Did I kill my batteries?

TRob

2021 400 BD. Two 6 volt batteries.

User error. Sent the camper off to the wrap shop and forgot to turn off the batteries and the three way fridge. Batteries were dead when we got it back. Plugged it in to shore power and the factory push button battery monitor showed a full charge immediately. Obviously they can't charge that fast. I ended up leaving it on shore power for weeks. Unplugged it today and there is zero power for lights, etc coming from the batteries. 

This is the first and only time that the batteries have been run down. Is it the last? Any simple thing that I might be missing? 

pthomas745

Find the battery switch and make sure it is on.  Find your battery fuses and make sure they are not blown.  Do you have a multimeter?  Then you can check the batteries with a multimeter independent of switches and fuses.  Check your converter box and check the fuses, and there are two battery circuit breakers there that need to be checked. Do you have installed solar?  Your Victron app will also show you the battery voltage.

Your 400 will have battery fuses in small plastic holders somewhere near the battery.  There is also (maybe, things have changed quickly in the 400) a circuit breaker attached to the battery.

Here is a thread with the same issue...with a picture of what the fuses and "Gloso" circuit breaker looks like.  this discussion focuses on the inverter, also, so you will need to check that out.

https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/11062/did-we-just-kill-our-brand-new-batteries

TRob

Thanks. That gives me plenty to start checking. We probably have a multi-meter at my biz somewhere. Might be time to finally learn to use one.

I did make sure the battery switch was on at least. I do have solar and will check the victron app. I am in the process of installing the battery shunt but put it on hold until I make sure the batteries are still good. 

ScottG

And you are correct regarding the factory monitor showing a full charge. When you are plugged into shore power (or some other charging device) what the monitor reflects is the voltage of the charging circuit, not the batteries. Battery voltage should always be checked with no charge going to the batteries, and no load placed on the batteries.

Otherwise, I second everything pthomas745 said. Check the batteries at the battery terminals. Any interruption in the battery positive line will result in the trailer having no power and the monitor showing zero charge. The same thing applies to charging the battery--if a critical switch/breaker/fuse is disconnected or blown, the charge from the converter won't reach the batteries no matter how long you stay connected to shore power. I.e., even if your batteries are drained when you check them at the terminals, it's possible that you  just haven't actually charged them. Hopefully the solution is that simple--let us know how it turns out. 

Sharon_is_SAM

The battery circuit breaker was previously reported to trip when the battery was trying to charge from a very depleted state.  You may need to use a battery charger independent of the converter.

B0atguy

Since the battery has been drawn down so far to basically "stone dead" , it is basically like an inert "stone" , so to speak. Most modern smart chargers, and possibly the onboard converter /charger will not "sense" a battery since its "stone dead" and basically invisible . You may need to "trick" the charger to start charging . Try "connecting" the "dead" battery up to a good battery via jumper cables , or even a jumper box , then try charging again . You may need to leave the batteries "connected" temporarily for a while , as the charger is charging the pair until the dead battery has enough charge to show some voltage readings on its own . Then the charger can sense the now "visible" battery and keep the charge going. 
We run into this all the time , when batteries are stone dead (common in boats) . Its almost impossible to find chargers anymore that are not "smart" . A stone dead battery is basically invisible to a smart charger . You can even touch the smart charger leads together, and they wont even "spark" anymore like old school chargers did . Its all about safety and explosion risk . 

Maybe give that a try and see if it works for you ?

 

TRob

Excellent info here! I think I will hook the trickle charger up to it for a bit and see if I can get some charge on the batteries. Any reason I can't use a normal car trickle charger in this situation?

pthomas745

Be specific about what charger you are talking about.  A "trickle" charger is just too generic a term.  For a battery in what might be very badly discharged, a "smart" charger would be a much better choice.

So....what charger?

TRob

pthomas745 said:

Be specific about what charger you are talking about.  A "trickle" charger is just too generic a term.  For a battery in what might be very badly discharged, a "smart" charger would be a much better choice.

So....what charger?

An old school trickle charger that I've had since before there were smart chargers! LOL 

pthomas745

LOL.....I still have one, too, somewhere!  Look at the specs on it (if you can find it on the labels) and see what kind of amps it puts out.  It might be good enough to put some charge on the battery...but it might take a long time.

Radcat

Agree with the above. Based on my experience with boat batteries, I don't think one deep discharge will kill it. There are voltage ranges that are reflective of % charge, but the only way to really tell the state of a flooded cell battery is to charge it, let it sit for awhile, and check the specific gravity of each cell. Don't buy a cheap tester that just floats the balls. Get one that will give you a number.   Do a search for the specs. You are looking for the specific gravity level and the difference between cells. Good luck. 

4ncar

...& what ever charger, make sure it is capable of charging an agm battery set.

TRob

All is good! Armed with the info from this thread I took another look at it today. Turns out the batteries are fine. The breaker in the image was tripped. I had battery power when I reset it.

I went ahead and hooked up the shunt and can now see 100% charge in the victron app. I think the breaker tripped when I plugged in the camper after moving it the day before taking it to the wrap shop. I am pretty certain that I heard a click sound when I did that. I did not have the surge protector inline at the time.

Thanks for the help! It's a good day when you come out trouble free and learn a bit more about your systems. Oh - and it doesn't cost any $$$.

ScottG

Sounds good. And if you tripped the breaker before bringing it into the shop, that means you never depleted your battery like you originally thought.

TRob

ScottG said:

Sounds good. And if you tripped the breaker before bringing into the the shop, that means you never depleted your battery like you originally thought.

Exactly. Best case scenario.

Sharon_is_SAM

@TRob - please reduce your photo size.

TRob

Sharon_is_SAM said:

@TRob - please reduce your photo size.

I can do that for pictures. No worries. I didn't realize the software didn't do that on it's own.

It's OT for this thread but have the powers that be ever considered a more modern forum platform that will do things like resize images automatically? No offense intended, it's the people that make a forum, but this software is definitely a bit outdated. 

pthomas745

@TRob did you find the little plastic fuse holders back there?  NuCamp keeps tucking them away in different years, so sometimes it is hard to tell people where they might be.

The various picture resizing discussions over the years.  You can look this thread over for some details. It comes down to the software used for the message board. 

https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/6052/picture-size

TRob

pthomas745 said:

@TRob did you find the little plastic fuse holders back there?  NuCamp keeps tucking them away in different years, so sometimes it is hard to tell people where they might be.

The various picture resizing discussions over the years.  You can look this thread over for some details. It comes down to the software used for the message board. 

https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/6052/picture-size

I did not see the fuses. But then again, I didn't really look. I reset the breaker and it worked so I stopped looking around. I will spend a bit of time familiarizing myself with everything while I have the plywood taken up.

Thanks for the link. I will read it over. I take a particular interest in discussion platforms as I co-founded one of the biggest and earliest forums on the net, www.corvetteforum.com. At the time we sold it and several others in 2007 there were somewhere around 300,000 members on the one site alone. It's not a big deal as this software is perfectly functional, just something I take a personal interest in and tend to notice. 

Sharon_is_SAM

@TRob - there is an announcement thread stuck near the top of the Home page with this:  https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/47/what-size-should-my-posted-forum-photos-be#latest

Unfortunately, this version of Vanilla does not automatically reduce photo size.  We are still dreaming about that😊