Costco Sale on Lion Energy LiFePo Batteries

TNOutback

Costco has Lion Energy Safari UT1300 LiFePo battery two-pack on sale for $1399.99 through 8/1 or until supplies last. So $700 each for 105 Ah batteries. Not a bad price considering BBs are currently running $900 each.

RMo

Another even less expensive option is from Signature Solar - 100ah 12v for $550.  I bought the G4-LL 400ah 12v battery several months ago and am very happy.  YouTube reviews are positive and the prices are hard to beat.  David Poz has a discount code on his review.

https://shop.signaturesolar.us/products/12v-100ah-lifepo4-battery-by-eg4

Dutch061

@RMo, weird as they only show a 100 Ah in 12 volts. There is not a 400Ah battery listed, maybe you have 100Ah but mistyped?

Brad

RMo

I have a 400ah/12v, they get those and 100ah/48v and 200ah/24v in stock but they sell out quickly.  People use them for home solar banks.

Dutch061

That certainly makes for a nice upgrade! It wouldn't fit in a 2020 battery compartment without major modifications but it would be nice to have 400Ah.

Brad

xdr

Is it true if you upgrade from AGM to LION batteries, the inverter has to be upgraded as well? 

Dutch061

Your "converter" charging profile is different to properly charge Lithium Ion Batteries. There are possibly some other things that may need to be addressed, we have a 2020 400 BDL and I am not completely aware of the changes between 2020 and 2021. One of the main concerns is the location of the power distribution center to the batteries. In 2020, the power distribution was under the dinette on the curb side and the batteries were behind the axle under the bed. Since you have Solar, this can be used to top the batteries off.

The "inverter" is what is used to make 120 VAC from 12 VDC and will be fine. 

Please PM me if you want more details, I have commented on many posts on the forum regarding converter's, converter location, issues, solutions, and what I have done that works for us.

I have installed 2 x Battleborn 100Ah Lithium Ion batteries etc. 

Brad

RMo

Dutch061 said:

That certainly makes for a nice upgrade! It wouldn't fit in a 2020 battery compartment without major modifications but it would be nice to have 400Ah.

In our 2019 400 I was able to fit the battery, 3000 watt inverter, charger, contactor switch, and solar controller all under the bed, with the shore/inverter transfer switch under the fridge.  I left the standard batteries in place and use them as backup via an A/B switch.  Not much room left under the middle of the bed but the outside-accessible side storage area still fits my cords, surge protector, levelers and a stove.

Somewhat surprisingly, I've learned that the standard converter can charge the LiFePo battery to 96% - although it takes a long time (max 7amps) so I generally rely on solar or the 75amp under-bed charger.

Dutch061

Yeah, unfortunately the 2020 also have an Air8 under the bed so leaving a back up plan of the second set of batteries wasn't an option. Don't think I would have even if I had the room actually. So far, I have been very pleased with the 2 x BB 100Ah. They will get the true test next month when we head out west, I doubt it will be a issue of battery capacity. It will likely be a fresh water - grey water capacity problem. 

Brad

TNOutback

I’m curious if anyone owns the Lion batteries already.  They are apparently the same chemistry as the BBs, roughly the same capacity, but strangely smaller and much lighter than the BBs.  That makes me go “hmmmm”.

Marceline

TNOutback said:

I’m curious if anyone owns the Lion batteries already.  They are apparently the same chemistry as the BBs, roughly the same capacity, but strangely smaller and much lighter than the BBs.  That makes me go “hmmmm”.

I've had a 90aH LiON Energy battery since Jan 2020. I bought it from Costco figuring that if it didn't work for me, I could bring it back. It works fine and it's been a terrific upgrade for me. 

Tundra57

@RMo. What do you run with the 3000watt inverter? I have 400Ah AGM battery with the standard nucamp fitted 1200W. I would like to upgrade it and use the changeover switch so I can power all of the outlets not just the one.

I saw many different inveters for sale with mixed reviews. The renogy one looks nice.

