Flexable solar panels ???

Brooky

Looking for feed back on flexible solar panels for the roof for a T@b. Thinking about getting some type of solar, or a generator for our T@b. Just feel like solar mounted on the roof would be more secure. Theft is always a concern.

Nomad

There's two or three people here that have flex-mounted panels, hopefully they'll chime in.
What kind of camping do you do? If campgrounds, there's plenty of people with solar suitcases now days that every campground has some and most keep watch on each others stuff. About the only time I've ever worried is when remote boondocking where everyone's spread out so it's hard to keep watch.

Brooky

Always have stayed in campgrounds, but some time I will do some boondocking. I think even if I stayed in a parking lot, it would be great to have a roof mount  solar panel, without thinking it could walk away.

jkjenn

I would check out the Yano group. I believe there are some thorough installation explanations there.

Nomad

Brooky - It does limit your choice of campsites as you need to keep the T@B in the sun pointed the right direction to get a good charge unless you've got plenty of watts and battery to carry you through.

Normfun

Brooky, I have 2 100 watt Renogy flex panels mounted on to of my T@b. Been there for 4 months and so far they are great. I mounted them front to back on either side of the fantastic fan. 

Nomad

normfun - Since Brooky's new to this, what limitations do you find? How careful do you have to be with your positioning? And since they go somewhat hand in hand, what's your battery setup?

mash2

Chime....I actually have the potential for a hybrid system (both fixed and moveable).  Two permanently mounted panels (136 watts) and a third (68 watts) that could be employed at another spot if I want to add additional wattage.  I have not found that the permanently mounted panels have been an issue with shady locations (and haven't bothered to augment with the additional panel).  

I prefer not thinking about the constantly deploying a solar system.  Just show up and it is going.  Security wasn't an issue in my thought process.

Actually, price was my biggest issue.   At the time I installed mine (3 or 4 years ago), the panels were extremely cheap. Great deals could be had on unisolar panels, after their bankruptcy.

I added battery capacity (200 AMPs) to carry me through.   Has worked out well. 

mash2

I think Pxlated is right, particularly in winter.  Overall yields are low in winter and every trick to coax sun access is more important.  However, for much of the year (March-October), I get pretty good results, regardless of what direction I'm pointed - within reason -- and even in fairly shady areas (redwood forests), they've worked well for me.  

Given the current price environment for panels, not sure I would do it now, however.  While I like the simplicity, most panels don't seem to lend themselves to the t@b the same way as unisolars did (they were set up for permanent installations).  

jkjenn

mash2 said:

Chime....I actually have the potential for a hybrid system (both fixed and moveable).  Two permanently mounted panels (136 watts) and a third (68 watts) that could be employed at another spot if I want to add additional wattage.  I have not found that the permanently mounted panels have been an issue with shady locations (and haven't bothered to augment with the additional panel).  

I prefer not thinking about the constantly deploying a solar system.  Just show up and it is going.  Security wasn't an issue in my thought process.

Actually, price was my biggest issue.   At the time I installed mine (3 or 4 years ago), the panels were extremely cheap. Great deals could be had on unisolar panels, after their bankruptcy.

I added battery capacity (200 AMPs) to carry me through.   Has worked out well. 

@mash2there are definitely benefits to a permanent mount. I know I benefited by mounting a 50 watt to my TV roof while driving out west this fall. It charged that T@b, when I was parked for stops or when I dry camped before I was on my way in the AM. It's sort of like a crock pot - fix it and forget it. But, I think it would be hard, with our current options, to mount enough to be sufficient for a lot of situations (location, weather, etc..) so I can see the value of a hybrid.

Personally, I don't love the look of a permanent mount, total personal preference, so I use suction cups with the built in grommets on my flexible panel when I take it off of the Jeep and plan on either doing the same when I can pick up a couple of Renogy panels when they start making the 100w flexible panels again or putting together a nice little PVC frame that is easy to transport and can easily be placed where it will receive optimal direct sun.

mash2

I like my racing stripes.

jkjenn

mash2 said:

I like my racing stripes.

I like the look more than I used to like it, but I am not quite there, yet. The nice thing is that if you pull in at night, in therein, you don't have to worry about them. They will start working as soon as the sun rises.

Nomad

mash2 - I think the 200 amp in batteries is probably the important thing - you can get by with less than ideal sun for a long time. You only need good sun on occassion :-)

Normfun

My roof panels run in to the charge controller mounted under the street side bench. I also installed in parallel with them a port for a 100 watt suitcase panel w/o controller. So if the trailer is in the shade I can plug in the portable and put it in the sun. All this solar feeds through the controller to 2, 6 volt golf cart batteries. That yield 208 amp hours of power. I have disconnected my tow vehicle charge wire as the solar charges while traveling. All in all it only takes 3 hours of good sunlight to totally recharge from the nights usage. Even after 3-4 days of rain we were back to a full charge in a day. It's probably overkill but hey, it's better than coming up short. We also have a second propane tank installed. That came in handy a couple of times. So far I like what I've got and don't see changing things anytime soon. 

