Frankly its unbelievable that NuCamp builds a quality camper but just doesn't make it work better...

Dutch061

@Gherzig,

I am sorry and apologize if you feel that I am trying to defend NuCamp or be oblivious to the fact that they too have some issues. Without trying to type all of it again, the majority of their issues are related to supplier quality, although there are some assembly issues too. Much of this relates back to my first post where I mentioned the following "Unfortunately, due to the recent 2 plus years of the "pandemic", constant supply chain issues, substitutions, worker shortages (in all business nationwide)". 

Has there been more issues since Covid, I believe this is a safe statement and is driven by my previous statement regarding supply chain issues etc.  Anytime Standard Work Procedures (SOP) are not followed, they introduce an entire new level of problems. So, imagine that you build a product to the 75% completion level and have to pull it off line to wait for parts. Every time something like this happens, you add more opportunities for problems to arise that shouldn't have been there in the first place. Nearly anyone who has purchased a motor vehicle of any type, camper, appliances, etc. will be able to tell you that there have been more issues within the last 2.5 years on top of an extended period of waiting to get what they ordered. 

NuCamp (and all other manufacturers) should be driven with the "continuous improvement - zero defect goal" that has also been mentioned. Do they have the manpower to have someone monitor this forum 24 x 7, I doubt it. Would it be a good source of information? Yes, if it is properly filtered; meaning you have to be able to separate emotions from facts. There are a lot of posts that are driven by emotions (in my opinion). Without a doubt, the finished product should be able to be used without constant issues or always having to fix things. Some of this goes back to the dealership also in doing a proper "pre-delivery inspection".

In closing, I do believe that what I paid when we bought our 2020 400 BDL was a great value. If I were to look at buying one today at $50k plus, I may have to rethink it more.

Am I happy with our 400? Yes, extremely! Is it perfect? About as perfect as I am, meaning NO. But as I have mentioned many times, I have looked at other brands, and the obvious quality is way below what NuCamp builds for the price range.

Some of the brands I have looked at are Grand Design, Xplore RV, Black Series, Winnebago, and others. The only reason I would change would be to have more room than what we have in our 400. The main thing that I would like to have larger is the refrigerator, because we have the smaller compressor refrigerator. After having 3 campers previously with 3-way refrigerators, I can easily tell you that owning a camper with another absorption refrigerator is a showstopper. I simply won't buy one with a 3-way refrigerator. So, that removes Black Series before I even look at them closely. So, in reality to invest less than $1k in a compressor cooler (many brands to choose from) makes way more sense than anything else. Which is likely exactly what we will do, along with making a couple more changes to the way we camp-travel. 

Safe travels,

Brad

P.S. It is always less expensive to keep your current customer base than have to seek new customers, but you know that too 

Denny16

“This forum is an excellent resource for NuCamp in providing them with that information and I am sure they appreciate that.  We shouldn't get defensive or make anyone feel wrong for pointing out weaknesses.  It is in NuCamp's, and our, best interest.” 

Well put Gherzig.
 Cheers 

Gherzig

It is helpful to be reminded that there are options requiring less maintenance and mechanical know-how than a T@b.  
Happy Fathers' Day to all the dads out there.

manyman297

I feel like my relationship with Nucamp is like the coach who is really hard on that one player because he knows what he’s capable of but keeps seeing him make the same mistakes. 

Nucamp is by all accounts the best in the business. But when I see things related to assembly (like with our trailer) it’s so frustrating because those problems are so easily avoided. Their lack of QC with our trailer cost them 2k+ easily once you factor in shipping replacement parts, communication, and cash reimbursements we received for warranty work I performed. That’s a lot of money on one unit. 

Passport

If NuCamp would take all the "little solutions and problems" encountered by owners and put it in a little book, they could make a fortune in sales.  Some things we encounter like the failure of the a/c to work, lack of hot water or other simple things that we communicate about on this forum.  It might even save them some money on warranty work because they could guide us through the repair ourselves and we wouldn't have to take the T@B to a dealer a couple of hundred miles away.
But I guess it's wishful thinking because they couldn't possibly cover everything.  

