First time winterizing wish me luck (2020 320S BD)

jules2go

Thank you everyone for posting about their winterizing tips and experiences. I'm headed out to pick up my RV antifreeze, waiting for today's delivery of a the Camco hand pump kit for getting it where it needs to be, and have a Camco blow out plug which I hope is the correct one. I'm using the manual posted on this forum (the 2016 version which appears to be the newest one of the four). I'm most likely going to end up with questions very soon, so I'll be back here to post them and hopefully that might help others, too. 

We have 3 days with nighttime temps at or below freezing, then I'll dewinterize for a little jaunt down to the SC coast for some beach time, hooray hooray!! 

jules2go

Already have a question. (I'm looking for the first time at all the pipes and valves and there is quite a lot going on down in that section of the camper, it's not as "clean" looking as in the diagrams, just fyi for those (like me) who have never pulled the cushions back to look at this stuff, or at least it's been awhile. There are lots of pipes and hoses everywhere.)

But onto my question -- is the hot water drain valve supposed to be in the closed position for both camping and winterized modes? Mine appears to be closed and I haven't winterized yet. The two diagram photos that show camping and winterized positions makes it confusing because in the photo on the left it looks kind of like it's closed, with the lever at 6:00, and in the pic on the right it's also closed but in the 12:00 position; either way both are closed. I'm thinking these are just two different campers in these pics and one just happens to be at 12 and other at 6. Just want to be sure about that one. 

Verna

@jules2go, pictures are so helpful to us so we can see exactly what you are referring to. 

jules2go

@verna, it's from the photos in the top post in this section; there are 4 manuals shown, and I'm looking at the one that is the most recent S year model of the 4, the 2016. 

Verna

Sorry, @jules2go, I meant of your Camper’s setup. 

jules2go

Verna, I think I've sorted out that question, was a minor one. 

So far I've drained the kitchen faucet, the shower head/hose, toilet, outside water hose. Black and grey are empty. 

In this video in link below from nucamp, Creed isn't mentioning anything about unscrewing the two hoses for the water pump in the wall behind the toilet. There is a mention elsewhere of opening them up and draining them "have a rag handy there will be water" -- yes indeed there is water coming out and way more than my rag can hold. I can't fit a bucket back in there. Is this step necessary? It's listed as a step in two different references, but NOT in Creed's video below. btw when I hit post comment the whole video displayed and this is likely a bigger file than this format desires and I don't know how to keep it from doing that. I can try and remove the https:// stuff?? 

www.youtube.com/watch?v=GiLc0nOQ4as&ab_channel=nuCampRV-TeardropTrailers%26TruckCampers

jules2go

Is blowing out the lines necessary if I'm going to use antifreeze? In Creed's video above, he doesn't mention anything out blowing out lines. I have all the stuff to blow out the lines and was going to do that, but would be nice to know. 

jules2go

On the directions on this forum under "To Drain" #4 -- where does the alde safety relief / drain valve actually drain to? It says to put a bucket under the drain and expect 2.5 gallons of water. Where does the bucket go?

Sharon_is_SAM

@jules, the hot and cold Alde drains as well as the Alde Safety/Relief Drain exit the floor of the TaB and end in a tube that you can see under the TaB.  If you look under the TaB behind the driver side wheel you will see the drain tubes.  The Alde Safety/Relief Drain corresponds to “D” in the bottom photo @jules2go.

4.  With the T@B level, place a bucket under the Alde Safety Relief/Drain Valve and open the valve (yellow flapper). Raise the tongue to fully drain the remainder of the tank. You should get about 2.5 gallons of water. Close valve when tank empties

tabiphile

jules2go said:

Is blowing out the lines necessary if I'm going to use antifreeze? In Creed's video above, he doesn't mention anything out blowing out lines. I have all the stuff to blow out the lines and was going to do that, but would be nice to know. 

If you run antifreeze through all of the lines (as you apparently have) then there is no need to blow the lines out. In fact, that would be counter productive. You should not need to disconnect any lines if you have pulled/pumped enough through. The anti-freeze will protect the lines, valves, tanks, pump from freezing to 50 or 75 below zero depending upon the brand you bought. The key is to make sure that you run each line until anti-freeze runs proud, flush the toilet until it runs pink, run the shower, sink etc. Pour it in the drains. Be sure to empty the tanks and don't be shy with the anti-freeze. A gallon should do it but use more if you wish.
Everyone seems to have a slightly different spin on this process..in simple terms you are either filling all of the lines and valves with a product that cannot freeze or you are removing anything that can freeze from the lines. The antifreeze is a bit more of a sure thing since there is no residual water or condensation that can find it's way to a low spot once you are done. Think about it, compressed air carries moisture.

jules2go

@Sharon_is_SAM thanks for that image. I didn't get any water out of the Alde hot water drain at all that I could tell, and did not realize until reading in this thread that I was supposed to open the cold water drain, too, which seems pretty stupid of me! Duh. (Actually, Creed's video only pointed to the hot water drain valve. I think is why I only opened that one.) I did find the clear plastic piece underneath and had a bucket there to catch the water... but there was no water coming out. I hardly used the hot water since I picked it up new in May 2020. Is that why there was no water coming out, or maybe it was because I only opened the hot water drain and not the cold, too? I can't even remember when I last did use the hot water. I've been showering at the campground bathrooms. 

jules2go

@tabiphile I put 3 gallons into the tank after trying only one gallon which didn't seem to be enough for the pump to pull up through the lines. Do you mean one gallon in total for the complete job, or one gallon to pour in to the drains after running through all the lines via the pump (with the majority into the fresh tank)?

jules2go

In hindsight this should have been a fast and easy job but I made it into a massive project. onward. 

webers3

I just winterized my 320 via the blow-out method (3rd season), it took less than 15 minutes. I don't have to de-winterize so I am ready to go camping on moment's notice.

jules2go

@webers3 Thanks for your thoughts here. I like to go out on a moments notice as well, all year round. 

tabiphile

jules2go said:

@tabiphile I put 3 gallons into the tank after trying only one gallon which didn't seem to be enough for the pump to pull up through the lines. Do you mean one gallon in total for the complete job, or one gallon to pour in to the drains after running through all the lines via the pump (with the majority into the fresh tank)?

