TVehicule for a new Tab 400

Harolo · March 2020

Hi !
im a newbie ..I’m planning to buy a new 2020 Tab 400 and a new vehicule ....Im thinking to buy a VW Atlas cross sport 2020 V6 3.6L with a towing capacity of 5000 pounds...is it gonna be enough to tow my Tab 400 !

Thanks for your help!
Harold Boulanger :-) 🇺🇸🇨🇦🌈

dragonsdofly · March 2020

@Harolo, while on paper what you have stated looks ok, a rule for comfortable and SAFE towing is always have the tow vehicle MORE than adequate, not just barely adequate. You have also not included the tongue weight capacity of the vehicle you are looking at. Some of the previous t@b 400's are running at 500 lbs or over, when loaded. Would that max out your considered tv capacity? What is your payload capacity in your considered vehicle? Remember, you have to consider everything you put in your tv as part of the payload, people, equipment, gear, etc. Does that put you at or over the max capacity of your planned new vehicle? And, lastly, what type of terrain will you be towing in? Will you cross the Rockies, Sierra Nevada, and others? Will you tow in the desert southwest in the summer? Does your vehicle have a factory tow package? Does it include a 7 pin connector? Transmission cooler? Etc? There's a lot to consider. There's a lot to research. There's a lot of information on this forum to help you out. Do your research. Many will offer opinions (including me). Many will conflict. Some will agree. But it is up to you to become informed and make your own decision. Whatever you decide, will it ever put you or the folks out there on the road with you, in danger or jeopardy? Can the vehicle you are considering not only tow, but stop and control your trailer in an emergency? All to be thought about before you commit. Now that I've laid that on you, relax, it's all part of the journey to own your trailer, and all part of the adventure.

MuttonChops · March 2020

@Harolo; @dragonsdofly has listed several topics that should be considered and researched. On the plus side You Have Time to do the research.

A starting point might be to stop by your VW dealer and copy an Atlas VIN number down then visit the VW owners web-page and download the Owners manual (VIN required). See what the OM has on towing.

Might also review posting here or Message owners of other brand Mid-size SUV to hear how their towing experience is going. Of special interest might be how FWD vs AWD (VW 4-Motion) handle towing duty.

For myself, I would not purchase an Atlas T@B400 Combination . . . however, I live and travel in the western U.S. states and 66% of my TV miles are towing my T@B.

Atlas max tow rating: 5,000#, that is at sealevel and with only a Driver & gasoline in Altas
Atlas max tongue weight: 500#, T@B400 will be in the 370 - 450# range
Frontal Area; typical mid-size SUV: 40 sq ft, T@B400 is 65 sq ft.

How important these numbers are really depends on your planned towing and safety margin comfort level.

Harolo · March 2020

Thanks for your advice! I will do my home work.

dlb · March 2020

Is the 3.6L turbocharged? That makes a difference going up hills and at any significant altitude. If it is, you have power. It is the stopping capability you need to be most concerned about, brakes or upgraded brakes. Definitely get in touch with the VW dealer and the forums on the vehicle.

dlb · March 2020

This is a good article on how tow ratings are determined. The video is worth watching.

https://www.roadandtrack.com/car-culture/a29339668/how-truck-tow-rating-is-calculated/

Harolo · March 2020

thanks for your help guys greatly appreciated it
Merci beaucoup!🇺🇸🇨🇦🌈

Denny16 · March 2020

Don’t forget the trailer frontal area that is above the TV air flow area, tow vehicles have a max sq.ft. rating for this also, as it crates drag on the TV.
cheers

N7SHG_Ham · March 2020

I seem to recall reading elsewhere that despite the Atlas being marketed as a TV (I have seen ads towing an Airstream), it seems to be a bit of a miss as a TV with a trailer of any size, especially that frontal area folks overlook. I believe there might of been someone in last year try it with a 400 and decide there was better options, but I can't find any info now.

On a personal note, I am a bit disappointed in the Atlas as I have a VW Jetta that has been very good, my boss drives a Toureag and is a fan and his wife has an Atlas, BUT they don't tow with it. I kind of thought about maybe my next TV when I retire instead of my dual function work pickup/Tab TV vehicle, but am on the fence.

EDIT to add I found a thread here where a member is towing a 400, BUT about maxed on hitch weight, some sag and VW does NOT recommend a WDH. So I guess it can be done, still would do more research before deciding.

https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/comment/132193#Comment_132193

jameskuzman · April 2020

@Harolo - I was part of the thread @N7SHG_Ham referenced above.

I have a 2019 AWD Atlas SE (the original version, not the Cross Sport). It has the factory tow package which gives it a 5,000 tow capacity with a 500 pound maximum tongue weight. All vehicles are different, even the same car in a different trim or option level, so please consult the sticker inside the driver's door for the vehicle you're considering.

I have an Excel worksheet that you might find handy that helps calculate this all out - drop me a private message here and I'll find a way to get it to you.

Here's how the numbers shook out for me. If you're not familiar with how the math works here, I strongly suggest you do a bit of research on your own, but I'll try to break things down a little as I go in the hopes of shedding light rather than adding to the confusion. Stay with me :-)

The GCWVR - the maximum the tow vehicle and trailer can weigh altogether - is 10,150.

The GVWR of the Atlas (the maxium weight it can carry, including itself, passengers, cargo, and tongue weight of trailer) is 6,019 pounds.

The curb weight is 4,500.

