Do I have to do anything with Victron solar controller?

Captenaj

I brought my new 2021 Tab 320 S boondock home last week and, as I was reading the owners manuals, I discovered there was a solar controller and it had an app. Apparently there are things you can set in the app, one of which is the battery type. Do I have to set this? The app default is set to "Gel Victron deep discharge(2)" but I don't think my battery is a gel battery and there are 7 other batteries to choose from (see photos). Are there any other settings I should worry about? Thanks for any help.

   

trimtab

Captenaj, I am in the same situation that you are.....hopefully the educated here will help...

pthomas745

Your battery is the basic stock battery, an Interstate SRM-24.  It is a Group 24, 81 Amp Hour lead acid battery.

https://www.interstatebatteries.com/products/srm-24?productLine=marine&subcategoryKey=&ignorecategoryid=true

I am not sure if there are any "presets" on your app, for a lead acid battery, but I bet the settings will allow you to enter the 81 Amp Hours as the battery capacity.

And, an online manual that might help.

https://www.victronenergy.com/live/victronconnect:start

Captenaj

Thanks for the response. I will try to wade through the manual once things are a little more settled in life. A camping trip seems like the perfect time to go through something like that!

jschmier

Navigate over to AMsolar.com.  https://amsolar.com/rv-solar/support?rq=battery settings.  They are a VIctron dealer and have a lot of info under "DIY Instructions" which helped me.

jebjam

Did you sort out your settings? I have the same battery and am pretty sure the dealer didn't set a thing, I'd like to pair the Victron app with the lead acid battery correctly. Have boondocked twice with little more than the 2 way fridge running and ran out of juice on day 3 both times, on bright sunny Colorado days.  

After reading this post I made my own preset for the "Trojan Flooded" parameters on AMsolar's website, since this was the only lead acid battery listed.  But it doesn't list settings for all setting options, just absorption, float and equalization voltages.  There is no place to enter battery capacity or other settings that might play a role in charging efficiency?

Also, which load output operation mode did you select? (default is "always off").  I was going to choose battery life but my main interest is in keeping the battery charged when boon docking - given the battery's performance so far I expect to be replacing it before too many years anyway.

Thanks to all for your insights, its a bit of a muddle!

pthomas745

@jebjam I would go back to the manual and set up the battery for what they consider the "stock" parameters.  The stock battery you have (I have basically the same one) is not a "Trojan", and I don't think the 14.1 or any of their other settings make any sense for the Interstate.  Inside the Victron manual they show the pages for entering the battery capacities/etc. 

Your battery may be just fine, but the battery parameters set in your Victron may be giving you bad data.

What are you using the load terminals for?  Unless there is something plugged into them, there is no need to set anything up for them.

Show us a screen shot of your Victron.  There have been numerous reports of some very odd wiring setups, and there might be more to deal with than just the settings.  What are your solar panels showing you for output?

jebjam

Thanks for the help - I know just enough to be dangerous (you probably guessed that).

I reset the app to factory default but that confuses me as the default battery is "Gel Victron deep discharge (2)", and mine is a lead acid battery.  There is no lead acid preset option.  
I don't see any pages for entering battery capacities in the manual for the MPPT 75/10, this link shows the manual provided with the unit:
https://www.victronenergy.com/upload/documents/Manual-SmartSolar-charge-controller-MPPT-75-10-75-15-100-15-100-20-EN-NL-FR-DE-ES-SE.pdf. 
I see where you can set parameters if you have the battery monitor mentioned often on this forum (BMV 712), but that is an add-on not part of my unit from the factory I think, right?

Nothing is attached to the load terminals I believe - I've included a photo, think that's correct?

I've included screenshots of the home page and settings page. (The sun is up but not yet shining on the solar panels, will be in an hour...).  Max Solar output I've seen on a completely sunny day is around 62 W, I believe the panel on the 2021's is a 105 W panel.

