The Alde/Glycol Dilema

mandt
mandt Member Posts: 158
in Heating/Plumbing & Winterizing
I have a 2016 Tab 320 and have used the Alde just a very few times.
Does the amount of use have anything to do with the need to replace the glycol?
Should I automatically replace the glycol after 2 years or should I somehow do a ph test to see if there is a problem?
Has anyone made a detailed youtube video showing the process?

Thanks
Mickey & Terri
2016 Max S
Kalamazoo Michigan
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  • rajamar
    rajamar Member Posts: 112
    edited October 2018
    mandt said:
    ...
    Does the amount of use have anything to do with the need to replace the glycol?
    Should I automatically replace the glycol after 2 years or should I somehow do a ph test to see if there is a problem?
    ...

    Thanks
    Please see @dhauf explanation at bottom of this thread:
    https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/comment/104373#Comment_104373

    Regarding glycol replacement: the manual States it should be done every two years to maintain anticorrosion properties. (But it doesn't tell you how.) Manual is here:
    https://us.v-cdn.net/5021717/uploads/editor/iz/x9ylh4kf7fz5.pdf 



    2016 T@B S - TV 2004 Toyota Sienna
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  • BrianZ
    BrianZ Member Posts: 1,772
    Great question, @mandt!
    I hope there is/will be a good solid answer that doesn't involve driving to a dealer in another state or renting/shipping a pump from/to NüCamp.  This should be a DIY operation with a written procedure available to do it with any needed tools available for purchase at a reasonable price.

    -Brian in Chester, Virginia
    TV: 2005 Toyota Sienna LE (3.3L V6)
    RV: 2018 T@B 320S, >100 mods 
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  • mandt
    mandt Member Posts: 158
    It would be helpful if there was a library of YouTube instructional videos for learning how to mantience and use our trailers. 
    Mickey & Terri
    2016 Max S
    Kalamazoo Michigan
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  • jkjenn
    jkjenn Member Posts: 6,423
    edited October 2018
    See this thread. It can be done at home.

    https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/2360/anyone-attempted-a-glycol-exchange-on-alde/p1

    2021 T@b 320 Boondock "Mattie Ross" | 2021 T@b Nights: 239 | Total nights in a T@b 455 | 2022 Jeep Grand Cherokee L Overland | T@b owner since 2014

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  • kaylevine1
    kaylevine1 Member Posts: 165
    Travels with Delaney has some useful videos in a series called take 5-specific to the t@b 400 systems
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  • Dalehelman
    Dalehelman Member Posts: 2,414
    We have a 2015. I recently checked the ph level with test strips. It tested exactly the same as the new fluid I had on hand. As a result I am not planning on changing it at this time.
    1. Hash  T@B Fun
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  • ChanW
    ChanW Member Posts: 3,165
    You can also get a 'precise' reading on the freeze protection by checking the specific gravity. Don't use a normal ethylene glycol tester however, because propylene glycol reads differently.
    This refractometer is the one I use:
    https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00JA6LGYY/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage
    Chan  -  near Buffalo NY
    2014 S Maxx
    2011 Tacoma 4cyl ... edit: 2022 Tacoma 6cyl - oh yeah! 

     A_Little_T@b'll_Do_Ya
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  • ScottG
    ScottG Administrator Posts: 5,669
    Do the pH or specific gravity tell you anything about the anti-corrosion properties? It seems that's the driving force for the frequent changes.
    2015 T@B Max S (320)
    2015 Nissan Frontier SV V6 4x4
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  • ChanW
    ChanW Member Posts: 3,165
    edited October 2018
    From what I'd read, I figured the pH test ought to tell you about the anti corrosion. Off the top of my head, I think the problem is that antifreeze becomes more acidic as it ages. Someone smarter should pipe in here.
    ScottG said:
    Do the pH or specific gravity tell you anything about the anti-corrosion properties? It seems that's the driving force for the frequent changes.

    Chan  -  near Buffalo NY
    2014 S Maxx
    2011 Tacoma 4cyl ... edit: 2022 Tacoma 6cyl - oh yeah! 

     A_Little_T@b'll_Do_Ya
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  • ScottG
    ScottG Administrator Posts: 5,669
    Sounds good to me. Does anybody know what is the pH supposed to be?
    2015 T@B Max S (320)
    2015 Nissan Frontier SV V6 4x4
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  • ChanW
    ChanW Member Posts: 3,165
    edited January 2020
    I hunted around for this information last spring, when I changed my glycol. I can't tell you where I got the information other than digging through the web,  but this is what I found:

    Correct ph is between 9.5 and 10.5 (lower is more acidic) - below 9 is too low
    Can test with volt meter: 
    - set it at 20vDC, 
    - ground one probe and put other into coolant. 
    - multiple references said should be <.3v 
    - another said should read .01-.05v & .07v is too acidic. (I think <.3 is correct)

    Do not use a hydrometer for propylene glycol. (a 100% solution reads the same as a 40% solution)
    ScottG said:
    Sounds good to me. Does anybody know what is the pH supposed to be?