RMo

Tundra57 said: @RMo. What do you run with the 3000watt inverter? I have 400Ah AGM battery with the standard nucamp fitted 1200W. I would like to upgrade it and use the changeover switch so I can power all of the outlets not just the one.

I saw many different inveters for sale with mixed reviews. The renogy one looks nice.

We run the A/C when needed (for a few hours at most), the microwave when cooking a lazy meal and, most importantly our coffee machines in the morning.  I got the Giandel 3000w after reading some reviews.  The 2000 might have been OK, but the form factor of the Giandel 3000 fit my space better than others.  My guess is most brand-name inverters work fine.  One thing I learned about the Giandel, and it may be true for others, is that the 3 plugs on the back are each a max of 1000w; to get 3000w you hard wire your connection to the terminals.  Best of luck and enjoy!

Spectre9

I have a 2018 320s with stock wfco converter and it works just fine with ut1300.  If you have solar you will get to full charged but I otherwise would not bother with a converter swap for just 100Ah Safari ut1300 

Spectre9

TNOutback said:

I’m curious if anyone owns the Lion batteries already.  They are apparently the same chemistry as the BBs, roughly the same capacity, but strangely smaller and much lighter than the BBs.  That makes me go “hmmmm”.

The Lion Safari is a prismatic battery system so there are 4 cells that are rectangular.  The BattleBorn uses packs of round metal cells (think 18650) more like a tesla.  This is why they are heavier.   Both are the same chemistry but the packaging is different.

CharlieRN

This video will give you an idea of what's inside a BB LiFePO4 battery. A caveat is in order - after making the video, this person became a BB affiliate, though that was not the case when it was made.

Here's a link to a more comprehensive comparison of Li several batteries. Not sure if any of these are the same as the Costco battery, but you can see that there are substantial differences in the design and build of different not only of the cells but also of the BMS.

sebzips

I helped Bezos go to space when I got an Amperetime LiFePO4 100ah 12v battery for $470. 

ChanW

The Ampere Time price is nice to see.

Here's hoping it's the beginning of the drop to a reasonable price for all LiFePO4 batteries!

I won't have need for a new battery for a few years, which ought to be time enough for these things to 'get reasonable'!

sebzips said:

I helped Bezos go to space when I got an Amperetime LiFePO4 100ah 12v battery for $470. 

Verna

Yes,@ChanW, by the time my dual 6V AGM batteries are ready to be retired, I hope for the Lithium batteries to be a reasonable price. Until then, with sufficient solar panel wattage, I do not have to plug the T@B to electricity at my house between trips. 

RMo

Another bargain-priced option for those of you (like me) looking for something to serve you well without all the bells and whistles, is reviewed here.  You’d have to make sure you don’t charge them at low temperature but that seems a small price to pay for a good quality $399/100ah LiFePo battery!

https://youtu.be/74iBMHE3StM

Grumpy_G

The low temperature charging cutoff is probably more important in an RV installation than in a fixed solar installation. Imagine getting on the road early on a cold fall morning and plugging in the 7 pin, voila instant charging voltage. Can't disconnect the battery either because it's needed for the breakaway. 

RMo

Grumpy_G said:

The low temperature charging cutoff is probably more important in an RV installation than in a fixed solar installation. Imagine getting on the road early on a cold fall morning and plugging in the 7 pin, voila instant charging voltage. Can't disconnect the battery either because it's needed for the breakaway. 

…….or just add the lithium batteries to your AGMs as a separate bank and use an A/B switch to control charging and use.  Or use a separate charger with low temp protection for charging.  Or use a separate BMS for the lithiums like the one reviewed here: https://diysolarforum.com/threads/finally-found-a-lifepo4-bms-with-low-temp-charging-protection.2884/.  

Grumpy_G

True, but I'm a proponent of the the KISS principle: Keep it simple and stupid. Adding a switch or external BMS increases the likelihood of failure or operator error.