Water Damage Source?

targ

Hello everyone,

Looks like our 2019 320s BDL has developed a leak somewhere.  We have water damage in the baggage compartment right at the junction where the flat floor meets the curved tail.  I've inspected everything in the region and can't find any missing or damaged caulk or any sign of the ingress point.  We also went through some heavy downpours over Thanksgiving week and didn't see any running water during the rains.  So this must be seeping in from somewhere else over time.  FWIW, this spot was visibly clean as recently as six weeks ago.

Any suggestions on where to look for where the water is getting in?

mona

Tail light caulking?

jeannie

dragonsdofly

@targ, this has been discussed several times. My damage was discovered after our trailers first winter and was repaired during üCamp 17. It was explained that these leaks in the taillights often don't occur during raging downpours because the water is moving quickly over the skin of the trailer, they happen during long drizzly days or as snow is slowly melting. The fix is easy. Remove the rear taillights, clear away the old caulk, including the wire pass through and screw holes. Begin with a very generous application of new waterproof caulk sealing the wire pass through, the apply into the screw holes and reinstall the taillights and screws to seal (I think they used silicone sealant). It's been leak free since then.

Drivers side rear. Look familiar?

dragonsdofly

Passenger side rear.

targ

Indeed.  Guess that's my next project.

targ

@dragonsdofly, I finally had a chance to dig into this more this weekend.  I pulled the taillight assembly out and, for the life of me, I can't imagine that's the culprit.  All of the screw holes were gooped up well (even had to pull goop out to get the light off and the screw threads are full of the goop top to bottom). The wire penetration is actually turned down so even if it weren't sealed, it wouldn't leak into the cabin.

In your picts @dragonsdofly, if you were to look along the floor (from port to starboard) to the seam between the floor and the sidewall, do you see goop in the joint?  Mine only has one small spot of goop so I'm actually wondering if they forgot to seal the entire joint.  Here's mine:

And speaking of goop, does anyone here know what the black goop NuCamp uses to seal the fasteners actually is?  I need to get some to replace everything I had to pull out to get the taillight off.
Also, does anyone know what structure is directly under this location?  There is a clear outline of a hole/pocket or something in this picture. And the linoleum (or whatever the floor covering is) is *very* soft and unsupported right here. 

PKT

And speaking of goop, does anyone here know what the black goop NuCamp uses to seal the fasteners actually is?  I need to get some to replace everything I had to pull out to get the taillight off.

  That black goop I'd think is butyl.

dragonsdofly

@targ, I watched the nüCamp service employees perform the "fix". After cleaning the taillight area thoroughly, they applied a generous, overly generous amount of silicone sealant to the screw holes and wire pass through holes. They then placed a bead of the same caulk around the base of the tailight trim piece and stuck it against the body of the t@b and screwed it into place. My t@b is a sofitel model, gray trim, gray sides and roof, gray interior. It is a completely aluminum exterior with a matching interior, which is why they used a color co-ordinated  caulk. Since this issue came to light, I suspect nüCamp switched to butyl as it "squishes" to fill voids as @PKT, suggested, perhaps because of this very problem.

dragonsdofly

@targ, nüCamp service employee also explained that during the most ferocious downpours, amazingly no water intrusion occurs. The angle of the t@b  in the rear promotes quick runoff. However, long days with a slow drizzle allows the water to find a pinhole/s and seep in. We had been in the southwest for weeks, during their "monsoon" rains and a leak did not develop. But since we are in Michigan, we found the repeated slow snow/melt cycles of a perticularly brutal winter caused the leaks. Since the nüCamp repair in July, 2017, we have traveled another 25,000+ miles, both east and west coasts and have been bone dry. I can't guaranty that is the source of your leak/s but it was mine, and several others since mine. I commend your diligence and hope you have success repairing your problem.

Jackie_Dave

We had to replace the gasket around the outside storage door. The leak looks like it could have come from the tail light, but ours was from that gasket. We replaced it about 8 months ago and no more leaks. Just food for thought.

targ

@Jackie_Dave, was there anything obvious that made you conclude it was the door gasket?  Mine looks fine with no breaks, cuts, pinches, or "low" spots.  And it takes a bit of pushing to close the door so I believe it is sealing ok.

Jackie_Dave

@targ, No. We caulked around the outside of the door, and that didn't make a difference. So we covered it with plastic and there was no water after that. We were under warranty so took it back to the dealer and they replaced the gasket and no more leak.

The door also shut really tight so that never occurred to us. But I did notice that there were water drops in the middle of the bottom of the inside of the door. Could have been a kink in the gasket before it was originally installed? No idea, but we have no more leaks.

dragonsdofly

@Jackie_Dave, thanks. Baggage door as standard came after my 2017, so I  had no knowledge of an additional leak source. Noted.

targ

Reviving this thread. I did end up pulling the light fixture and recaulking everything back there. 

But there is still something else that is letting water in. That whole area stays damp. 

I’ve also checked the baggage door seal, side marker light seal and the seal around the external power outlet. 

So, any other ideas or stories?

And on a side note, is there any way to get the factory to inspect/repair something like this rather than going through a dealer (asking because I’d also like to get the factory to do the split rear back mod). 

Denny16

It takes a while for wet plywood to dry out.  You need to have lots of dry air 
circulation.  Remove all the cushions in the area, open up and expose the wet area, and place a small fan to blow air into the wet area, have the roof vent and a window near the wet area open to aid in air circulation, and allow damp air out.
cheers

Voyager

https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/comment/130314#Comment_130314

I know this is an old post but I have this exact same looking veneer behind the sofa. That’s the way it was when we bought our used 2019 T@b 320. There is no active leak but it was never disclosed to us where the leak was. My question is if anyone has replaced that veneer. If so, was it a DIY project? Was it simple to fix? Was it expensive if it was done at the dealership?

