Total newbie: Solar Panel/Charger Controller question

AudioGirl

Greetings savvy T@B RVers,

I have a 2018 (purchased new) T@B 320S.

I had the dealer install a solar panel plug but have never used panels and I don't know anything about how they work, etc.

I'm told a Renogy 200 Watt 12 Volt Portable Solar Panel with Waterproof 20A Charger Controller would work fine.

I've attached THREE pics that I hope helps illuminate.

THANK YOU sooo much for any help/advice you can give.

:-)

fwunder

I'm guessing you are looking at the Renogy 200 watt suitcase with a Voyager 20 amp PWM charge controller? Yes, it will work fine with your Lifeline AGM battery(s). You just want to make sure the polarity on the SAE connector ( Solar plug) is correct and that your charge controller settings are setup for AGM battery. 

You have the option of leaving the charge controller with the panels or placing the charge controller closer to your battery bank. Technically, it would be more efficient if you place the charge controller closer to battery bank - less impact from voltage drop over distance.

It's really set it and forget it except to move panels to capture more sun.

I have the Renogy 200 watt suitcase w/Voyager PWM controller, another HQST 100 Watt Monocrystalline with Voyager PWM controller and now my 190 watt Tab panel w/Victron MPPT controller. They all work great. To make things more flexible and to chase the sun I made up a bunch of different lengths 10 gauge wire w/Anderson connectors. Sometimes I want to park the camper in the shade and put the panels out in the sun.

fwunder

Here is a visual of how I would normally camp with my R-Pod before I got my brand new Tab 400. Note the charge controllers are close to battery bank. 

fwunder

Before I got the Tab 400 and my F150 I would carry the 100 watt panel on roof racks of my tow vehicle ( 4Runner ) and use it to feed my 6 volt battery bank while towing. Allowed me to easily keep batteries up and run fridge on 12 volts while towing. Just kinda fun.

AudioGirl

OK, thank you! WOW. You are not a newbie! Below is a link to what someone suggested. I believe the controller is MOUNTED on the back of the panel. What do you think?  I posted a linl but it appears it doesn't work. :-(

Here's what the Amazon tiles says: 

Renogy 200 Watt 12 Volt Portable Solar Panel with Waterproof 20A Charger Controller, Foldable  Adjustable Kickstand, Solar Charger for Power Station RV Camping Off Grid

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07RFQVB9M?psc=1&ref_=cm_sw_r_cp_ud_ct_EN4FMGH43N2XJJJA2BAT

fwunder

Yes, that's basically the same system I have. Yes, you can leave the controller attached to the suitcase and run wire ( 10 gauge ) to your solar input port ( SAE ) It's all waterproof. It really just depends on how far you expect to keep the panels from your battery bank and how nerdy you want to get.

If you want to keep the panels, say 25-40 feet, from your camper to chase sun you will get marginally better efficiency by keeping the controller closer to your battery bank.

Of course, you could build a system from scratch a lot cheaper, but the Renogy system is very slick and really plug and play.

You could get all tangled up in MPPT vs PWM and wire gauge and anderson vs. SAE vs. solar connectors. My advice would be to keep it simple to start with.

fwunder

Oh, I forgot! It looks like your SAE ( solar port ) is fused. If not, make sure it is!

AudioGirl

No dumb questions, right? 

1) What is the battery "bank"? Is that the battery that's in the battery compartment? 

2) I don't know if the solar port is fused... how can I tell?

3) So the cable that comes with the Amazon product is not long enough? 

4) Can you recommend a longer cable?

5) Is the solar port that the dealer installed a standard kinda plug that will fit the Renogy or will I need an adapter?

I'm sure you can tell my "building a system from scratch" is not my area of expertise. lol.

Thank you SO MUCH for your help!

fwunder

No dumb questions, right? 

Right!!

1) What is the battery "bank"? Is that the battery that's in the battery compartment? 

Your camper battery system. Could be one, two, three, four or more batteries. Sometimes in parallel, sometimes in series ( different lesson ).

2) I don't know if the solar port is fused... how can I tell?

