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GFCI question for owners with Multiplus II 3000W inverter/charger:

rh5555rh5555 Member Posts: 517
edited November 2023 in Battery/Electrical & Solar
If you plug your TAB into a GFCI breaker, does your Multiplus II trip it when it turns on?
I've just installed a MultiPlus-II 12/3000/120-50 inverter/charger in my TAB400, and it is tripping any GFCI outlet I plug it into at the moment when it starts charging the battery.  Seller is saying "they all do that" and don't use a GFCI outlet.  I would like to know what the community experience is.
Roger and Sue Hill | 2020 T@B400 Boondock (Cryst@bel) | 2022 Land Rover Defender 110 - P400 | San Juan Island, WA
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Comments

  • JilongJilong Member Posts: 87
    Is it just drawing too many amps right off the bat when plugged into shore power? I think Victron inverter-chargers have a way to limit the input amps on the shore power side.
    2018 Tab 400 × 2013 Toyota Highlander Limited AWD
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  • rh5555rh5555 Member Posts: 517
    No, it's definitely a ground leak.  If I disconnect the ground wire, it all works fine.
    Roger and Sue Hill | 2020 T@B400 Boondock (Cryst@bel) | 2022 Land Rover Defender 110 - P400 | San Juan Island, WA
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  • otr_320otr_320 Member Posts: 71
    edited November 2023
    We installed a Victron Multiplus II 12v 3000 2x120 in our 320 a few months ago.  Have always used a non-GFCI outlet in our garage to power our 320. Your post got me curious so I just tried powering our 320 via a 20a GFCI outlet with the Multiplus charger turned on.  Charges just fine with 100+ amps of charge current.

    A GFCI trips when it detects a difference in load (current) between the hot and neutral.  I've found wiring issues on either the neutral or ground side can trip a GFCI. Have you checked to make sure all your "new" neutral and ground connections for this install are properly connected/terminated?

    What do you have your Multiplus chassis grounded to?  

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  • rh5555rh5555 Member Posts: 517
    In the process of troubleshooting, I disconnected everything except a length of Romex feeding the Multiplus from an extension cord and my batteries.  No independent grounding of Multiplus.  It still trips any GFCI it is plugged into...
     
    Roger and Sue Hill | 2020 T@B400 Boondock (Cryst@bel) | 2022 Land Rover Defender 110 - P400 | San Juan Island, WA
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  • otr_320otr_320 Member Posts: 71
    edited November 2023
    @rh5555, not sure if you saw this.  A good bit of discussion about this Multiplus GFCI issue in the Victron Community Forum.  Appears to be 2 versions of the problem.  Unfortunately, didn't see a solution mentioned.  

    https://community.victronenergy.com/questions/161020/multiplus-ii-2x120v-tripping-gfci.html
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  • rh5555rh5555 Member Posts: 517
    I did see this.  Their situation is a lot more complicated involving 120V/240V setup.  Mine is so simple, which is why I was appealing to other Multiplus owners to see if anyone else is having issues.  So far, one out of one respondent isn't (thank you, @otr_320).  I also have questions into tech@nucamp.com.
    Roger and Sue Hill | 2020 T@B400 Boondock (Cryst@bel) | 2022 Land Rover Defender 110 - P400 | San Juan Island, WA
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  • elbolilloelbolillo Member Posts: 421
    You need to limit the amp draw using the Victron Connect App. I would trip my 20amp circuit in the garage at first because the app was set to pull 30amps. Changed it to 20amp and Bob's your uncle.
    _____________________________________________________
    Ken / 2023 Tab 400 “La Bolita” (23,000+ miles) / 2024 Toyota Sequoia
    2024 - 3 Trips - 35 nights - 9 National Parks, 3 National Forests
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  • elbolilloelbolillo Member Posts: 421
    I should say, that I have a Multiplus 3000w not a Multiplus II.
    _____________________________________________________
    Ken / 2023 Tab 400 “La Bolita” (23,000+ miles) / 2024 Toyota Sequoia
    2024 - 3 Trips - 35 nights - 9 National Parks, 3 National Forests
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  • elbolilloelbolillo Member Posts: 421
    rh5555 said:
    If you plug your TAB into a GFCI breaker, does your Multiplus II trip it when it turns on?
    I've just installed a MultiPlus-II 12/3000/120-50 inverter/charger in my TAB400, and it is tripping any GFCI outlet I plug it into at the moment when it starts charging the battery.  Seller is saying "they all do that" and don't use a GFCI outlet.  I would like to know what the community experience is.
    What is your battery setup? I don't know about the Multiplus-II, but the regular Multiplus needs to be configured specifically for your setup.
    _____________________________________________________
    Ken / 2023 Tab 400 “La Bolita” (23,000+ miles) / 2024 Toyota Sequoia
    2024 - 3 Trips - 35 nights - 9 National Parks, 3 National Forests
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  • rh5555rh5555 Member Posts: 517
    My setup is 2x LiTime 230Ah 12V batteries in parallel.  The Multiplus has been set up using the VE.bus to USB dongle and my laptop.
    Roger and Sue Hill | 2020 T@B400 Boondock (Cryst@bel) | 2022 Land Rover Defender 110 - P400 | San Juan Island, WA
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  • otr_320otr_320 Member Posts: 71
    edited November 2023
    rh5555 said:
    I did see this.  Their situation is a lot more complicated involving 120V/240V setup.  Mine is so simple, which is why I was appealing to other Multiplus owners to see if anyone else is having issues.  So far, one out of one respondent isn't (thank you, @otr_320).  I also have questions into tech@nucamp.com.
    https://community.victronenergy.com/questions/161020/multiplus-ii-2x120v-tripping-gfci.html