You should not need to put anything in your tank. You should drain the water heater and drain the tank. Make sure they are shut off. Then, what you want to do is pull the AF directly from the jug with your pump and the use it to freezeproof the lines. All you need for that is a pump converter kit that allows you to pull from the jug (with the pump) and bypass the tank. You put a tube in the jug, turn on the pump and then open each faucet and run it until the AF runs. It won't take much to do this. Flush the toilet until AF runs through. Pour some in each drain. Empty your tanks (because they are filled with the water) and then finish by closing the tanks and pouring a bit more AF into the traps. A gallon will do it. Once you have the converter kit installed it will literally take you less than 5 minutes to winterize.  

jules2go

@tabiphile One day I hope all of this will gel in my brain and I'll look back and think omg why was I so confused. I actually do have that Camco hand pump kit and used it, it worked great, but I pumped the AF straight into the fresh tank, then turned on the pump and flushed everything. So you're saying not to put it into the fresh tank at all? then where would I put it. I don't get it. Thank you for replying. 

tabiphile

@jules2go....OK...not quite the same....the idea is to pull directly from the jug without running the antifreeze into your holding tank. To do that you plum a bypass valve into your system and use it to bypass the tank when you winterize. Here is a typical kit that you might find that does this for you. Install and leave it in place YoY so that you can do this job quickly and effortlessly. https://www.campingworld.com/pump-converter-winterizer-kit-6279.html?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIgZzbtI_k7AIVUODICh20yQ1AEAQYAiABEgIyq_D_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

Here is a (somewhat droll) video that explain both the method and the installation. It's not a tab but the idea of putting the valve in place to bypass the tank is explained. Once you have this setup you simply draw the AF through you lines using the pump. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BGm6TJ-_AUo

Mellow_Yellow

@jules2go - thanks so much for this post. You helped me to find the courage to locate the Alde reservoir tank on my (new to me) 2014 T@B 320 S, discover that it is thankfully not empty, but that the fluid has not been replaced - ever. The service record is empty. Luckily, the previous owners hardly used it, but it has been running on 6+ year old glycol. I haven't taken it out on its maiden voyage yet, but needless to say, I'm not using the Alde until I drain and replace the fluid, hopefully this coming weekend!
Other useful posts:
https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/10140/alde-glycol-expansion-tank-locations-for-the-tab-320-clamshell-and-400-models
https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/12514/tips-for-reading-adding-glycol/p1
https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/12275/how-to-remove-alde-antifreeze-drain-plug
https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/comment/152671#Comment_152671

CrabTab

To add some info about the CAMCO 3-way valve/winterizing kit, here are some pictures.
First one shows the 3-way valve installed between the water filter and pump in our T@B.


The second picture shows the valve open and siphoning antifreeze through the plumbing lines. No antifreeze gets in the fresh water tank.


Hope this adds some clarity...

DougH

Added this last year and love how simple and fast  it makes it versus blowing the lines out. Downside is the cost of PG fluid and putting it back into the world. Not toxic, but just feels a little funny putting gallons of antifreeze into dumps everywhere. 

Sharon_is_SAM

@DougH - I read that so many owners blow out the lines and then run AF through the plumbing which is redundant in my book.  In a pinch you can justify the ease of using AF.

tabiphile

Sharon_is_SAM said:

@DougH - I read that so many owners blow out the lines and then run AF through the plumbing which is redundant in my book.  In a pinch you can justify the ease of using AF.

It kind of makes sense but it is definitely unnecessary. If you blow out the lines first and then follow with AF when the AF begins to flow from the lines you know that the lines are protected. If you don't blow the lines out first you must watch for the color of the AF to darken after the water in the lines is pushed through....some folks might not allow the AF to run long enough. That would have the effect of diluting the AF and raising the freeze point...But, it's not such a big deal....let it run until it's dark and then move on.... AF is cheap and even if you waste a lot of it a gallon or two is plenty....
There is piece of mind that comes from using AF. With air it is possible for water to be left in the lines/valves faucets and for condensation/moisture to develop in the lines while the unit is in winter storage...temps go up and down, condensation is not preventable. A few drops of water freezing in the right place can result in leaks and damage. There is zero risk of that if you use AF so that seems like the method that gives the most peace of mind if you must store in an unheated location. 

DawnS

Picking up our new T@B this morning, so excited. First time camper.   We are lucky that it will fit in our garage which stays warm enough.  But I intend to winter camp.  Should I winterise all with AF and just dry camp all winter?

dragonsdofly

@DawnS, after your walk through, have the dealer winterize the trailer. Then you can dry camp through the cold weather. I personally use the blow out method, but most dealers do not. If you have the dealer winterize before you leave the lot, you will have confidence knowing the winterization was done well, and can actually enjoy the trailer without worry. If you are picking up your trailer from a previous owner, after checking the operation of all systems, have the previous owner winterize with you. You will get hands on experience before you take possession. Either way, welcome to the forum, congratulations on your trailer, and most of all happy t@bbing!
 -Denise