Look at the back of the solar port in your front bin. Follow the wires. If the wires ( red and black ) are connected directly to the battery with nothing between, it is NOT fused.

3) So the cable that comes with the Amazon product is not long enough? 

From what I can tell, it looks like the kit just comes with alligator clips. You will want and extension ( 25 foot ). Without seeing exactly what the kit comes with, you will need an SAE connection on one end ( solar port ) and I am guessing solar connectors or bare wire on the other end. I make my own. Again, it is important that you make sure polarity is correct - positive ( red ) to positive ( red ) and negative ( black ) to negative ( black ).

4) Can you recommend a longer cable?

Depends on what comes with the kit. Sorry, I make my own but there are tons of different extensions with different ends. Just guessing but you probably want something with solar connector on one end and SAE connector on other. 10 gauge if you can. 12 will work, but 10 is better.

5) Is the solar port that the dealer installed a standard kinda plug that will fit the Renogy or will I need an adapter?

It is standard. It is an SAE plug. As I said again, you just need to make sure black-to-black and red-to-red match up ( polarity ) and it is fused.

pthomas745

Earlier versions of the SAE port, such as my 2017, were not fused on the solar side. Show us a better picture of your battery, and it will show us all the cables (4 of them) that go from your battery to either the trailer or the SAE port (that is the solar port.)  And, the picture will tell if it is fused or not. I've never put a fuse on my solar cables from the port.

You can buy individual panels and separate controllers. Some owners have said the Renogy controller will detach from the back of the panel.  You could then run ordinary solar cables from the panel, to the controller.  The controller can be tucked in close to the trailer, or even inside the battery box area.  (Controllers close to the battery are a bit more efficient.)

Nothing wrong with battery clamps to the battery.  I did this for a year until the eternal mystery of the SAE port was revealed to me.  Keep it simple.

The most important tool will be a multimeter.  There is and will forever be endless confusion about the SAE port.  Once you figure out how yours is wired, it will be very easy.  (We would have no idea how the dealer wired the port...this is the most important thing to know about it). 

I "make" my own cables, like fwundr says.  The wires that go into the solar controller are simply stripped bare for about a quarter inch, and simply tightened down with the screws you see on the controller. (Keep it simple). You can get fancy later.

These are the types of cables available. This cable would go from the solar panel to the solar controller, which should be located close to the battery.

https://www.amazon.com/WindyNation-Gauge-Black-Extension-Connector/dp/B01D7VBKQG/ref=sr_1_1?crid=AA7O2J2EKKVA&keywords=windy+nation+10+awg+solar+wire&qid=1690941594&sprefix=windy+natio,aps,159&sr=8-1&ufe=app_do:amzn1.fos.f5122f16-c3e8-4386-bf32-63e904010ad0&th=1

Once the solar is attached to the controller, you might only need 3-6 feet of cable that could reach to your battery or to your solar port.

And: Multimeter! We can show you how to use it. 

https://www.amazon.com/s?k=autoranging+multimeter&rh=p_36:1500-2500&crid=389K2IWWOZZMS&qid=1690941713&rnid=1243644011&sprefix=autoran,aps,148&ref=sr_nr_p_36_5

AudioGirl

You guys have been so incredibly helpful! I'll take a better pic of the battery compartment. 

Hopefully you can tell if it's "fused."

And thank you for the links!

I'll be in touch!

Much appreciation for your knowledge!

- AudioGirl

Slackers

Just know the Renogy 200w Solar Suitcase can be kind of heavy/bulky to move and store. I've got the older version; although, the newer version is lighter.

ScottG

All good advice here. I'll add that even if the positive wire from the port to the battery is not fused, the positive wire from the controller (mounted on the suitcase) to the SAE plug/alligator clips/whatever might be. At least that's how my older Renogy suitcase was configured. As long as you have a fuse somewhere on the positive line from the controller to the battery you should be okay.

SLJ

The 200 watt works fine. I moved the controller inside the tub on my 2021. You will need to confirm the polarity is correct. Mine was reversed. Here's the details and the parts/adapters I used about t a third of the way down the page: https://teardropsandtinycampers.com/sj-mods.htm

pthomas745

The "polarity" of the SAE ports is correct in the vast majority of the campers.  For whatever reason, the internet decided the polarity of the SAE port was "reversed" and that legend will never end. 

