Outlets all of a sudden not working inside...

Pattie57

Hi all, when I first got my 2004 T@B T2 home, I plugged in and checked all the lights and outlets inside the trailer and everything worked fine. After connecting a battery and getting the cook top and fridge to work, I planned to spend the night in it in my yard just see how quiet, warm and comfortable it will be when camping. I went to plug in my phone to recharge and I discovered that none of the outlets were working. I've gone through all of the manuals and googled but have come up with nothing. The 2 outlets in the trailer are not have GFCI outlets. AC power was on to the trailer. Any suggestions?

SLJ

I don't have a 2004 but I'll bet there's another GFCI somewhere that they all connect to. Check under/near sink, cabinets, under benches, etc.

Pattie57

@SLJ Thank you...I will check! While I was trying to figure out the fridge, I fiddled around with fuses by replacing them according to the amp numbers thinking that was part of the issue with the fridge. Could a fuse be the problem?

SLJ

I don't know what converter you have but the AC outlets should be on circuit breakers. The DC voltage would be on fuses.

Pattie57

SLJ, I have checked in every nook and cranny and did not find GFCI.

rfuss928

It sounds like the GCFI has tripped.  It should be the outlet on the left bench.  Push the test button then the reset.  Sometimes it helps to use a small stick to assure they are pushed far enough.

pthomas745

One more thing: when you checked the trailer on shore power, yes, the outlets worked.  "I installed a battery". Then things didn't work.  Are you still on shore power?  The outlets (unless there is an inverter connected to the battery) will not work on battery power.

So: are you on shore power or battery power?

Pattie57

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Pattie57

@rfuss928, the pictures above show what I found under the bench...I couldn't see any button to push.

Pattie57

@pthomas745, I have tried with and without shore power.

rfuss928

Where does the big white wire go? (center bottom of above photo)  That is the AC out of your power center. 

Pattie57

rfuss928, it goes to the fuse box. I flipped the AC breakers on and off; didn't solve the problem.

Pattie57

rfuss928, sorry, I was wrong. The big white wire goes to one of the outlets. No buttons of any kind on any of the 2 outlets. The picture shows the back of the fuse box under the bench.

rfuss928

The orange wire is the AC in to the power center, Often called the converter.  That box makes "12 volts " to maintain the battery and power the 12v appliances and lights.  It also has a circuit breaker(s) for the outlets and maybe air conditioning.
You need to have the trailer connected to 120vac (shore power) for any of this to work.  When running off the battery, the power center provides fuses for the many 12v circuits.  Have you checked the circuit breaker in the converter?

SLJ

You are sure you still have power at the AC cord coming from the house? Outlets will, only work then it's plugged into outside power. They won't work on battery unless you have additional equipment (Inverter).

Pattie57

@rfuss928, the orange wire leads right to where the the trailer's plug in power cord. The trailer is connected to shore power. I have flipped the I AC breakers on and off; didn't solve the problem. I had nothing else plugged in at the time and all 3 lights in the trailer work. Very strange...

Pattie57

SLJ , yes...absolutely certain!

Grumpy_G

The picture shows AC breakers labeled Main, Outlets and AC. Does the AC work ? 

pthomas745

Can anyone guess why there is a 1 amp fuse in the Number 1 fuse position?  The one marked "Main?" Or am I reading this wrong?

rfuss928

pthomas745 said:

Can anyone guess why there is a 1 amp fuse in the Number 1 fuse position?  The one marked "Main?" Or am I reading this wrong?

I saw that...  Trying to solve the AC side for now.  Apparently everything on 12v works.
I think it is time to follow the voltage with a meter.  Something is missing or not working suddenly.

Pattie57

@Grumpy_G, yes, everything is hooked up, power is on from the house, all connections are together. All 3 lights in the trailer work...I am assuming that they would work off the AC as well as the outlets or am I wrong?

Pattie57

@pthomas745, this is the way the fuses were in when I got the trailer. Before I installed the battery, the AC outlets and the lights in the trailer worked fine.