Denny16

I think part of the issue is just as much to do with the dealers.  When a TaB is delivered to the dealer, it should be checked out, and detailed ny the dealer before delivering it to the customer.  This includes checking all the water connections, solar system, heating, AC, etc, to make sure it is working correctly.  After the trailer is prepared and checked out. A through walk through with the new owner should follow.
 Cheers 

manyman297

I agree with what @Denny16 says but the onus is ultimately on the manufacturer. Products I buy big or small (hopefully) go through QC before leaving the factory. I can tell you that our camper probably received very little QC. Things like leaky plumbing should be caught while testing the plumbing. Something the factory should be doing but most don’t. Nucamp is better than most but it’s not that hard to be better than most RV makers.

Denny16

The water lines are pressure tested after they are installed on the assembly line.  Non torqued (hand tightened) water fittings can come loose whilst the trailer is transported from the factory to the dealer.  I have noticed most of these type of issues, like loose water connections on the back,of the Nautilus are on trailers towed to,the East or West coast dealers.  I agree, nüCamp needs good QC checks, before the trailer is shipped.  

But the dealers are the bottom line here, to make sure the trailer is ready to use when they deliver them.  Our local nüCamp dealer does this.  Their trailers do not leave the lot until,they have been tested and prepared for delivery.  

Cheers 

manyman297

Not trying to nitpick or anything but all of the loose plumbing connections…maybe they loosened up in transit…but if that’s the case then we’d all be having constant leaks after towing these every few thousand miles. Once I tightened our connections they’ve been solid since and that was several thousand mikes ago. 

I just don’t think they’re doing any QC on these. I had an entire upper cabinet (over the kitchen) racked and all of the cabinet doors were crooked. No excuse for that. And to leave that up to a dealer’s service department who might know how to fix it? It’s just passing the buck and it seems to be an accepted practice in the industry. It’s a mess.

tabiphile

The idea that quality can be inspected in (QC) is quite stale. Modern manufacturing relies less on "QC" and more on process and trained operators performing standard work. ISO drove many companies towards pinning down process and teaching the concept of say what you do, do what you say to moderate defects. Furthering this, a well-managed operation will measure out of box quality (OBQ) defects (the crooked cabinets and leaky pipes) as well as warranty events (these are not the same) to refine training and process. "Old school" mindset might lead towards accepting low warranty costs (as a percentage of sales) as a measure of success. Modern manufacturing does not tolerate that approach and drives towards zero defects. A crooked screw is a defect. Reports of numerous crooked screws become an OBQ and warrants corrective action.
The dealer is not the manufacturer and should not become the backstop for failed process or untrained personnel. Those belong to the manufacturer. 

manyman297

tabiphile said:

The dealer is not the manufacturer and should not become the backstop for failed process or untrained personnel. Those belong to the manufacturer. 

They should have this pinned above the factory exit doors 

tabiphile

manyman297 said:

tabiphile said:

The dealer is not the manufacturer and should not become the backstop for failed process or untrained personnel. Those belong to the manufacturer. 

They should have this pinned above the factory exit doors 

A consultant would live in your conference room for many months, cover its walls with Post It's and charge you beau coupe bucks for those words...

Denny16

I wasn’t suggesting the dealer should be part of the manufacturing process by correcting factory errors.  I was saying, a good dealership will make sure the unit is working correctly, and detail any areas needing attention.  Testing a camper to make sure it’s systems work is good customer service, and will,gain customer support.  I agree that nüCamp should be making sure the trailers are correct when they leave, but manufacturing defects do get by, even in other areas of manufacturing.  

I worked at several retail areas involving expensive high end merchandise, and we always checked out a bit of equipment before we delivered it to the customer.  Defective equipment was repaired if minor, or returned to the manufacturers for a replacement batteries item.  

The automotive industry works the same way, most dealers are required to have a qualified service department with certified technicians to check and adjust/repair the vehicles they sell.  That is why when you get a new off the lot,vehicle, it will have a few miles on it from test driving them.  

Cheers 

manyman297

I thought I'd add this into the debate here. 

I received replacement doors for one of my curved kitchen sink doors that had a splitting/cracking finish occurring (for some reason they sent two doors). The new doors are made of a cheaper plywood (maybe 6 ply) and not baltic birch which is what my original doors are made of. My assumption is cost since Baltic Birch has gone through the roof and I don't blame Nucamp for having to switch. 

The problem is that within two days after installation the replacement door start to splinter, crack and the layers separated...like really badly.

I should add this is the 2nd set of replacement doors they've had to send out due to a splitting/cracking finish. I feel like they need to look at making some pieces out of composite or covering them in a laminate vs. the enamel finish they use.