This is what the proper polarity of the port is.  What you want is the positive output from the controller to terminate "inside the plastic" of the cable, and not on the big piece of metal.  The recessed nature of the plug and the cable prevents unfortunate shorts. Once I figured that out, I tossed all my adapters, and never needed one again.

So, wire your SAE cable to the trailer port with the positive "inside the plastic".  After, of course, you use you multimeter to confirm everything!

AudioGirl

I so appreciate the great info.

Re: a fuse... I have learned that there is a 30 amp FUSE in the battery cable from the plug the dealer installed for solar.

More Questions: 

1) The solar panel below that I've been looking at comes with a 20amp charger... will that still work?

2) And will the included cable connect with the plug the dealer installed.

Thanks soooooo very much for all of your help and expertise.

Cheers,

AudioGirl

I hope the links work...

https://www.renogy.com/200-watt-12-volt-monocrystalline-foldable-solar-suitcase/

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07RFQVB9M/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&th=1

pthomas745

You have two links to the same product.  Which is fine.

A 20 amp charger is perfectly appropriate for a 200 watt setup.  A 100 watt panel, under lab type conditions, may get "up to 8 amps" of charging.  So, 20 amps for 200 watts is fine.

Take a look at the cables that come from the back of the panel.  There are two "MC4"connectors on the panel,which are pretty standard solar cable connectors. They connect into the cable going to the solar controller.   Coming out of the solar controller is another cable with MC4 connectors.  The "battery clamps" that come with the setup have...you guessed it: MC4 connectors to match up with the cables from the controller. They would go directly to the battery.

There are cables that have MC4 connectors at one end, and SAE connectors on the other. (The "port" the dealer installed is an SAE "port".) Like this cable:

https://www.amazon.com/CERRXIAN-10AWG-Female-Adapter-Conector/dp/B07T5Y2HQZ/ref=pd_bxgy_sccl_1/146-4994471-6531460?pd_rd_w=K1ROZ&content-id=amzn1.sym.26a5c67f-1a30-486b-bb90-b523ad38d5a0&pf_rd_p=26a5c67f-1a30-486b-bb90-b523ad38d5a0&pf_rd_r=MV4NBWW5A928VF3N3BCA&pd_rd_wg=Lcrw1&pd_rd_r=2bffd755-e413-4fac-9683-cfad87d3ae85&pd_rd_i=B07T5Y2HQZ&psc=1

In the end: it will be better to remove the controller from the back of the suitcase panel, and move it close to the battery and your port.  Those Windy Nation cables above would work from the panel to the MC4 Connectors at the solar controller, and give you room to move your solar panel into the sun if you need to.

And: send us a photo of your solar connections at the battery, and we can all make sure how the "dealer" installed the solar port.  If you have your multimeter...take a reading of the port.  Make sure.  Don't guess or take anyone's word for it!

AudioGirl

Thanks PThomas for the great info.
About the two links, the Amazon link appeared to not be working so I attached the Renogy link.

The cable situation is still a bit confusing.
The cable that comes with the solar panels WILL work/connect to the SAE?

Also, the battery has a 30amp fuse but the solar product kit I'm looking at says it's a 20amp.
That's ok?

Thank you!

pthomas745

What "solar product kit" do you mean?  The fuse in the Renogy controller?

It is easy to get all wrapped into knots over cables. 

If you look at the panel photos: there is a small cable with battery clamps at one end and MC4 connectors at the other.  That cable would connect to the MC4 cable from the "battery output" on the controller and clamp onto the battery. Fine, easy.

The link to the "Cerrian" cable above would attach directly to the MC4 connector from the "battery" output of the controller and go into your port on the trailer.  Even easier.

 

AudioGirl

Thank you for the info and I apologize if I'm unclear.
I put links to the solar panel kit above in the thread. And photos.
The cable from plug (in photo) is already connected to the T@B battery (30amp fuse).
The solar panel controller says it's 20amp.
I was asking if that's ok.

Thank you!