Grumpy_G

We have a communication problem AC = air conditioning in this context. Sorry should have spelled that out. There is a breaker labeled AC so I assume the trailer has one. If it works the problem is somewhere with the outlet circuit. If it doesn't the problem is likely outside the trailer. 

All the lights in the trailer run off 12V battery power so that does not mean anything for the 120V AC side. 

Pattie57

@Grumpy_G, sorry, my mistake! This trailer doesn't have an air conditioner. I found the breaker that is labeled AC and I have flipped it on and off a couple of times. The fan on the top of the trailer works so I am assuming that is also part of the 12v system but this fan also ran on just the AC system. I have a funny feeling that if I uninstall the battery, the plug-ins may work again or is that just a weird thought?

Grumpy_G

You appear a little lost with this electrical stuff but you'll get the hang of it. At a high level the trailer has two separate electrical systems, 12V DC and 120V AC. For traditional camping with no power hookup most everything in the trailer works off 12V, lights, fan and the fridge in gas mode (the ticking relighter uses 12V). The 120V side powers the outlets, the fridge in AC power mode and most importantly the converter in the power center. Think of the converter as a glorified battery charger, it takes 120V AC in and puts 12V DC out to charge the battery and power the 12V side. In essence the 12V side has two possible power sources, the battery and the converter (when connected to AC). You can have either one or both. Some good info here: https://us.v-cdn.net/5021717/uploads/editor/fw/dnylxkpq8clx.pdf

In the other thread you wrote that initially you had no battery but the trailer plugged in and the interior lights worked. Disconnect the battery and see if this is still true. This will tell us if there is 120V AC coming to the converter. 

Pattie57

@Grumpy_G, you're right, I am unfamiliar with all of this being a newby! The book that came with the trailer says I have both systems. The information that you stated in the second paragraph is true; no battery...outlets worked, lights worked, fan on top of trailer worked. I disconnected the battery and now the lights don't work....neither do the plug-ins or the fan.

Pattie57

@Grumpy_G, connected the battery back up again and now the lights and the fan don't work and still nothing with outlets. The only thing I can think of now is somehow I blew a fuse.

Pattie57

@Grumpy_G, I have posted a couple of other comments ahead of this post to let you know the process I've done so far. At one point this afternoon, I turned on the furnace to see if it worked and there appeared to be no problem...it was blowing good and starting to warm. So I turned it off and turned off the propane. This was before I disconnected the battery. So my next step was to check the fuses. So I'm wondering if turning the furnace on screwed something up with the lights. The outlets did not work last night. Sure enough, the 30A fuse was blown. Went to replace it and it blew before I could get it inserted all the way. So my next question is whether or not things have to be done in a certain order, for example disconnecting the battery before I try to insert a new fuse.

MuttonChops

Hi, All . . . . I've been following this thread and have three suggestions.

For @Pattie57

1)   Are you 100% certain the House outlet is live.
       You have tested it with a plug-in fan/light/whatever.

2)   Super search the trailer interior and exterior for a GFCI outlet.
      The Dutchman Documents say the TaBs had one.
      It could be hiding under a shelf/cabinet or even under the benches.
      And of course could be outside.

For all the Folks Trying to Solve the problem

3)   Attached file (.jpg) has a basic Dutchman Electrical Wiring Overview from yr-2005

Good hunting, everyone.

Pattie57

@MuttonChops Yes, there is definitely power coming from the house! I have torn the trailer apart, looking in every nook and cranny by even undoing the screws of the cover in the area that has the ducts. Nothing. I have all but crawled under looking to see if I can find a GFCI outlet. The only place I have not looked is behind the fridge but I can't imagine why it would be there and I don't want to monkey with that. Thank you for your suggestions though.

Grumpy_G

The 30A fuse is the battery fuse and serves mainly as reverse polarity protection. Did you disconnect both battery cables ? Any chance you might have reversed them upon reconnection ? 

If the lights etc don't work without the battery even though the trailer is plugged in it very likely is a problem outside the trailer. To reiterate @MuttonChops point: If you plug something else into the house outlet where the trailer is connected, does the light or whatever work ? Also make sure the cable is securely attached at the trailer side.