where can you buy bear spray?
Not being from big bear country I don't think I've ever seen it.

Mercator

PXLated said:

Where can you buy bear spray?
Not being from big bear country I don't think I've ever seen it.

In Canada you can purchase at Mountain Equipment Co-op. You must sign a waiver. Bear Spray is legal to possess in Canada, but Mace is illegal.

"This item cannot be purchased online. Health Canada requires a signed waiver for purchase. Call 1.888.847.0770 for details. When purchasing or picking up bear spray in-store, valid Photo ID is required."

Mercator

Montalaskan said:

"I grew up in bear country ... 

How do you tell the difference between black bear and brown bear (grizzly) scat?

Black bear scat is smaller, has lots of berries and small bones in it. Grizzly scat has berries, small bones, bigger bones, and bells in it and smells like pepper spray"


I have heard Bear Bells referred to as Dinner Bells for bears.

jkjenn

Montalaskan said:

I hope that's either a crop from a much larger pic or shot with a 600mm.

I took this in Denali.

Yeah, it was a telephoto with an extender and I was at a safe distance, with a ranger at the scene. I was fortunate enough to see a number that of bears on that trip. I had a big, beautiful Grizzly  cross the road right behind me right before Cooke City and saw one in hot pursuit of a Bighorn.

Wanderoo

I purchased bear spray from my local REI store.

http://www.rei.com/product/722005/counter-assault-bear-deterrent-spray-102-oz

jkjenn

Counter Assault is the one I hear most often recommended.

I have a sad tale of woe about bear spray. Within an hour of first arriving at my campsite in Yellowstone (Madison), I set up camp (tent), then ate my lunch. As I was putting everything from lunch away back into my Jeep, the corner of my food pantry caught the safety on my bear spray, released it and discharged the spray up into my face.

I can assure you, that us powerful stuff. I stumbled over to a nearby site and a very kind man read the canister to me. I then had to go shower and was all clothing and coat I was wearing at the Old Faithful lodge. I cannot even describe how painful it was.

geromo

i have used  what i call "boat horn in a can" (air-horn) that is also very good at getting them to leave. you do not have to worry about the wind blowing it back on you. i carry both with the Horn being first line. --never had to use the spray.

Montalaskan

By the way, I think jkjenn can attest - familiarize yourself with how it works and practice. Make sure the wind is AT YOUR BACK before you try it out. Aim low and spray back and forth in a sweeping motion. Let the cloud go up. You don't aim at the bear, you aim at building a wall.

Montalaskan

Another reason the old "I'll just bring my .44 Mag" is dumb (IMHO) is that you are not just likely to miss, but the bear doesn't deserve to get shot for you going in its back yard. Yes, the noise might help even if you miss, but there are stories in the past couple years about hunters accidentally shooting their partners in an effort to shoot an attacking bear. 

Michigan_Mike

Rad

Montalaskan said:

Another reason the old "I'll just bring my .44 Mag" is dumb (IMHO) is that you are not just likely to miss, but the bear doesn't deserve to get shot for you going in its back yard. Yes, the noise might help even if you miss, but there are stories in the past couple years about hunters accidentally shooting their partners in an effort to shoot an attacking bear. 

I had been known to carry a 357 mag when hiking solo in bear country.  Then, I enountered my first Grizzly and was stunned at its size compared to the black bears I had encountered.  I upgraded to a 44mag and even with that I would be lucky to ever be able to stop a grizzly that demonstrated true predatory behavior where I was the prey.

Parlando

I was camping in Katmai Alaska, home of the largest population of Brown Bear in the world. I left my hiking partner one day after weeks of traveling back country together, just to experience being alone in the bush. Around every corner I thought that I saw a bear, but none of those sightings proved true. Then I saw what looked like a bear lying in the bush under a tree. Little by little I moved closer to check it out. (Don't do that. Yes I know it was dumb.) Finally I came face to face with a huge brown bear...that was dead. Winter kill I'd guess. It gave me a unique opportunity to examine it, claws, teeth, head...all huge. It was a dumb thing to do, but it made the bear more mortal, and helped me understand them treat them with respect and give them plenty of distance.