More winterizing woes

leroybort

I know that there is now a bunch of stuff about winterizing and that there are so-called manuals online.  I also have the Alde manual.  But for Pete's sake!  We can't figure this thing out.  Drained the Alde water heater tank.  Opened the sink and shower up and drained them.  But are there some valves we need to turn and drain too?  We want to use antifreeze cause we don't have an air compressor.  Please!  Someone explain this in a simple to follow manner.  I promise, we're both college edumacated and can't figure this out.  And this toy is too expensive to make a mistake.  thanks for all who take pity......

Nomad

First lets see where you're sitting fresh water wise...You mentioned opening the sink/shower valves - did you run the water pump while doing this? And - Did you drain the fresh water tank - The valve is behind the step to the left.

leroybort

We "ran" the shower and the sink without the pump.  Water came out and down the drains.  Flushed the toilet a few times til no water came thru.  We opened the black and gray drains and water came out (both were "clean" since we'd dumped and cleaned previously).  Drained the fresh water tank using the valve near the step - had to open the yellow valve on Alde -right?  Water came out.  We have not used the pump.  

Nomad

Run the pump until everything sputters - It won't hurt the pump to run dry.

Nomad

After that, someone else will have to continue as I don't winterize anymore.
Note: Doesn't take much of a pump to blow stuff out. An emergency tire pump is more than enough. I found the blowout method easier than messing with antifreeze fall and spring.

leroybort

OK.  All sputtering complete. 

leroybort

and we were doing so well......

Nomad

Ok, where is everyone, someone step in please. I'm a dunce now on winterization since I no longer do it, worry about it, or pay attention to the threads much.

irvingj

Is your T@B equipped with a water heater?

Nomad

irvingj - Mentioned Alde hot water tank in opening post and sig says 2016 T@B.

Photomom

Did you open the hot and cold water valves? You can identify them because they connect to a hose that runs thru the floor. We left all the valves open to give any remaining water or water vapor a chance to expand a bit.

We found it useful to open one valve or one faucet at a time when blowing out the lines. We used a bike pump and there wasn't enough pressure to blow everything out at once.

I took all the bedding, pillows, etc. out, washed and dried them, and put them back in the T@B inside Space Bags. I also put some Bounce dryer sheets and pieces of Irish Spring soap in the cabinets and all the compartments. Can't hurt. And I put a couple of those containers of moisture absorbing crystals in the T@B. And put some graphite lock spray in the door locks and the lock on the outdoor shower compartment.

Someone else can explain what you do with the traps, gotta run!

ScottG

Ditto what Photomom asked. You mentioned opening the faucets, the fresh water tank drain, and the Alde tank drain. However, there are also drain valves on the hot and cold water lines that need to be opened. They are in the same compartment as the Alde and are indicated in the winterizing manuals.

Even if you are planning to use antifreeze, I'd still suggest applying a little pressure (even with a bicycle pump) to the lines--you'll be surprised how much more water finds its way out. Others here have suggested that it's not a good idea to dilute RV antifreeze, as its effectiveness is reduced.

You should also dump a little antifreeze into the traps, and run a little over the gate valves in the gray and black water drains.

irvingj

PXL-- Oops, you're right. Guess I wasn't really as awake as I though I was!

Only thing I was going to mention was bypassing (isolating) the drained water heater... but I take it the Alde system is a different beast altogether, so I don't know nuthin"!  

leroybort

You folks are the best.  I think we have a handle on things.  Gonna follow the sage advice you've given.  

TabberJohn

PXLated said:

Run the pump until everything sputters - It won't hurt the pump to run dry.

Someone should make a water pump with air blow mode so you can just throw a switch on your water pump to blow the lines out.
Or is that not practical considering where the pump is located?

jgram2

So, having learned the art of procrastination from my dear Dad, who is a grand master, I decided today was the day to winterize (it may drop to 30' tonight). CW's shelves were bare of antifreeze but BiMart had plenty at almost 1/2 the price. Homeward to review the manual. Found the valves by the ALDE and discovered they were not set in either normal use or winterized manner, just sort of a mix. Chose to duplicate the winterizing, starting with the yellow valve based on someone else's decision and saw water traveling upward in the clear tube. Concerning-why not downward with gravity or did it just look like it was going up? 6 valves counting the yellow one. Opened the 3 drains on the bottom of the Tabitat, lowered the jack-more water drained. Turned the faucet and pump on til nothing sputtered out. Flushed til zero water. Used the shop vac to blow out the lines at the FW intake but bupkis, again concerning. Poured AF til it came out the FW drain, then shut all 3 drains and poured 4 gallons in the FW filler. Then poured ~ 2 cups in the sink, shower and toilet, releveled the Tabitat and turned the ALDE back on. Don't think it's working cuz I tried it last night, but I'll check that out on Friday since the Portland area is due for a rare winter storm overnight. Still concerned re the lines, but am happy to say have not lost all of my Iowa cold tolerance-37' and feeling fine even if a Tab worried. Thanks to everyone for your questions and answers. Now then, how will I know if my efforts did not do the trick and we have a large yard ornament instead of a darling teardrop?

