No hot water - (How to adjust the Alde mixing valve)

ChrisandAlexis

We took our T@B out for our first trip on Memorial Day weekend and had a blast camping. Our T@B is the CS-S Max model with the kitchen sink in the back. We were not able to get hot water from the kitchen sink faucet but the bathroom sink had hot water. There were a few instances when I felt a little warm water come out of the kitchen sink faucet then the water went cold the rest of the time. What were we doing wrong? 

Sharon_is_SAM

We too have a new CSS and had intermittent hot water.  Have you adjusted the mixing valve yet?

ChrisandAlexis

Thanks @SAM, I have not tried adjusting the mixing valve yet. I will give it a try.

Sharon_is_SAM

Did you receive the instructions at purchase?  If not, I think I saw them in the manual.  

jpi68

We are on our first outing in our T@B 400, we are having a similar problem. Our sink in the bathroom has hot water, however, our sink in the kitchen and our shower do not have hot water. The kitchen sink and shower will have hot water for about 5 seconds and then turn cold. The mix valve is turned all the way full on hot. Not sure what could be wrong. Obviously the Alde system is producing hot water or we would not have hot water in the bathroom sink. Some how the kitchen sink and shower are not getting the message. Can anyone help... Thanks..

Sharon_is_SAM

Not sure if you followed these instructions or if you just turned the knob.

4ncar

That some faucets are getting hot water and others are going cold is weird. However, the “hot for a second or two, then cold” syndrome is indicative of the Alde bypass valve being in the “winrerized” position and not the “camping” position.  Verify that all your valves are correctly set for “camping” and the problem should resolve itself.

Sharon_is_SAM

Be careful because if you loosen the screw too much, the water pressure will blow the knob off and flood the area.  This actually controls the amount of cold water that mixes with the hot.

Bayliss

@ChrisandAlexis and @jpi68, I am passing along the below info if adjusting the mixing valve does not resolve the hot water issue.  It is a comment I added in a previous thread: 

While searching through Google, I came across this interesting YouTube video:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IsiXaMEneaY .  It addresses something I have never encountered, but which could easily happen if you use the shower (inside or out) and turn off the water flow at the shower head, but forget to also shut off the faucets.  According to the video, this will result in you only having "lukewarm" water flow when you open another hot water faucet.  I would think you would likely notice a small amount of water leaking from the shower head if you have left the faucets in the "on" position (and take it as a cue to turn off the faucets), but maybe not.  I recall reading somewhere that shower heads in RVs have some sort of pressure relief in them that creates a slight drip of water when you close off water flow at the shower head.  Out of curiosity, I think I will test/replicate what is described in the video to see what happens.  (Copied from:  https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/comment/113839#Comment_113839 )

I have not had the opportunity to test the above scenario, but you can easily eliminate it as the cause by confirming that both your inside and outside (if you have that option on your camper) water faucets are turned off.  If you discover that one of them was left open, then I would suggest that you give the Alde time to heat the water in the hot water tank before concluding whether that solved the problem.  (Greg)

Bayliss

@Sharon_is_SAM , or anyone else who may want to comment, I have a 2019 320S with the Alde unit and mixing valve under the driver's side seat.  I was going to adjust the Alde Mixing Valve this past week, but when I started to do that, the below instructions, which I find to be extremely poorly worded, confused me:



Here are my questions/confusion regarding the above directions:

1.  "Turn the knob anticlockwise to (+)" - - does this mean that you turn the knob all the way to the left as far as it goes, or to a particular point?

2.  "Loosen the screw and move the knob out to the side" - - Do you merely loosen the screw, or remove it completely.  I have seen conflicting instructions, with one saying loosen the screw, and another saying to remove the screw.  I have also seen posts that warn against loosening the screw too much or you will have water filling the Alde compartment under the seat.  FURTHER, the instruction states, "move the knob out to the side."  What exactly does that mean?  The wording infers either (a) that you "remove" the knob (and its screw) completely, OR (b) you are to pull the knob out toward you ("out to the side?") slightly (with the screw still attached, but loose), and possibly reengage the knob on the teeth located behind the knob?

3.  "Then turn the knob clockwise to (-) without it being engaged" - - IF the knob is supposed to be removed, there is no knob to turn clockwise, UNLESS it is referring to what may also look like grooved ("teeth") below the outer knob.  IF the knob is not removed (and the screw has merely been loosened), how far do you turn the knob toward (-)?  Also, what does the instruction,"without it being engaged" mean.............what specifically is not "engaged"?

4.  "Adjustments are carried out in small steps.  A 1/4 turn corresponds to approximately 7˚C (44.6˚ F)" - - I assume this means that you turn the knob left toward the positive side, thus increasing the temperature approximately 45 degrees with each 1/4 turn.  HOWEVER, is one to assume that you are starting from 0˚and increasing the temperature from that point, or are you starting from some higher temperature?