Grumpy_G

Yes a 30A fuse is fine with a 20A solar charge controller.

I'll restrain myself from going on a rant about the stupid SAE connectors (again)... All you need to know is that the "polarity" a.k.a. which pin is positive and which pin is negative changes depending on which end you look at. 

pthomas745

Lol.....I had to restrain myself about how stupid MC4 connectors are (again!).

Slackers

I'll say if it's a connector that will often be connected and then disconnected go SAE. If it's not or must endure movement/jostling go MC4. 

AudioGirl

Thank you sooo much for all your help! Just purchased it. Be well!

pthomas745

Let us know how you do!  It isn't as hard as we make it sound!

AudioGirl

Ok! Will do, PThomas! Thank you!

TABNewbies

Thanks everyone for this discussion trail and others. I was reading up on additional solar for our 2021 TAB400 (3 way fridge) and a recent camping trip showed how the roof panel could not quite keep up with the 3 way fridge (on propane), various mods to reduce the silent current drains and modified fan, as in the shade for some of the day. 
From this discussion trail and many others I decide to keep it simple and go with the Renogy kit to get started and make sure I bought the right things from the start. It makes a lot more sense when you have the items in hand for sure and good a guide to hand that you are not going to do damage. I did not move the controller near to the camper, just started off easy. Perhaps in the future. 
The most complex task below was making the MC4 connections onto the extension.

So hopefully of help to others in the same situation ...

External SAE port (as original factory fit) for our camper
 

Test polarity


Checked it was fused. On my TAB400 this in inside the external rear storage cubby. (I added the labels).
I just pulled each fuse on by one and saw when the external SAE multimeter dropped to zero, or the victron monitor for the roof solar dropped to zero. The 'Gloss 40A' fuse is for the items inside the camper, that I learnt on this forum all about if you happen to hit the yellow button by accident ....
 

Bought these cables on Amazon

CERRXIAN 50cm 10AWG SAE to Male & Female Adapter 10AWG Cable with SAE Conector for RV Panel Solar

BougeRV 20 Feet 10AWG Solar Extension Cable with Female and Male Connector with Extra Free Pair of Connectors Solar Panel Adaptor Kit Tool (20FT Red + 20FT Black)

The 20' length reads as about the maximum length for normal use with flexibility to move the panels around. 



I made the final connections shown above, after checking the exact set up for my needs and keeping positive to positive each set on the way. Lots of youtube videos on make MC4 connections both with and without the crimping tools. (I checked on the web many times to check others but never found an exact description, FYI - my 20' extension in my case is red female to female; black male to male)

SAE plugged in:


Final voltage check, positive to positive, red to red. 


Renogy kit

Renogy 200 Watt 12 Volt Portable Solar Panel with Waterproof 20A Charger Controller, Foldable 100W Solar Panel Suitcase with Adjustable Kickstand, Solar Charger for Power Station RV Camping Off Grid

Disconnected the panel from the solar charger by opening the red MC4 connectors as shown in photo below.
Read good advice to always store that way, 

Connected the battery to the solar charger.
Set for AGM battery type. 


Connected the panel to the charger. Sigh of relief as all lights read as OK as per the manual. 


The panel set up


Now for our next trip with out hook ups to test for real. Disconnected panel from charger first, and then battery from charger.

Slackers

We have a 320 and what you did is nearly identical to our setup.  I wish I could tell you how ours performs but haven't really boondocked for an extended period since we put it together. Anyway good job! 

AnOldUR

As much as I think that SAE is not the appropriate connection for solar, it has made its way into being a standard. With that in mind the double wire cable with two MC4 connections posted by @TABNewbies can be clumsy to work with. Using a straight SAE to SAE extension wire with an MC4 adapter on the end is a little less so.

One of the things I dislike about the SAE to SAE extension is that the color coding can be mixed up depending on which end you plug into your solar port. To keep red to red and black to black I crazy glued an MC4 adapter to the end of the SAE to keep the colors consistent.

AudioGirl

This was soooo helpful!!
Thanks a bunch for all of your expertise!
I got mine hooked up and it's working!
Happy trails to you all!!
💕