Denny16

@manyman297 Are your gallery doors getting direct sun light on them?  That could be a factor in their splitting.  Given the switch to lesser 6-ply plywood, I would take your original Baltic Birch doors and refinish them, a light sanding, use a good epoxy wood filler to fill in the cracks, and repaint them with a white satin  finish.  Our doors on the 2018 are still fine, no splitting issues, but I keep direct sunlight out of the TaB, and have it vented in warm/hot weather.

I think the issue with Baltic Birch is more of availability, as most of this comes from Russia, and some from Norway/Findland.  The bulk,of,what we used to get came from Russia.  Supply lines were broken during the pandemic and have gotten worse since with the recent events going on.  

We didn’t have any Baltic Birch available here, which was a favorite with local cabinet shops here, and just recently got some 5x5 foot panels in 19mm (3/4”), previously we had a little 14mm (1/2) Baltic Birch, but now that is gone, and just some 19mm stock received.  It is going to take a while to get plywood availability back to some semblance of normal.

 Cheers 

manyman297

No direct sunlight. We’re in a dry climate which doesn’t help. I just don’t think that cheaper new plywood they’re using is up to snuff…interested to see if anybody is having issues but I haven’t heard anything. 

Yeah, Baltic birch in our area is extremely cost prohibitive right now. We have 3/4” 4x8 sheets but they’re $170 up from $70 pre pandemic. The local suppler said to not expected it to go down anytime soon.

elbolillo

We ordered our Tab 320S in January of 2021 and got it the first week of July of 2021. We have had a problem with water leaking in on the threshold of the door. Also, one of the screen/shades was installed out of square. Fixing the screen/shade was a simple fix. It took a bit more work fixing the door threshold and I still need to update the weather stripping to eliminate the last bit of leakage. However, now that I have had the time to dig into the Tab and see how things are put together I would say that in general, it is a solid and well-built trailer. However, it appears to me that there are areas where they could tighten things up considerably with little to no additional cost. For example, how the threshold, door, and screen are installed is overly complex. Reworking that design, in my opinion, would probably save them time and money. Also, the mess of electrical wiring under the bench on the driver's side along with the plumbing certainly could be reworked to be much neater and laid out in a much more logical fashion. This too would save them time and also free up space for more storage or batteries.

One thing that NuCamp needs to get straightened out is the owner's manual. Whether digital or in print, a comprehensive manual that includes instructions for all the different systems would help eliminate frustration on the part of many new owners, especially those that have not had much experience with RVs.

It would be great if dealers were more knowledgeable but since most dealers have such a wide variety of offerings I don't see that happening any time soon. Finding good mechanics and those knowledgeable in troubleshooting and repair is difficult.

manyman297

elbolillo said:

One thing that NuCamp needs to get straightened out is the owner's manual. Whether digital or in print, a comprehensive manual that includes instructions for all the different systems would help eliminate frustration on the part of many new owners, especially those that have not had much experience with RVs.

Yeah, the manual is way too general and doesn't even feel like a Nucamp-specific manual. I wish they'd put the time in to go over every system in detail and keep the general information separate. 

Denny16

The manuals for the Alde, CoolCat, Nautilus  and Stereo go over their respective units in detail.  A good manual going over the TaB and how to use the basic components in an overview would be helpful, especially adding the changes nüCamp made to the Nautilus setup and Alde Bypass valve operation.  Basic info on how the change the tire, lube the bearings and general maintenance would also be good, with additional details.
 Cheers 

gyamane

Totally agree - for all of the beautiful design there are just some bonehead things like using the same length stabilizers on the 320 and the boondock so that they are too short for the boondock or putting the spare on the Yakima rack where it's impossible to reach without a ladder or the design of the fresh water fill port that makes filling from 6 gallon jugs very difficult. I have a 2018 outback and perhaps some of these issues have been resolved in later models. But, the fact is that at the time somebody thought these were fine ideas.

Dutch061

@gyamane, 

Here is the easy way to get the water in.

First, I wired a pigtail into our 2020 400 BDL.


Then I use this $12 pump from Amazon to drop into my 5 Gallon jug and insert the hose into the fill pipe. 




Total cost less than $20.00 and would work for all non-nautilus Tab's.