5.  "Reinstall the knob and check that it engages with the teeth" - - Again, this tends to infer that you have previously removed the knob (and screw).  However, I considered that maybe it just means that you have previously merely pulled the knob outward slightly (with the screw loosened, but still attached) and that before you re-tighten the screw, you need to make sure that the knob is properly seated (i.e., engaged) over the teeth that the knob is installed over.

6.  "Tighten the screw and then turn the knob to max (+)" - - What confuses me with this portion of the instruction is that if you have already apparently adjusted the temperature (in 1/4 turn increments), and re-tightened the screw, what is the purpose of turning the knob to "max."  Also, how far are you supposed to turn the knob in the direction of max (+)?

7.  "Max calibration for increasing the temperature is a 1/2 turn" - - This instruction creates even more confusion, because it seems to conflict with the "1/4 turn" instruction.  Additionally, in which direction are you supposed to be making the 1/2 turn, AND how much hotter will the temperature increase with that 1/2 turn?  (The only thing I can figure to rectify the conflicting information is that essentially you can only make TWO 1/4 turns to get to the maximum allowed temperature.)

Maybe I am the only one confused by the above instructions (because others somehow seem to have figured it out), but as I say, the wording is extremely poor.  Further, I reviewed the nüCamp video recently posted by Creed on this subject.  He says nothing about loosening or re-tightening the screw, or removing and re-engaging the knob.  He simply instructs the viewer to turn the knob to the left (i.e., "+" direction) in small increments until you reach the desired temperature.  If that is all that needs to be done, then why do we need the above instruction.

As an aside, does anyone know the source of the document that includes the above instruction (the full version is included earlier in this thread)?

So...........any help in clarifying the above instruction, or an explanation as to what is supposedly being conveyed in this particular instruction is GREATLY appreciated.  Sorry for the very long post, but hopefully the answers to my questions will be of assistance to others.  Thanks!  (Greg)

P.S.  I know the mixing valve question comes up frequently.  Maybe my questions should be broken off as a separate topic so they do not get lost under the current title for this thread?

ColoradoJon

What these instructions do is help you calibrate the knob and valve.  The plastic knob has the hard stops, not the valve, so essentially what you are doing is adjusting the valve either hotter or colder within the range.  You do this in 1/4 turn increments, to a max of 1/2 turn total.  Adjust by 1/4 turn, then test your system for the correct temperature.  If not quite enough, adjust another 1/4 turn.  This should get you were it needs to be.

Slightly simpler instructions:
1. Turn the knob all they way to +, it's hottest setting.  Yes, adjust it until it stops.
2. Loosen the screw on the knob, but not all the way.  You want to loosen it just enough so you can pull the knob up off of the valve splines (so it disengages from the valve)
3. Turn the knob toward the -, about 1/4 turn.
4. Re-seat the knob onto the valve spline and tighten the screw.
5. Turn the knob all they way to +, until it stops.

Test your water and see if it fixes your temperature.  If not, repeat the above.  Hopefully this clarifies it a bit.

Bayliss

Thanks @ColoradoJon.  That does clarify it and your instructions are much clearer than that provided in the more formal instructions.  Your step #2 is what I suspected is meant by "move the knob out to the side."  I'm guessing that the formal instructions were written by someone who works for Alde in Sweden where the boiler is manufactured.  They probably express things a little differently than we do on the other side of the pond.

If anyone else wants to add to @ColoradoJon's very good summary, I am all ears.  Thanks Jon!!

Sharon_is_SAM

@Bayliss, at one point, the instructions came in the packet of information and manuals that come with the TaB.  I think the above is an exact copy of the hard copy.  I agree, @ColoradoJon did a nice job of explaining the procedure.  The part that stumps everybody is the direction to “move the knob out to the side”.  ?Translation from Swedish? or do I remember that someone had a mixing valve mounted with the adjustment knob facing upright?  

pthomas745

Mine is mounted facing up, and I think I mentioned it while asking questions on the adjustment a couple of years ago.  The direction stating "move knob to the side" stumped me for several hours.  The other confusing part of this operation is the design of the knob and how it connects to the "spline" behind it.  It took me another few hours to realize what was really being adjusted. 

Bayliss

@Sharon_is_SAM, @ColoradoJon and @pthomas745, thanks again for your assistance.  I adjusted my Alde 3020 using @ColoradoJon's instructions and was successful in increasing the water temperature.  I was unable to simply loosen the screw and lift the knob up slightly to get it off the splines.  Instead, I had to completely remove the screw and pull the knob off the splines to make the adjustment.  Thankfully, no water leaked out.  