    Chan  -  near Buffalo NY
    2014 S Maxx
    2011 Tacoma 4cyl ... edit: 2022 Tacoma 6cyl - oh yeah! 

     A_Little_T@b'll_Do_Ya
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  • ScottG
    ScottG Administrator Posts: 5,669
    edited October 2018
    Thanks, @ChanW!
    Should the first line say "below 9.5 is too low"?
    2015 T@B Max S (320)
    2015 Nissan Frontier SV V6 4x4
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  • Dalehelman
    Dalehelman Member Posts: 2,414
    That’s why I tested my strips first in a fresh unused sample. There seemed to be no need to change the fluid if measured the same ph acidity level as new.
    1. Hash  T@B Fun
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  • ScottG
    ScottG Administrator Posts: 5,669
    I agree with you @Dalehelman, I was just hoping I could test mine without having a fresh bottle for reference.
    Like you, I have a 2015 and have never changed the glycol. I'll do it if I really need to, but I'd like to be convinced of that before going through the trouble!
    2015 T@B Max S (320)
    2015 Nissan Frontier SV V6 4x4
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  • ChanW
    ChanW Member Posts: 3,165
    Good question @ScottG! My notes are clear as my coffee (mud)! I think the info I was finding corresponds to my notes... Not very convincing.

    This spring, i think ours tested a little off (a year older than yours?), so I changed the glycol.

    ScottG said:
    Thanks, @ChanW!
    Should the first line say "below 9.5 is too low"?



    Chan  -  near Buffalo NY
    2014 S Maxx
    2011 Tacoma 4cyl ... edit: 2022 Tacoma 6cyl - oh yeah! 

     A_Little_T@b'll_Do_Ya
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  • lkc001
    lkc001 Member Posts: 877
    Did you do a step-by-step post on how to change out the glycol?  That would be great if you did =)
    2018 Tab 400
    2016 Nissan Frontier SV 4x4 Crew Cab
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  • ChanW
    ChanW Member Posts: 3,165
    edited November 2018
    @lkc001, best I can remember....
    1. Drained the glycol.
    2. Tipped the Tab every which way until no more glycol came out
    3. Added clean distilled water to rinse system of old glycol
    4. Drained distilled water
    5. Return to step 3 & repeat until distilled water drains clear
    6. Refilled the glycol - used 100% glycol, not premixed, to be able to adjust % with water
    7. Tipped the Tab every which way with the Alde pump running to bring air out
    8. Opened the bleeder screw now and again to release trapped air
    9. Topped off the glycol reservoir
    10. Return to step 7 & repeat until no more room to top off.
    11. Ran the Alde pump for days, then checked the freeze protection, adding more 100% glycol if necessary, to adjust % to correct solution
    Needless to say, it was not very scientifically done. (And it wasn't done right, according to Alde)

    As I said in another thread, I did measure what came out, and it wasn't enough. There is one loop of the heating system that just won't drain easily. Maybe if I turned the Tab upside-down a couple of times...  B)

    As I also said in that previous thread, I don't recommend you follow my example here. I think a pump is necessary, unless you're willing to put another drain port in the system to be able to fully drain it.

    HTH! 😉  ;)
    Chan  -  near Buffalo NY
    2014 S Maxx
    2011 Tacoma 4cyl ... edit: 2022 Tacoma 6cyl - oh yeah! 

     A_Little_T@b'll_Do_Ya
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  • N7SHG_Ham
    N7SHG_Ham Member Posts: 1,261
    Found info at DOW Chemical re propylene glycol

    https://dowac.custhelp.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/7485/~/propylene-glycols---stability-&-storage

    I would think chemically all  propylene glycol would all be similar even though DOW is a different brand. It looks like heat and oxygen can degrade the fluid over time and I suspect the reason for the frequent change recommendation. The frequent change may also be an FDA requirement in USA too, there must be some Federal agency regulating the use in USA, as Europe is allowed to use ethylene glycol which is much more toxic to your health in case of cross contamination between the heating and domestic water cylinders in the Alde. Since they can use the toxic stuff in Europe there much be almost no chance of contamination or they would be sued out of business by now by anyone who has been poisoned.
    2019 T@B 400 Boondock Lite
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