Brad 

Marceline

gyamane said:

Totally agree - for all of the beautiful design there are just some bonehead things like using the same length stabilizers on the 320 and the boondock so that they are too short for the boondock or putting the spare on the Yakima rack where it's impossible to reach without a ladder or the design of the fresh water fill port that makes filling from 6 gallon jugs very difficult. I have a 2018 outback and perhaps some of these issues have been resolved in later models. But, the fact is that at the time somebody thought these were fine ideas.

Gravity is your friend.

richardspahn

Denny16 said:

I think part of the issue is just as much to do with the dealers.  When a TaB is delivered to the dealer, it should be checked out, and detailed nyrou the dealer before delivering it to the customer.  This includes checking all the water connections, solar system, heating, AC, etc, to make sure it is working correctly.  After the trailer is prepared and checked out. A through walk through with the new owner should follow.
 Cheers 

Denny, I concur.
 I also will have an RV inspector in mid to late September at delivery go through my 2023 400 BD with Victron 3000, 4BB 100 amp hr batteries option, and have an eagle-eye techie friend make a punch list with me on the walk-through/PDI at Princess Craft RV in Round Rock where I've done business before with PJ, her service techs and parts department on several deliveries and numerous upgrades. I've found they keep at it until they get it right. As one of nuCamp's top dealers and top video producer, they get quick responses from NuCamp on whatever they need. This could be a rough year with many manufacturers and dealers still having help problems, inflation pricing changes from suppliers, surprise parts shortages, increasing financing rates, and customers saving and not spending anticipating the coming recession that many already feel is here. I feel nuCamp and Princess Craft are a winning combination for me.  

Mickerly

I haven't read this thread in a while. The discussion of the Owner's Manuals caught my eye. I've been working on a manual for my 320CS. Is this the kind of manual people think should be available with the trailer?

Mickerly

I'm not perfect, there may be areas in need of improvement.

CCC

I will read the whole thing. I just want something that actually addresses the functions of the trailer without referrring back another manual, etc. Some common sense helps. 

Its also a dishonest practice to limit your warranty to just your portion of the build when you are marketing the whole package. That is my gripe with NuCamp.

You ever buy a car where they tell you, sorry the transmission is out of China, you need to call them?

manyman297

@CCC not saying I agree with what they do but this is common amongst the RV industry. They view the RV like a house where individual appliances and other systems carry separate warranties. 

Passport

Auto manufacturers have in-depth manuals for their products.  NuCamp could do it once and if improvements or changes are made could simply add to or change the manual.  It would  be a good PR effort and show folks they really care.  Additionally, it would save them from answering a myriad of questions from buyers.

Mickerly

Having worked with both Cessna and Bombardier I have a different view. If you bought an aircraft or a large boat, and something went wrong, the manufacturer would point you to the contractor responsible for the part. NuCamp does the same but to a lesser extent.

Things are a mess now. The dealerships are selling more than they can service. Their attention goes to the bigger units with a larger profit margin. NuCamp does ship their trailers with a certain amount of dealer preparation; more than a car manufacturer. The dealers have some fault in this too. The factory has good SOP's, except they're short manned. Things are a mess.

Do let NuCamp know what is going on with your trailer. They will make things good, but be patient. It will take a while before they rebuild their world. While they are adapting to new times, people are wanting more trailers. They are in a non-winning position.

Marceline

CCC said:

I will read the whole thing. I just want something that actually addresses the functions of the trailer without referrring back another manual, etc. Some common sense helps. 

Its also a dishonest practice to limit your warranty to just your portion of the build when you are marketing the whole package. That is my gripe with NuCamp.

You ever buy a car where they tell you, sorry the transmission is out of China, you need to call them?

It’s not fair to call NuCamp “dishonest.” I don’t think that NuCamp has ever represented that their warranty covers every single component in the trailer. If you believe otherwise, please share where NuCamp has made that representation. IMO you’re treading on pretty thin ice when you make that accusation and I’m surprised the mods haven’t stepped in. 

As others have pointed out, it’s normal practice in the RV, boat, and airplane industries for components to be covered by the manufacturer of the various components- engines, electronics, hvac, etc.  

I bought my trailer 2nd hand, but fortunately the original owner kept the paperwork. I keep all of it (including all the installation and user information for the various components) in a file in my trailer. I don’t see any need for NuCamp to duplicate that paperwork. I also keep a record of all of the part numbers in a file in the cloud so I can access it anywhere. I’ve also downloaded parts manuals to a cloud account. I was under the impression that NuCamp is providing this information to new owners on a thumb drive, but maybe I’m wrong.