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Question about tow vehicle and inverter

DalehelmanDalehelman Member Posts: 2,410
edited June 2020 in Battery/Electrical & Solar
If I install 2000 watt inverter directly to my tow vehicles battery. With the engine running at idle. How many watts Of useable power might I expect? In other words can the alternator keep up with the power drain. Or will the battery slowly be drawn down. Will increasing rpm reduce or neutralize power drain?
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  • DalehelmanDalehelman Member Posts: 2,410
    Where is @MuttonChops when I need him?
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  • VernaVerna Member Posts: 6,878
    Asleep!  @Dalehelman as many times as you have helped me and I feel bad I can’t help you on this one!  Sorry!
    Verna, Columbus, IN
    2021 T@B 320S  Boondock “The T@B”
    Towed by a white 2019 Ford F-150 4x4 Supercab, 3.5L V6 Ecoboost “The Truck”
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  • MuttonChopsMuttonChops Member Posts: 1,710
    Dalehelman said:
    Where is @MuttonChops when I need him?

    LOL :)
    Dalehelman said:
    If I install 2000 watt inverter directly to my tow vehicles battery. With the engine running at idle. How many watts Of useable power might I expect? In other words can the alternator keep up with the power drain. Or will the battery slowly be drawn down. Will increasing rpm reduce or neutralize power drain?

    Not an expert here.  A few items to consider.
    a) Many Inverter user manuals use a simple divide by 10 rule to determine input 12VDC Amps requirement.  So at maximum steady 2000W output your inverter will need 200 Amps DC from battery/alternator.

    b)  Car Alternator sites note industry standard alternator output is rated at 6,000 RPM.  With research you might be able to find the "IL" rating (low test speed, idle).  One article I've read suggests that IL can be 40% or so of maximum rating.  So if your TV had a 200A Alternator, at idle it's output may only be 80 Amps and much/most of that 80 Amps would be going to charge TV battery and run TV electrical load.

    c) Most TV trailer battery+ feed lines are fused at 30 Amps.  So if we use 30 Amps as available at idle . . . an inverter will produce between 250-400 Watts depending on TV voltage level and inverter losses.

    With an inverter rated at 2000W it would be easy to overload the alternator which would quickly drain TV battery, might damage alternator.

    2000W Inverters are intended to be used with high AH capacity Battery Banks not direct alternator output voltage/current.

    What are you trying to achieve ?
    '18 320 S,  pitched axle, 3020HE; PNW based
    TV: '17 Colorado V6 Z71 4x4, Tow Package, GM Brake Controller
    Adventures:  54   Nights:  341  Towing Miles 43,780
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  • GatorEggGatorEgg Member Posts: 482
    The simple answer is no.  But it will take a lot of research on your part.  Beginning about 2008 manufacturers began installing “smart” alternators.  They won’t even keep up with the amp need of the three-way refrigerator.  But some manufacturers have built inverter ports into their vehicles. My Tacoma having one in its bed, rated at 400w.
    2022 TAB 400 Boondock, 2019 Toyota Tacoma Sport 4x4
    2018 TAB 320 Boondock (previous)
    Odessa, Fl.  

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  • DalehelmanDalehelman Member Posts: 2,410
    @Verna No problem. How are you fairing during this wacky time? Do you have plans to be in Arizona anytime this winter.
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  • DalehelmanDalehelman Member Posts: 2,410

