400 Boondock Tire Clearance

N7SHG_Ham

Was just looking at a new unit and noticed for the first time what looks to be very limited clearance between the tire and the plastic trim on the outer edge of the wheel well. It doesn't appear to me that more than an inch or so of body travel is possible without making contact with the tire.

Anybody with a 400 Boondock had any issues with the tire rubbing the wheel well trim?

Awca12a

Its too new for me to tell but I measured this morning and the on the drivers side, the front part of the well is 1" from the tire and the back part is 2" from the tire.   On the passenger side, it is 1-1/2" equidistant.  Could be how it is parked so I'll check again when it moves.  While I was there, it has 4" clearance from tire to top of the wheel well on the inside.

N7SHG_Ham

I am most concerned about the front/rear clearance. It seems logical that with any bounce in the suspension that could be a point of contact AND especially if on a muddy road with the tires all caked with mud. Please update as you have a chance, I am seriously considering changing my order to remove the Boondock option and just upgrade the tub. A real bummer is you also can't buy a Goodyear Endurance tire in the Boondock size and I have been web searching for a ST (trailer) tire in the Boondock size unsuccessfully. R-Pod owners for at least one other brand have also had many discussions about replacement tires since they also use this oddball size (for a ST tire).

falcon1970

The Boondock tire supplied by nuCamp is a 235x75/15.  The largest Goodyear Endurance tire that I have found is 225x75/15.  That is only .79" difference in height.  I think that Goodyear tire will work just fine.
The non-Boondock tire is 205x75/15.  I bought my 400 with the steel tub and the pitched axle but I passed on the Boondock tires.  I probably should have gone with the complete Boondock Lite package since that would have added another 1.77" to the overall height of the trailer and my purpose with the pitched axle was to get a little more ground clearance for traversing a steep driveway apron.  I passed on the Boondock tires because I don't think there is much utility in an aggressive tread pattern on a non-driven wheel.
BTW my 400 (with the 205 size tires) has about 3" clearance front and back and 4.25" on the top.

N7SHG_Ham

@falcon1970 thanks for your input. I wanted to order with Boondock axle plus aluminium tub, (Boondock a la carte), my dealer told me a couple weeks ago no deal as NuCamp is getting away from some of the on the line customization due to slowing the machine down. Your reasoning is similar to mine on the tires and the too close of clearance in my opinion is a definite negative for those tires. Are you saying of the total additional 3" of ground clearance on the 400 Boondock lite package that 1.77" comes from the tire and the axle only adds 1.23"??? I got the 3" by comparing a couple units on the lot.

At this point I am leaning toward changing the order to non Boondock and having them ship it with the aluminum tub. I think it would be real hard to drag the tail end going over rough or steep terrain, the real vulnerability is the sewer drain, that needs a skid plate or some such Boondock package or not.

falcon1970

@N7SHG_Ham. I ordered mine late in OCT and got the tub and pitched axle only.  No problem getting that.  I suspect nuCamp doesn't want to do any "one-of" custom stuff but the tub and axle is just a matter of scheduling the same parts they otherwise use.  I suspect your dealer has it wrong.  You might ask another dealer for his opinion.

N7SHG_Ham

@falcon1970 can you confirm my questions about additional clearance the axle alone adds? Best I can tell with a tape measure at the dealer the Boondock Lite adds about 3" of additional ground clearance. Trying to determine how much of that gain is due to the bigger tires and how much due to the Boondock axle.

Awca12a

Using a tire size calculator (link below), the height difference between a 205/75R15 and a 235 is the 1.77" quoted by N7SHG_Ham above.  There is indeed a 3" difference but only part of it comes from the Boondock axle. 

While considering the tires, note that I made an informational post to any Boondock Lite owners regarding the availability of the tires should there be an issue on the road.  Look-up "2019 T@B Boondock Tires: Rainier Apex ST235/R75" or click https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/8151/2019-t-b-boondock-tires-rainier-apex-st235-r75#latest

In researching the tires I realized I had no idea what kind of axle was actually on the Boondock.  Supposedly it's made by Dexter but when I went to get details on it to see if it's a Never-Lube bearing, I realized that any info tickers must be covered-up by the plastic cover.  I'd take off the wheel to look closer but as there is no publicized information for where or how to place a jack, nor any obvious place to do so, I'm stuck there too.  

In short, while I have a Boondock Lite and I ordered it because of the ground clearance, it seems that part comes from the tire and part from the axle.  I did so because the axle is supposed to be stronger and even 1.25" is a help.   As to the tires rubbing the ABS, its pretty flexible and soft but just don't see them articulating that way.  If they do at any point, we can cut them back a smidge but it doesn't seem to be an issue.

In good time, this will all get sorted out.

Tire Size Calculator
https://www.tacomaworld.com/tirecalc?tires=205-75r15-235-75r15
 

Awca12a

As to the low point being the tank flush valves, it's actually the Fresh Water Tank Drain.  I've added this item on the "replacement parts" section of the manual because of its configuration.  Thinking of doing a metal valve as a PM measure but it's certainly the most exposed item on the bottom.

N7SHG_Ham

Thanks @Awca12a, I did see your other post about the tires. While you have noted a source, it is still a single source (and the only one I have found). What happens when that source dries up? It seems putting on a tire that is rare (for a trailer tire size) is shortsighted, I would prefer to go to Discount Tire, Goodyear, etc. and get a name brand tire in the size that came on the trailer at replacement time. (I plan on adding a hub odometer and it is specifically calibrated to tire size, so changing tire size later renders your hub meter inaccurate)

So it appears to me that at least on the 400's about the extra 3" of clearance can be contributed roughly equally to the axle and tire? I am not as worried about the fresh water drain as I am the dump valves, in part because going through a ditch, etc. the fresh water drain is closer to the axle and will rise as the tire walks over a ditch, curb, etc. Of course a tall rock, stump, etc. the tire misses could peel that right off! The sewer drains OTOH dip down as your tow vehicle crosses the ditch or a driveway curb cut for instance and stand a real chance of dragging.