The battery charges, but even with day long sunshine the alde system (just heating water) and fridge drained the battery enough that lights went off at night and the aide shut off on day 3. I know its not a great battery and upgrading will help, but I'm disappointed that I can't get 4 days boon docking in bright sunshine, hence my search for setting changes.
Thanks, you guys are great.



 

jebjam

One more thing...

Sun is up, here's the screenshot with current settings, indirect sun.
I also included the history of what concerns me - 12 days ago our T@B was connected to AC the day before our trip.  Day 11 was our first day camping, 10 and 9 obviously the next two.  
Despite being attached to AC max. battery charge was 12.73 volts.  We drove 2 hours to our site and boondocked the next three days.  Even with nothing on but Alde and the 2 way fridge and a day of sunshine, the battery drained to 11.23 V first day, 6.31 the second.  Just seems this shouldn't be happening?

pthomas745

I found this page which I found a good translation of the whole setup.  What this blog says is in the Battery Preset area, change the drop-down from "Factory Default" to "User Defined."

Hopefully, this will allow you to manually enter your battery parameters: 

https://faroutride.com/victron-review/

I have the 712, and it does not have that same "Settings" menu.  I hope this can get  you back on track, because it certainly seems your solar is working.

What do you mean by "the lights went off" and "the Alde shut off?"

jebjam

Thanks pThomas.  This link seems to work for the battery monitor (the 712) but the settings menu is different for the MPPT 75/10, there is a drop down menu for "user defined", but referring back to my original post, that only allows for setting "absorption voltage, float voltage, equalization voltage and equalization (automatic or manual) as well as temperature compensation". There is nothing for entering battery parameters like amp hours and such.  I guess this is my quandary, the factory default is for a gel battery, there is no default for lead acid.

To answer your last question, there wasn't enough battery power to run anything at the end of the day - the Alde system requires a minimum number of volts and the battery dropped below that and it shut down, camper lights wouldn't come on.  I know this is bad for the battery and was unintentional, unexpected.  I just feel like a day of sunshine should prevent all this from happening.  The Solar is charging, but either I've got a bad "new" battery or the T@B's draw running essential components exceeds what the solar panel can replace on a normal sunny day.

Sharon_is_SAM

@jebjam - Your battery only has about 70 Ah (140 reserve capacity divided in half).  You have 35 usable amps daily before you start abusing the battery.   The 60 - 70 watts for a 100 watt panel Is about right, so about 5-6 amps/peak sun hour.  So figure 5-6 peak sun hours In Colorado and you are generating about 25 - 35 Ahr/day.  

I know the Alde control panel uses very little Ahr.  The CS Norcold at half duty will take around 48 Ahr/day and then there is phantom drain of maybe 5 Ahr per day.  So, say you use at least 50 Ahr per day and you offset that with only 25 - 35 Ahr.  So, every morning you already start out behind.  The answer is either adding more solar and/or increasing your battery capacity.  

jebjam

Thanks Sharon_is_SAM.  I appreciate your calculations and think they explain my situation.  I'll plan on a better battery setup next season.  It still seems the battery shouldn't have drained by end of the day (even before the next morning), I just wonder about the Victron app battery settings...

I'm disappointed my "Boondock" model can't actually do that for more than a day or two with the stock electrical system supplied.  I wish NuCamp somehow dictated to or supplied dealers with resources to install batteries adequate for the advertised task, as they do with the 400s.  (A different option would have been to use a 3 way fridge and let me run it on propane practically forever.  I like the pluses of a 2 way, but not at the cost of requiring AC power despite outfitting my unit with options I thought would allow camping off the grid).  

The combination of a 2 way fridge and an inadequate battery out the door seems a poor starting place for new owners.

Sharon_is_SAM

I think that the majority of owners routinely hook up to electric, so the stock battery is enough for most to get by.  The ability to use LPG via the 3 way frig has been attractive to those who planned on boondocking, but it has never been available on the CS.  