Typically your payload (the amount of people and stuff you can carry, including the trailer tongue weight) is the difference between these two, which would be 1,519 pounds. Often manufacturers list a specific payload rating that is different. Volkswagen did, and for my Atlas, that number is 1,113. Note the 406 pound difference here. That *suggests* that VW has included the weight of a driver and passenger in their calculations - some manufacturers do that, while others do not - so when we make our calculations, we'll want to run the math both ways since we don't know for sure if that was their method here.

My 2019 T@B 400 standard model weighs 2,700 pounds dry. Add 37 pounds for a full tank of propane, 250 pounds for a full fresh water tank and, allow another 100 pounds for "stuff" in the camper (we travel light), and the real weight comes out to around 3,100 pounds.

That puts me well under the 5,000 towing limit and well under the 10,150 GCVWR rating. So far, so good.

The published tongue weight on my 400 is 385 pounds. There is some speculation that NuCamp was a little light on quoting this figure, but for now, that's what we'll use. A full tank of propane brings that closer to 425. We're getting a little tight here - 85% of the allowable tongue weight - but we haven't exceeded it. Note that I haven't added anything to the tongue weight for the water, as the 400 is relatively short and the tanks are all located pretty much over the axel, resulting in a balanced front/rear weight distribution on the water regardless of what tank it happens to be in at any given time.

Now onto payload. The tongue weight counts as payload, as does any stuff you're carrying in the back of the Atlas. As I said, we travel light, so even with a 10x10 pop up tent, portable grill, a couple of chairs, charcoal, firewood, and a few tools, I'm adding maybe 100 pounds of extra weight on the high side. That brings my payload up to 550 pounds, so I'm 563 pounds under my payload capacity which gives me a little wiggle room to add another passenger or a bit more cargo to the Atlas, but not much. *This assumes VW has factored in a driver and passenger.*

If they have not, we'll need to add that weight back in as part of the payload. In my case, a driver and passenger combined adds 350 pounds. Now I'm within 213 pounds of my payload. Adding another passenger or any other cargo (including, say, a small generator) is pretty much out of the question. I'm maxed out.

Payload is where most tow vehicles max out first. Everyone looks at the tow weight rating and the tongue weight and forgets about payload, or doesn't understand that the tongue weight of the trailer and often the passenges count toward payload. Payload isn't just stuff in the bed of a truck (or the cargo area of an SUV).

For us, the Atlas works ok, but primarily because we travel light, we don't take extra passengers with us, and we aren't dealing with steep grades and hills here in Ohio like someone in the west might as our trips are limited to within a couple of hours of where we live.

The back end does sag a bit, enough to affect headlight alignment at night. The low beams turn into high beams and the high beams light up the trees. I'm planning to add a set of airbags to the rear coils to help lift it up. Please note that airbags do nothing to increase any rated capacity nor to they re-distribute weight.

Sway has not been an issue yet pulling the 400. It feels very stable at 60MPH (the fastest I care to go when towing). Volkswagen outright prohibits the use of a weight distribution hitch on the Atlas. The vehicle and hitch are not capable of withstanding the upward force a weight distribution hitch would apply.

In terms of power, the V6 in the Atlas is plenty powerful enough for me. This isn't a sports car. When pulling the 400, it never seems to struggle, though it will of course downshift more often even on small grades. Gas mileage gets cut in half, so instead of 24-25MPG on the highway, it's down to 12-13MPG when towing. That penalty is not unique to the Atlas; many tow vehicles burn twice as much fuel when towing. Despite its teardrop shape, the 400 presents a fairly substantial frontal area against the wind and isn't as "slippery" as you'd think.

To sum things up, I've very happy with the Atlas as a daily driver. It's well-appointed and comfortable. The 4Motion is great here in Ohio winters. The rear seat is huge. The third row seat can actually be used by adults. The cargo area is massive. The Cross Sport is smaller and lacks the third row, but it's no slouch in terms of rear cargo size either.

It is adequate for pulling the 400 in the way that we camp, but if I had to do it all over again, I would have gone for a 1/2 ton pickup configured for maximum towing and maximum payload to give us more wiggle room on both tongue weight and payload. It would also have set us up better down the road if we ever wanted to move to a larger or heavier camper.

Hope that helps some.

Jim

N7SHG_Ham · April 2020

Agree Jim, you can slice it anyway you want, but the safe recommended TV for a 400 is full size pickup, most other vehicles are just too close to max in one or more catagories.

Harolo · May 2020

Thanks Jim...I really appreciate it!

Cbusguy · May 2020

One thing that will forever impact my choice of tow vehicles was a random encounter with a young lady driving a Volkswagen. Along rt 77 in Virgina, Rocky gap I think, in a gas station completely melting down. The wife approached her. Seems the passats transmission went out and the closest service was Charlotte and the tow was going to cost big dollars and was a 4 hour drive in the wrong direction.

She ended up leaving her car at the gas station and catching a ride north with another couple.

GM, Ford, Chrysler are about all I will own in a tow vehicle. Every small town as a mechanic that can repair them and most NAPAs have the parts on the shelf. I can't imagine the tow bill in in the southwest to get somewhere they can repair an import.

Harolo · May 2020

Thanks,I finally boughtLast week a 2020 Toyota Tacoma off road 3,5 V6 and today yesss I finally bought my TAB 400 Boondock lite 2020 ...Very happy !

Harold

dragonsdofly · May 2020

@Harolo, congratulations on your trailer. Happy t@bbing! (When we're finally alliwed to, if course.)

Harolo · May 2020

Thanks!! My first trailer🇨🇦🇺🇸👍

AirBoss · May 2020

Wear it out, Son!

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