ScottG

I'm not sure I can answer all your questions, but can maybe help with the Alde drain (yellow valve)...

The clear tube you describe is not the Alde drain. I believe it's an overflow for a pressure relief valve located where the hot water line exits the Alde. The actual drain is just below the yellow valve, and exits under the camper. Two to three gallons of water should come out when you open it.

It stands to reason that when you open the Alde drain valve, a little suction might be generated in the hot water lines. This could explain the water in the clear tube running back up into the Alde. I would not be concerned about it.

jgram2

@ScottG-thanks, I'm sure that was explained somewhere, but it didn't stick. Next time I'll run out to make sure it's draining out of the port rear side of the trailer. But how do you know when a line freezes and splits? First trailer and never had that happen in any house or auto. My guess is I would see water under the back bench or water rushing out underneath after all of the valves were reset to normal use come spring.

marknjudy

That's a really good question. I winterized last weekend using the blowout method and a small air compressor. It went smoothly. I would close the faucet, count to 10 and open it and repeat to get rid of all gurgling. Did the same for shower on hot and cold. At the end there was no gurgling. But then the overthinker in me wonders if I might have blown a line loose and how I might know other than hooking up in the spring and having water gush out somewhere. 

Nomad

I think you both worry too much :-)
Unless you can inspect every inch of tubing before dewinterizing and adding water in the spring, you won't know if you've sprung a leak. BUT, the tubing is resilient and probably wouldn't burst unless full of water and feezing temps. It's the expansion of the water as it freezes that does things in. Even if there is moisture ir a little water in the line it's not going to burst the pipe. Fittings/joints are not made of the same material so are more suseptical but still, if you've blown the lines good, there shouldn't be a problem.
At the very least, don't worry about it all winter :-)

TabberJohn

I tried searching the forum for "busted", "burst", and "frozen".
I did not find any post that mentions T@B plumbing being damaged during the winter.
Surely someone must have forgotten to drain everything and had an "accident" by now. 
If not, that is a very good sign.

marknjudy

@PXLated, you are right. I worry too much. Especially about what my wife might do to me if I broke her baby

Sharon_is_SAM

TabberJohn - that is NOT very reassuring!!

Verna

SAM said:

TabberJohn - that is NOT very reassuring!!

Actually it is rather reassuring. History shows us that this forum is where a lot of problems are discussed, fixed, and hopefully the result is posted. I can vouch that I have read over 95% of all posts (I don't like greasy discussions!) on both of these forums and there have been no reports of "busted" or "broken" water pipes due to improper or inadequate winterization. 

Nomad

SAM - I'll second what Verna said, if there is a problem(or has ever been), even once, it'll show up here. In fact I warn forum members to make sure they keep everything here in perspective as this is the place to resolve problems even if it's happened just once.

Nomad

Mark - There a solution to that...Teach her how to blow it out. If it breaks it's her problem :-)

marknjudy

Hahaha! Truthfully, she would love to do it. She loves to do all she can with it.

@SAM don't let what I wrote disturb you. I'm a super newbie at this and so am being overly anxious. I will aay that it is the wise people on this forum who taught me how and gave me the confidence to do it. And I will say that a week of studying and going over and over it in my head the actual event was anti climatic. It was so simple that it was a non event - and quick. You could almost do it after every trip. But I will add that I didn't fill it with antifreeze because we're experiencing our first dip below freezong tonight and probably won't have more than a half dozen isolated sub freezing days the rest of the winter. Like Verna and PXL said, be encouraged. 

Sharon_is_SAM

Yes, you are all correct.  We would have read about it by now.  So, I will need to find something else to worry about!  They used some special plumbing in the Tab- Pex, Plex?..

Nomad

SAM - Ya, the same stuff they use for radient in homes now days.

DebM11

Jumping into this conversation with a similar concern.... only picked up my Tab a month ago and since then I have been recovering from surgery so no time to winterize yet.  Only thing we did was open the grey and black and drained off the little water that came out. I opted to plug her in and leave the heat running at minimum.  Barring a heavy long freeze (unlikely for Maryland so early in the season) I thought this would protect me for a few weeks. Thoughts?

Photomom

We JUST got down below freezing last night. We'll probably go to check on the T@B after a few sustained days of sub freezing weather. We did leave all the faucets and drains open to give any remaining water room to expand.