Normfun

Look close you can see the panels on the top

mash2

Both Norman and plated have good comments.  I think the trick is to think about how you want to use the T@B and figure out where the constraints in your systems lie and look at ways to get around the constraints.  In doing this, consider how changes can work together over time to meet your needs.

In my case, I wanted additional 12V capacity, but don't use AC (my own bias).  Found solar I liked and installed (my bias being I didn't want to worry about deploying so chose permanent).  
This bought me an additional source for 12v capacity.  It helped a lot but I found I wanted ability to go longer when weather was bad (overcast).  Reworked batteries to significantly increase 12v storage.  
Concern for filling up the batteries while off grid led to adding capacity to hook up a roving panel.  

Non AC and preference for no generator directed my decisions. Permanent installation saved required storage space and time for the system. Battery capacity freed me from worrying as much about where I parked.  
My next step will probably be a zero goal 150 (for computer and camera electrical needs).  The "spare" solar panel will double as source for charging this when I'm out and about.  This zero goal will generally function as a third battery for 120v capacity in my case (though the car inverter generally functions as a 120 sources as well).

In my case, I did this in a series of steps (solar, then batteries, then solar, then more 120 capacity).  Just tried to make sure that each step allowed me to continue adding capacity without starting over.  In this regard, make sure that the panels can be additive (mine are all unisolar 68's so the compatibility issue was not a problem).   

If I used AC, I would have added a generator (which would probably eliminate need for the goal zero).  While I like the versatility of the generator, it is one of my bias
  
Normfun, I have a second propane tank when I'm out for longer trips, and just toss it in the back of the TV to switch out if I need it.  If weather is warm, I'm not really worried about running out (I have an outdoor stove for cooking as well) so i don't bother.    

jcfaber1

Normfun, that is a nice looking install.  How many watts per PV?  I would also like to see a photo from the rear. 

I have not worried too much about theft as we are usually in established campgrounds.  I like the idea of both permanent and moveable solar but went with the moveable for when we are in areas with shade.  I do not think the charge wire from the vehicle really does a good job of charging the batteries.  It would be nice to have the best of both worlds (portable and fixed).  My flexible panels in the home made suitcase is great as they are protected when travelling and is very light without the glass.


John

Normfun

The roof panels are Renogy 100 bendable the portable is a Renogy 100 suitcase model. 300 watts when fully deployed. I will try to get a pic from the back and maybe from above next week. It has been a fun and rewarding project. 

jcfaber1

Thanks.  I too have used the same panels for my 200 watt suitcase.  It is very easy to transport, not including the frame it weighs 20lbs.  Photo attached.  I love these projects.  What are you using for a meter?  I have the Bogart Engineering Trimetric 2025-Rv.  Regarding the photos, I would be interested to see how you ran the wires.  John

Nomad

Curious - What's it weight total (with frame)?

jcfaber1

The case is 20lbs, the collapsed frame in its blue jean bag is 11lbs, a small old stuff sack of the fasteners under 1lb and the 50ft of 8 gauge wire is 10lbs for a total of 42lbs.  It all adds up I guess.  For the fasteners, I used stainless steel and epoxied them into those knobs as I did not want to use tools or look for a nut in the grass.  The case fits nicely behind the passenger seat in the Jeep Grand Cherokee. 

John

Nomad

"it all adds up" <- Yes it do. I'm always kind of surprised when I first haul mine out of the Jeep. Not nearly as bad as the generator though.

MarineFriend

I have the same light weight peal and stick durable Flex Panel setup as mash2 above. No thief can seal them. These things just peal and stick to the roof. Security is not an issue. Shade not much of an issue. Deployment not an issue. System stays charged with absolutely no fuss. I have done this since 2008. It's worth it. Now the flex panels are on ebay for less. 

I had a camper repair place in Romona CA stick them to the top, drill wire holes and install the charging regulator for about $200. The parts were $1000. That works out to be $150 per year and dropping. $11 per month. I couldn't be happier. 

[Deleted User]

I just purchased a couple of flexible 100W panels that I understand are remarketed Renogy panels, got 'em on Amazon and that's what one of the reviewers said anyway.  I'm debating whether to permanently mount them to the roof, similar to what Norm has done or build my own suitcase and frame, along the lines of what John has fabricated.  I like the idea of not having to set them up every time or worry about security but am concerned about shading and non-optimum panel exposure or generating enough power to keep my batteries healthy.  Both options have raised questions that I'm hoping you experienced guys may be able to help me with.