I don't know if it made a difference, but while adjusting the mixing valve, the water pump was off and I also did not have any municipal water pressure turned on.  However, the water lines were pressurized and the Alde tank was full.  I do not know if having the municipal water pressure turned on would have caused the valve to leak, but I doubt it.  Frankly I could not see any way that it would leak.

I know @Sharon_is_SAM has the Alde 3010, and assume @ColoradoJon does as well, but I am not sure about @pthomas745.  If you all have the 3010, maybe the lack of water spraying out when I removed the screw has to do with the difference in models.

I have included photos of the mixing valve with the knob removed so that others reviewing this can see the metal stop on the valve, the splines that the knob is seated on, and the corresponding tab/stop located inside the knob.  When the tab/stop inside the knob hits the metal stop on the valve housing, it cannot turn any further, unless you remove the knob and re-position it on the splines beyond/past the metal stop.  Regardless, I stuck with @ColoradoJon's instructions and reset the knob 1/4 turn back toward the negative.  I then re-seated the knob on the splines and replaced/tightened the screw.  I then turned the knob all the way back toward positive.

I cannot honestly recall, but I believe that I set the hot water (shower) icon to full/"boost" with the symbol completely filled/black.  I then set the Alde to heat the water using LP gas only (electric off.)  In a half hour, the temp was up to 149 degrees F, which is what would be anticipated based on how I believe I had set it.  (The shaded symbol returned to half full, which is also consistent with what is expected when you temporarily set the hot water to boost.)  Next time I go camping, I will confirm that the "normal" water temperature (half-darkened symbol) is at around 118-120 degrees.  It should be, but I want to make sure.

Here are the photos...........................

Sharon_is_SAM

Thanks for the pictures @Bayliss!  

Glider11

I have a T@B 320s with model 3010 Alde.  Will someone reach through here to move my hands to the right knobs, etc?  My TT also has the hot/warm for a few seconds (about 1/2 qt.) and then back to cold.  Soooo, now to sort through all of this step by step. Pics are helpful, too, thanx.   Once this is learned (hours!) then it's easier.. right?  

Sharon_is_SAM

Yoy got this @Glider11!  After this, then you know it will be something else!

ColoradoJon

@Bayliss - I do have the 3010.  I also removed the knob when I made my adjustments, but I also drained and depressurized the water lines and hot water tank before doing so.

aahnh

Thank you for this string & thoughtfully explained solution. Just finished a great (albeit brief!) shower! 

dno

So sorry to beat this poor dead horse, but I'm facing the same kind of issues as others new to this world. I have a 2019 320S with the 3020 Alde. I've adjusted the bypass valve to the max hot setting before it blows the setting knob off (don't ask me how I know this). The red hose leading to the bypass valve is definitely hot, using either electric or propane, but the hot water hose on the other side gets just a little warm. As others have written, I get an initial warm burst  at the sink or shower  then it quickly becomes just lukewarm. I've pored through the manual and many posts here and am still at a loss. I'm getting ready to winterize but would love to solve this problem before I do. What am I missing? Thanks!

Sharon_is_SAM

“The red hose leading to the bypass valve is definitely hot”
Do you mean the red pipe leading to the mixer valve is hot?

Is your Alde bypass valve open?  That can allow cold water to enter the hot water supply after the mixing valve causing cooler water.

dno

“The red hose leading to the bypass valve is definitely hot”
Do you mean the red pipe leading to the mixer valve is hot?

* Sorry, yes, the red pipe leading to the mixing valve. The white pipe on the other side of that valve is just warm.

"Is your Alde bypass valve open?  That can allow cold water to enter the hot water supply after the mixing valve causing cooler water."

* Ahh! In my 2019, it's hiding under a radiant heat hose, and didn't know about it until tonight when I downloaded the 2016 Winterizing pdf. It was definitely on, tomorrow I'll try turning it off. Thanks!

dno

Sharon_is_SAM, yes, that was it! Thank you so much.

Sharon_is_SAM

Now you have too hot water😂

JPRoland

I purchased a 2021 320s Boondock and I have had the exact same issues with hot water. I can't thank you forum members enough. This is the info I needed. 

pthomas745

  I think this should be a "sticky" for new owners, right at the top of the page.  Verna's new trailer has a big info label attached to her sink to warn of the mixing valve needing adjustment.

Sharon_is_SAM

For the record, here is a photo of the mixing valve warning with the 2021 models and the 2021 320 TaB Owner’s Manual mention of the mixing valve.  Sounds like there is a hard copy of the instructions in a new owner’s packet.

Sharon_is_SAM

New video from nuCamp demonstrating where to find and how to adjust the Alde mixing valve:  
https://youtu.be/-3OJxJdR34o