I would also keep an eye on your battery after running it so low.  They aren’t designed to recover as well as other batteries (AGM).  Start planning your battery conversion now.  I just saw a nice dual 6 v battery tray over at the Teardropshop.

Lastly, it won’t save you much, but turn off the Alde until you actually plan on showering.  Put some very frozen water bottles in the frig and take another cooler for those items that you frequently reach for (adult and non-adult beverages).  This may reduce the cycling of the frig and save some amps.  Pre-cool your frig before travel.

If you explore more solar, I would consider a 100 watt portable suitcase with 30 ft extensions.  You can then move the panel to optimize your peak solar hours.  It is an easy solution relative to adding another panel to the roof.

jebjam

Thanks Sharon, I appreciate all your insight and thoughtful advice all over this forum.

I will do all of this going forward.  I know the battery will suffer with this sort of use and I hate to shorten its life.  Planning to trash it next year I suppose will make me a little less obsessive.  Still...

Cheers.  I'm heading for the hills!

rh5555

We have a 400 with after-market solar, so cannot offer specific advise.  However, some things are true regardless of setup. 

1. When your panel gets partially shaded, its ability to provide power drops to almost zero.  Unfortunately, you don't get half the output if half the panel is shaded, it's more like 10% of the output if 10% of the panel is shaded.  In your screenshot, you show a generation of only 13W.  That isn't even keeping up with the fridge, let alone recharging the battery.  So you need to park in full sun with as little shade as possible to get the most out of your solar system.
2. The solar controller only starts working in the morning when the photo voltage from the panel exceeds the battery voltage by 5V.  Once it starts working, it will continue to work with a voltage difference of only 1V.  The 5V start requirement can delay your hours of usable sunlight considerably.  So, if you can, orient the TAB so that it gets full, unobstructed sunlight in the morning hours to kickstart the Victron into action.  (I have 2 panels which I wire in series to avoid this problem).
   

So with some extra thought on parking your TAB, you may be able to get enough solar power to stay ahead of the game.  I know that we want to park in the shade, but the panels need unobstructed sunshine to work.  Mutually exclusive.  This is why suitcase solar panels are so popular:  Park in the shade, setup panels in the sun.

Denny16

@jebjam, your MPPT appears to be wired correctly, and as Sharon pointed out, you are using more battery energy than the solar setup can replace.  

For boondocking more than 2-3 days, you need to increase your battery supply.  A move to Lithium would be good, more power per cubic inch of battery, and you have more useable energy available, a 100 watt lithium would be the same approximate size as your current battery, but give you 80 amps of useable power vs 35 amps you currently have.  

Your other option is a larger AGM battery, like two 100 amp 6-volt batteries wired in series to get 12VDC, or a 100 -125 amp 12VDC AGM batrery whichnwould need more space, and add more weight up front.

We have a 200amp AGM battery running Alde 12 VDC whilst it runs on propane. A 2-way fridge on 12 VDC and occasional lights, and we only get about 4-5 days if solar is not getting full sun, which 194 watt roof solar panels.  We are adding two 100 watt suitcase portable solar panels to help keep more sun on the charging side.  So no way is a 70amp battery on 100 watt solar going to keep up with load.
cheers

JPRoland

Thank you all, once again! I was having trouble understanding my solar system on our new 2021 320S Boondock. In fact, I thought maybe it was not even operating. Downloading the App: victronconnect was a game-changer. I am, so thankful for this site. Everyone who owns an RV with a Victron solar system must have this App on heir smartphone.

MarkAl

This has been said before but having just re-mounted my two 6V in the tub due to poor mounting by the dealer. They are annoyingly heavy. I knew this going in but I did not want to learn tow and trailer energy management with an expensive lithium battery. BUT after this learning experience - my next battery will be lithium for space and weight (with updated charger). I won't hook it to the tow vehicle's power as I don't want to deal with the minor mixed chemistry battery issues. With the factory mounted solar panel it's rare during travel I don't cover the day use power needs of the trailer.