    @rh5555, I believe the overall premise of the above Victron Multiplus II 3000 GFCI thread focused primarily on the difference between the Euro and US GFCI hot/neutral leakage current thresholds.  When a given threshold is exceeded, the GFCI cuts-off all power to the circuit. The Euro threshold is ~30ma.  The US is ~6ma, which is much more stringent (and safer).  If Victron is selling Multiplus II 3000's (in the US) based on the Euro threshold then that would explain why so many folks are experiencing issues with US GFCI's.

    I believe in your previous post you connected your Victron Multiplus II 3000 directly to a GFCI protected outlet (bypassing everything in your 400) and it tripped the GFCI.  If true, then it would appear your Multiplus has >6ma of leakage current.  I suppose there is the possibility the wire or plug you used caused the leakage, but more than likely it's the Multiplus.
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  • enzo86enzo86 Member Posts: 31
    @rh5555
    Did you ever find a solution to this ?  I am having the same problem with my brand new multiplus 3000/12 120V unit.
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  • rh5555rh5555 Member Posts: 517
    edited May 13
    @enzo86 - do you have an older Multiplus or the newer Multiplus II?  
    My ground leakage issue went away when it got drier.  It seems that moisture exacerbated the problem.  I know others will scream in horror, but I added a ground isolation switch to disconnect the shore power ground if I have to use a GFCI protected outlet and it is tripping on me.  Haven't needed to use it yet.
    Roger and Sue Hill | 2020 T@B400 Boondock (Cryst@bel) | 2022 Land Rover Defender 110 - P400 | San Juan Island, WA
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  • enzo86enzo86 Member Posts: 31
    MultiPlus 12/3000/120-50 120V 
    Firmware version: 502

    What is odd is that it is tripping the GFCI in charging only mode with no AC out connected.  Wonder if it could be some sort of grounding fault on the DC side ?




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  • rh5555rh5555 Member Posts: 517
    What wiring have you installed for grounding?  Obviously you have a ground lead from shore power, and ground continuing to the rest of the trailer, but any others?
    Roger and Sue Hill | 2020 T@B400 Boondock (Cryst@bel) | 2022 Land Rover Defender 110 - P400 | San Juan Island, WA
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  • BDA123BDA123 Member Posts: 22
    I’ve never had my gfci’s flip when charging my trailer but i have the Multiplus 24/3000. Sounds like the body of your Victron components are not properly grounded to the TAB chassis.

    Trailer - 2018 Tab 400 with Solar
    TV - 2014 Toyota Tacoma Double Cab with bed rack/truck tent
    Adds - Jackit bike rack with tongue rectangular tool box
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  • rh5555rh5555 Member Posts: 517
    @BDA123 - do you really have a 24V Multiplus?
    Roger and Sue Hill | 2020 T@B400 Boondock (Cryst@bel) | 2022 Land Rover Defender 110 - P400 | San Juan Island, WA
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