Potential Collateral Damage After Toilet Valve Freezes and Cracks?

cachastney

Looking to buy a used T@B that has a water leak in the back of the toilet which I suspect is from a frozen toilet flush valve that has cracked. This alone does not seem to be a big issue to replace however I am concerned about other issues in the water system that could be damaged (pipes, fittings, pump, HW heater, tanks, fixtures...etc). I realize it depends on the temperature and duration of the freeze but for those who have had to replace the toilet valve, have you had other damage surface in the water system (or structure) after replacing the valve?  How best to check....maybe replace the valve (or shut off the water) and introduce water under pressure and look for leaks after sitting for a while? Thanks for your input!

pthomas745

Tell us what year.  We have a bunch of threads about toilet valves, and usually freeze damage is limited to just the valve.  But one frozen section may indicate other places that were frozen, such as waste gate valves or outside showers, etc.

cachastney

The T@B is 2016. The seller advises he does not remember using the toilet for years as it was simply used as an "extra bedroom" so undoubtedly the camper has gone thru several winters with water in the freshwater tank (how much I don't know). I fully agree other areas of the water system probably did freeze. The camper is located in Georgia, we don't typically get hard freezes for long durations, but all it takes is one, and we had one this past winter. During my purchase inspection the seller turned on the pump to show that it worked and work it did, water spraying from behind the toilet, which the seller kindly warned me about before turning on the pump. Consequently, I could not check out the complete water system (and it was raining at the time). As you state, I have seen many threads here (this site has been a tremendous resource already) about that valve freezing and splitting and replacing the valve but have not seen any follow up where an Owner came back and posted about other damage discovered subsequent to the frozen valve replacement so hoping most people's experiences are one and done. Also concerned if there are any leaks in the system that would damage the structure once under pressure. I am confident I can replace the valve myself.  I hope to come to some agreement with the seller on how to check it out myself or professionally. Thanks!

VictoriaP

The reason you aren’t seeing follow ups indicating other damage besides that toilet valve is because most owners who’ve encountered the issue found it after blowout winterizing their system instead of pushing antifreeze through. The blowout method is reasonably effective except for that valve and the gate valves on the sewer (most people put a bit of antifreeze down the drains for the latter).

If I’ve read your last post right, this trailer was never winterized, and there was water throughout the system when that valve froze. That’s a very different issue. If I were looking at it now, with water in the pipes, I’d check every visible indoor connection (under the dinette and under the sink) for leaks, and find a way to get a camera into the compartment behind the toilet to check for leaks there. Then I’d get under the rig (drop the underbelly panel if there is one) and check the connections to the fresh water tank and all of the grey/black system.

Replacing any one of those connections is a nuisance at best, and some are a fair bit of work at worst. Some of them are impossible to reach without cutting holes (those behind the toilet wall). If buying as is with no further exploration of the damage potentially sustained in that freeze, I’d want a pretty hefty discount off current prices in your area. 

Actually, to be fair, I’d probably pass on this one unless it could be shown there was no other damage. An owner who neglects one area of routine maintenance almost certainly neglected others.

cachastney

VictoriaP, thanks for your comments and words of wisdom! I suspect the trailer was never winterized.  I reviewed the manual and as you point out there are a lot of inaccessible and hidden pipes and connections.  Thanks for taking time to respond, it is appreciated.

VictoriaP

@cachastney No problem. My Tab is my 6th RV over my adulthood, and I’ve gotten a lot more cautious over the years about what I’ll accept, so take my advice (or don’t!) with that in mind. What I can repair myself or am willing to take on with a used RV may well differ from what you or others are comfortable with.

Something to add is that if the rig has been basically stationary the last several years, the tires are likely dry rotted and the brakes & bearings probably haven’t been maintained either. This will need to be dealt with before towing any real distance, because a blowout can cause significant damage to the wheel wells. If the trailer has an Alde heat/hot water system, that probably also hasn’t been maintained, and for many of us, a flush and fill of that is not a DIY job. I’d suggest checking the convectors/hose ends of that system for bulges. 

Good luck with whatever you decide!

dragonsdofly

@cachastney we have a 2017 model. Our first winter (Michigan) we did a good job of the blowout winterization method, but not perfect. A small amount of water must have remained in the toilet valve and it inevitably froze and cracked due to our location. Water sprayed everywhere on our first dewinterization. My husband learned a bit of t@b yoga, but that toilet valve was not really difficult to replace. 2 bolts hold the toilet to the floor. I believe the new toilet valve came with a replacement floor gasket and we replaced that just to be sure.

THERE WAS NO OTHER DAMAGE ANYWHERE IN THE TRAILER OR PLUMBING SYSTEM.

We have continued to use the blowout method to winterize and have had no other incidents and no other damage has ever been detected.

We have spoken to others who have had that pesky valve freeze and crack and they too only suffered the cracked valve, but I do advise caution and agree with @VictoriaP to check this trailer over carefully. I'd use the info you have at hand to negotiate a substantial discount.

Good luck.

cachastney

VictoriaP...thanks for the follow up! Yes, you are correct the tires need to be replaced and intended to check/repack or replace the wheel bearings myself (have done that in the past)....got those covered and check brakes with the wheels off.  The HW heater not familiar with so thanks for the comment! Although I consider myself quite handy, if I proceed with the purchase probably best to have the water system checked out professionally.  Much appreciated again!

cachastney

dragonsdofly...thanks for your comments. It does seem this valve is susceptible to freeze damage if not properly winterized. Thanks for the comment about no further damage, that's encouraging! If I do proceed to purchase will see if the seller will allow someone professional to check out the water system for leaks and operation. Thanks for your input! 

Homebodyatheart

I have a 2017 320S and due to user error, mine, I have had this exact part replaced twice. It’s only a $35 or so part and I paid to have it swapped out. I’ve been told it’s a simple fix. I absolutely love my Tab and starting my seventh year soon. Best of luck!

BrianZ

Here's how I winterize both our water pump and toilet valve at the same time, which also adds antifreeze to the black tank for winterizing the black tank drain valve -three for the price of one..

https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/9137/a-modified-hybrid-winterizing-method-pump-toilet-shower

I also winterize the outdoor shower valves with a homemade attachment.

cachastney

BrianZ...thanks for your response and links to other discussions you have posted! Lots of good information, appreciate the written description along with the great photos!