    @MuttonChops to the rescue. Thanks for the information. It was very helpful. Your the best when it comes to technical information. Just trying to see the TV and an inverter could be used to make coffee or run an induction plate with the engine idling. Since my TV is much quieter in the morning than a generator.
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  • DalehelmanDalehelman Member Posts: 2,410
    @GatorEgg you’re correct I do have an inverter port I forgot about it. I am not sure what it is rated at I will have to check. It probably only  about 400 at best though. Thanks for the reminder.
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  • MuttonChopsMuttonChops Member Posts: 1,710
    While not what you want expect you'll find
    propane stove, percolator pot, and frying pan
    works great, is quiet enough, and requires no installation or risk
    '18 320 S,  pitched axle, 3020HE; PNW based
    TV: '17 Colorado V6 Z71 4x4, Tow Package, GM Brake Controller
    Adventures:  54   Nights:  341  Towing Miles 43,780
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  • VernaVerna Member Posts: 6,878
    Dalehelman said:
    @Verna No problem. How are you fairing during this wacky time? Do you have plans to be in Arizona anytime this winter.
    Hey, @Dalehelman, I’m doing fine. Doing mods in my new home, so I’ve kept busy. No plans to go to Arizona this next winter unless I win a lottery (gotta buy tickets to win😂) and then put solar panels on the house so it can hum along without me😂
    Verna, Columbus, IN
    2021 T@B 320S  Boondock “The T@B”
    Towed by a white 2019 Ford F-150 4x4 Supercab, 3.5L V6 Ecoboost “The Truck”
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  • DalehelmanDalehelman Member Posts: 2,410
    edited June 2020
    MuttonChops said:
    While not what you want expect you'll find
    propane stove, percolator pot, and frying pan
    works great, is quiet enough, and requires no installation or risk
    Cooking with propane. Sounds a lot like camping. I count on you for a high tech Solution.
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  • Denny16Denny16 Member Posts: 5,431
    No, it’s Glamping, camping is cooking on or over a wood fire!  ;)
    cheers
    2018 TaB400 Custom Boondock,  Jeep Gladiator truck, Northern California Coast.
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  • TampakayakerTampakayaker Member Posts: 554
    Dalehelman said:
    If I install 2000 watt inverter directly to my tow vehicles battery. With the engine running at idle. How many watts Of useable power might I expect? In other words can the alternator keep up with the power drain. Or will the battery slowly be drawn down. Will increasing rpm reduce or neutralize power drain?
    The new 2021 F-150s will have a built in generator as an option.

    Three different onboard generator systems are available. F-150s with conventional non-hybrid drivetrains get a 2.0-kW system, while hybrid trucks get upgraded to 2.4 kW or, optionally, a massive 7.2 kW of power, made possible by the hybrid's 48-volt lithium-ion battery pack. Ford claims that the top-spec 7.2-kW system can power a plasma cutter, TiG welder, chop saw, air compressor, angle grinder, and work light, simultaneously. That mobile welding shop can run for 32 hours continuously on a full tank, making all-day, heavy-duty work possible. If you don't need that much wattage, Ford says the 2.4-kW system can run a jackhammer or a mobile theater setup complete with a projector, loudspeakers, and popcorn machine for up to 85 hours.
    2006 RAM 1500 4 door, 2016 T@B 320 MAX S 
    Tampa FL
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  • DougHDougH Member Posts: 1,110
    @Tampakayaker : Hmmmm, my heart was set on a diesel Gladiator, but you've just converted me to PHEV Ford.
    2021 Jeep Gladiator, 2021 tiny toy hauler, Austin TX
    Former steward of a 2017 T@B S Max

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  • TampakayakerTampakayaker Member Posts: 554
    DougH said:
    @Tampakayaker : Hmmmm, my heart was set on a diesel Gladiator, but you've just converted me to PHEV Ford.
    But from what I've read, the truck engine needs to be running.

    Here's a link with a lot of amazing information about the systems

    https://news.pickuptrucks.com/2020/06/5-fun-facts-about-the-2021-f-150s-onboard-generator.html
    2006 RAM 1500 4 door, 2016 T@B 320 MAX S 
    Tampa FL
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  • Tundra57Tundra57 Member Posts: 640
    A 2.5kva generator will require 200Amps from 12v to keep up.
    I find it hard to believe the truck alternator can provide this at idle speed. If it cannot, then you will slowly be draining the truck battery. You could be left  dead on the road.
    2.5kva would be around 20 amps at 120v ac or 10Amps at 240v ac.
    Maybe a whisper quiet 2kva generator would be better. Quieter than running the truck with no worries of draining the battery. Also you can drive off and leave the genny running the camper.
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  • YanniLazarusYanniLazarus Member Posts: 362
    Related question,  as best as I can tell... I have a 2020 320 with two 6v agm batteries and the factory installed "unsmart" charger.   I have a Noco Genius charger which I use to top up and maintain my charge.   I'm comfortable for three days or so of boondocking,  but am looking for the rare emergency charge back up if I'm out longer.  Will it work to plug my Noco into my Rav4 adventure inverter and run my car to charge?  Is my alternator too smart or too slow to do the job through my 7pin?
    Yanni Lazarus 2020 T@B320S, 2018 RAV4 Adventure, Central CT
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