The axles are indeed a Dexter easy lube variant and are nothing specific to NuCamp products as far as technology and design, they may be built to NuCamp specs as far as mounting, length and rise, etc. There are really about two companies that make ALL trailer axles, Dexter being one. I have a similar Dexter 3500 pound axle on a Wells Cargo that has been excellent for 30K miles. AFAIK the "stronger" axle may apply to the 320's or it may be marketing fluff, when you look at axle ratings between the regular and Boondock 400's, I don't think you will find a difference?

As far as jacking, I have jacked my WC on the frame and I suspect that is the best course of action on the Tab's also. Having said that, I bet a tire store is going to put a floor jack under each side of the axle and jack away. I looked in a few other brands forums and guess what? Trailer tire changing is a topic there just like here with no definitive answer except the axle manufacture says don't jack on the axle, LOL. I was also looking at something like this jack: https://www.amazon.com/SeaSense-Tons-Easy-Lift-Trailer/dp/B000FZ345S but of course that jacks on the axle and apparently must sell or it wouldn't be multiple places on the internet...

Awca12a

You make great points especially noting that the sewer drain is more likely to be damaged because it's in front.  The spare tire is directly in front but off to the side so it comes back to gaining every inch you can.   Since I can't carry a spare for the sewer, I'm focusing on the 80/20 and hardening the points I can.

As for the trailer tires, while I'm concerned about having to replace them due to a sidewall issue, the reality is that you rarely need to do so.  Moreover, a simple fix is to replace the spare 205 tire with a new 235 tire and call it a day.  That's probably the route I'm going to take once I get a definitive answer, in writing, from nuCAMP on where and how to jack so I don't void the frame or axle warranty.  It's just an oversight on their part which should get sorted out once they come back to the office.  These Boondocks are new so the questions will bounce around till the right person sees them.

My worst case would be to replace both tires with a Goodyear or equal 225 should we be somewhere remote and can't figure out the 235.    The focus on knowing what we have, and where to replace parts, is to eliminate the frustration and time waste when in the field with no WiFi on a Holiday weekend Saturday afternoon in the rain.   

falcon1970

My concern with ground clearance was really only with getting the trailer over a steep rise in a driveway apron.  But reading all above about hitting a pothole and scraping the drains off came with an epiphany.  Just a few days ago I drove through a low water crossing which was (as you would expect) full of water.  At least enough to hide the road surface.  I eased through it and sure enough, it was hiding a deep pothole!  It was so deep I scraped the frame on my F-250.  Had I had my 400 in tow it would surely have gotten hung up--if not worse.

N7SHG_Ham

Official word from factory today is the Boondock Lite package adds a whole 1" extra ground clearance. I thought it was closer to 3". Also confirmed today for the 2nd time that it is NO LONGER possible to add Boondock axle without getting the Boondock package. I am leaning strongly toward dropping the Boondock off my order and just swap the tubs.

Awca12a

The combined 3” is worth the tire difficulty issue to me.   New buyers just need to be aware and nuCAMP should offer a full size spare option. 

N7SHG_Ham

I wished NuCamp published the additional clearance specs, I kinda measured about 3" sitting on the lot at a dealer, BUT my dealer was told by his NuCamp rep yesterday that they consider it a 1" gain. If so, even more of a gimmick than I had previously thought. Aluminum tub is nice

cafyrman

N7SHG_Ham said:

Official word from factory today is the Boondock Lite package adds a whole 1" extra ground clearance. I thought it was closer to 3". Also confirmed today for the 2nd time that it is NO LONGER possible to add Boondock axle without getting the Boondock package. I am leaning strongly toward dropping the Boondock off my order and just swap the tubs.

The difference in just the tires is roughly 1.7 inches.  And there's a different axle. The axle would have to reduce clearance to only have 1" total clearance.  I'm not sure that makes sense.

I bought a 400 off of the floor without the Boondock package.  Intent is to change the axle and upgrade the tires. There aren't a lot of trailer tires in 235, but there are a ton in 225.  That said, there are many, many tires available in a 235.  I'm sure some would be plenty good for a light trailer.  If you want the Boondock look, the Goodyear Wrangler Duratrac looks similar.  If you were to get stuck with a flat, you'd probably have better luck finding a 235 LT tire on the road than a 225 ST tire.  My TV is pretty big, so I'm debating just buying a set of 4 tires and wheels and keeping one on the trailer and one in the TV.

N7SHG_Ham

@cafyrman I did find published that the Boondock is 2.25" higher, so that 1" the factory rep reported seems to be in error.

Bayliss

@Awca12a and @N7SHG_Ham , although your discussion references the 400,  I was curious about the distance between the fender skirt and the tires on my 320 S Boondock Lite.  Although the fender skirt wraps slightly around the front and rear sidewalls of the tire, the passenger side clearance between the tire sidewall and fender skirt is 1" at the front and 1 1/2" at the rear; on the driver side it is 1 1/2" at the front and 1 3/4" at the rear of that tire.  Although it is close, I don't think it will be a problem on a bumpy roadway, especially since there is sufficient clearance between the wheel well and top of the tire.  I have included photos for anyone who is interested.

In comparing my Boondock Lite to the standard 2019 T@B 320 S models I saw at the dealer lot, I would say that the additional ground clearance is closer to the 3" additional clearance you have discussed.  Mine is definitely more than 1" higher, but the 400 and 320 S may be slightly different in clearance.