If I go with the permanent mount to the roof, since these panels aren't the "peel and stick" type, I'll need to come up with some type of glue to adhere the panels to the roof surface.  Norm, did you put those on yourself or did you get someone to install them for you?   I can screw anchor through the grommets and seal the anchors but I also want to keep air and water from getting between the panels and the roof.  My batteries, 2-6V 220AH each, are in the box on the tongue so I want to put the controller near them.  Does anyone know if cable can be routed under the plastic trim at the edge of the roof / top of the wall?  Just trying to make this look decent.  I wondered if there was space below the trim, if you could access it by removing the plastic trim at the front corner pull handle?  I didn't see any exposed wires in Norm's photo above, and wasn't sure how the wires got back to the controller and batteries.

I'd thought some about planning for an additional permanent panel if needed as there's room on the roof for another one, but hadn't though about a hybrid, portable plug-in as a supplement.  It's an interesting idea, but I'm hopeful that 200W should be enough for our needs as we're not going to be living in the trailer and boondocking full time.  I recently discovered HandyBob's Blog and it was an eye-opener, and a bit to wade thru.  He and his wife have gone years in their 5th wheel with something like 345W of solar, boondocking most of the time, running 120V power tools and appliances, and they've never used a generator.  He comes off as a cantankerous opinionated dude, but he's got a lot of knowledge about solar.

I've got a bunch of questions about a portable setup.  Critical for me is voltage drop and maintaining adequate voltage to the controller so that it can fully charge the batteries. Another advantage to a permanent setup on the trailer are shorter leads from the panels to the controller.  John, in your portable system, how long are the leads between your panels and your controller and what voltage are you seeing at the controller?  I'm leaning heavily toward a trimetric 2030-RV meter and SC-2030 solar controller and am interested in how your liking your meter.  I'm now wishing that I'd had one since we got our T@B so I'd have a better understanding of what everything is actually drawing.  I also am curious about what your using for cable connectors at either the panels or the controller.  My panels came with MC4 connectors but they don't appear to lend themselves to connecting and disconnecting on a regular basis.  I've never used these so I may be wrong, but the 2 tools it takes to pull them apart makes me think that this isn't the best option for a connection that needs to be made and unmade regularly.

Sorry for the lengthy post, but I appreciate you folks sharing your knowledge and experiences.  Any additional information you can add about your setups is welcomed. Thanks.

Nomad

Norm and the others will have to answer your questions but somewhere here on the forums I recall there are pictures of some flex panels where they took off the rear tailight housing and ran the panel wiring thru there internally - and of course remounted the light housings - might even have been Norm's setup.

Normfun

On my 2 permanent panels I used a 3M tape to hold them on. I don't remember the number but will look it up if needed. It was a commercial extreme bond tape. I also silicone sealed the edges so water and wind couldn't intrude. The wiring is zip tied to stick on anchors I got from work. They consolidate to just 1 positive and 1 negative that enter the trailer just above the AC grill on the top side of my CS-S. If the site of 4 inches of black wire tightly going over the roof edge and in to the side wall bugs you then you would need a hole in the roof. I didn't want a hole in the roof so did it my way. Honestly I don't even see it. 200 watts is plenty most of the time. When it isn't I just add in my 100 watt portable that I can put in the sun. So far I have never seen a reading below 12.3 volts. It is nice to not have to worry about "is my vehicle charging the trailer?" Or will the portable be there when we get back?  It's worry and trouble free. I do admit replacing a panel will require use of ever swear word I know and the invention of new ones. But so far no problem. 

Normfun

The tape was either 5952 or 4941. I think I waffled and used alternating strips of each. 

Nomad

I probably shouldn't say this but in 15 months I've only woried about my panels getting stolen 2-3 times and packed them away. I worried about it when I first got started but not once I actually had some experience. I never worry about it in actual campgrounds and even when boondocking there are so many campers with unattended panels here and there it doesn't seem others worry much anymore either.
That said, it probably depends on what part of the country you're camping in. The only place I've ever seen theft warnings was on the CA coast and they were for securing your generator.

Normfun

I am a convicted worry wart. It's what I do. I will admit to only 1 item having ever been stolen from me. A kids bike. He had outgrown it anyway. 

Nomad

Nothing wrong with being carefull - Everyone needs to decide their level of comfort and/or worry. Just don't necessarily want everyone to think it's a den of theives out here though :-)

Joe

My two cents --

Like PXL:

1) I like having a free standing panel that I can easily move and point at the sun.  
2) I don't like the idea of poking holes in my roof or figuring out the wiring.
3) I don't worry too much about thieves.

Just got back last night from a three day/two night boon docking trip to a ranch in far south Texas on the Mexico border.  NOT a safe place.  The solar system worked great.  Couldn't be happier with it.

100 watt panel, Group 27 100 AH AGM deep cycle battery.

All that said, not everyone has the same requirements in their solar system, so I understand those that place a higher priority on the convenience of having panels on the roof.  Just pointing out what works for me.

~ Joe