I understand that it is cosmetics but, if it’s an easy replacement, I would rather do it. I am not sure if painting it would look good either.

Thank you 🙏

dragonsdofly

@Voyager, no we did not do any repair or replacement to the area. For us the memerely cosmetic damage never affected our ability to go down the road and so we were satisfied that the repair was done. I apologize for the late reply but we don't visit the forum often anymore. Our trailer sits alone in our yard as we have been full time rving for the last 5½ years. Personally, if we could full time with four cats, a German Shepherd and a parrot in our tab, we would. The tab is a much simpler, more expedient and more fun way to travel. Good luck with your endeavors. Good roads and fair weather wishes to you in your adventures. Denise &

Mickerly

This is going to sound strange, but it may be the answer. In my 320CS, I was finding water damage in the kitchen behind the taillights. A very similar problem to yours. It took me a while to find the issue. The aluminum on the kitchen hatch gets cold in the winter. The area around the tail lights is mostly aluminum frame. It gets cold too. The heat is inside the cabin. The moist air we breath out produces condensation on the cold surfaces.

I would bet the water you are getting at the back of your trailer is condensation from the interior, not rain coming in from the outside. You have a radiator back there drawing in cool air along the floor. You have metal frame holding the back of the trailer together. This would explain more water in the winter and in misty conditions and no water in heavy (spring) rain. You should get more water than I did because your kitchen is inside. It produces a lot of water vaper.

I solved my issue with daily drying and lots of towels. Just a thought.

Voyager

@dragonsdofly thank you! You have many pets! 😂

I just read this myself, I didn’t get notifications.

@Mickerly interesting thought!

Voyager

@Mickerly, we just came back from a trip to NH. It was cold every night so we had the heat running. As a result, we experienced what you are describing: condensation inside the storage area over the wheel well and also some in the back, behind the bed. However, it was only a bit. I don’t think that that alone would have caused the amount of discoloration our camper has in the back. This is how it looked when we bought it last year.
But it did happen!

Mickerly

It doesn't happen over night. Your trailer is 7 years old. The bottom edge is aluminum and conducts temperature really well. The wheel wells are not insulated at all. You will have staining where the wood meets the floor front and back. The flooring will come loose at the front, back, and around the wheel wells.

Most trailers die from moisture damage. Breathing and cooking in the trailer cause the condensation. Humid or misty weather add more. That's partly why we bought a 'CS. It moves the cooking outside. There's not much you can do about breathing. ; )

Anytime you are not air conditioning, I recommend the ceiling vent be open 1/2in minimum with people are in the trailer. When cooking in the trailer, the vent should be open with the fan on at least low. We've camped down to the upper 20's, the Alde keeps the cabin very comfortable.

IRISH

NuCamp recommends Geocel ProFlex RV Sealent specifically, there is a NuCamp Tech Talk video on sealing.

Does anyone know of a video showing the replacement of tail lights 2016 320S thanks.

webers3

I am at a complete loss of where to look for the water leak in my 2017 320, no leaks for 8 seasons until now. I've sealed the tail lights inside and out, there is no condensation inside while the trailer is in storage, there is no sign of water leaking from any of the outside connections, I've pressurized water lines to check for leaks, there were none. As a last attempt I've covered the trailer with a waterproof tarp that extends from below the tail lights in the rear to below the tub in the front and below the fenders on either side yet there is still a lot of moisture in the driver side storage area where the floor meets the sloped floor part of the storage. The moisture is not glycol. I am stumped.

mx4789

FWIW, in my old trailer I had a leak once when the water heater was on (by mistake) and I hadn't opened the hot water faucet to bleed the air out since I hadn't planned on using it. The air pressure caused a leak where one of the hoses crimped on to a fitting, which then didn't reoccur once the pressure bled off. That took a bit of head scratching to locate since it was such an isolated, random thing.

webers3

@mx4789 I pressurized the lines with water, then blew-out the lines with air, then pressurized with air, no leaks anywhere

Voyager

@webers3 did you peel and seal all caulking per Nucamp instructions? There is a video on their support page.

webers3

@Voyager I sealed the tail lights, and since I still have water leaking in despite covering the whole trailer with waterproof tarp, the sealing instructions are academic?

Voyager

@webers3 yeah, that is puzzling……..unless it wasn’t completely dry before you put the tarp over. We ran a fan pointed at that area for 3 days, plus the vent roof fan to make sure it was dry before troubleshooting again. There is however a seam right under that area that needs to be re caulked. I don’t know if your tarp prevented water from sliding under there.

webers3

@Voyager a seam? Is it covered by what looks like metal trim running underneath and across? I noticed something like that but because that area was dry I didn’t pay much attention to it. I’d think if there was water above it I’d see wetness below.

GBL_citruscountyfl

one of the biggest, overlooked areas is tightening the nuts on the exterior handles, from the inside. I check every inch of my 400 after each rain storm, and caught a small puddle in the back compartment, on the floor, and sure enough, one of the two handle bolts was loose and needed to be tightened.

I've been full-time living in mine for four years, and never had any condensation form unless I used the shower without turning the vent on, or running a fan in the rear storage compartment, when it got really cold outside. Once the rv and outside temperature are equal, you should not get condensation. Your staining is definitely water damage.

All 320 years before 2021, Nucamp used a two piece roof sheet of metal in the rear, which allowed water to enter in the exact location you have damage. In 2021, they started using a one piece roof, like they use on the 400's. You may need to remove the plastic bumper (which is super easy,) to find the location water is entering.

webers3

@GBL_citruscountyfl it would help to know how to remove the rear bumper