Shore water leak

JohnDanielsCPA

I bought my T@B, primarily, to boondock, so I don't typically use shore water.  However, as my warranty will expire soon, I thought it wise to test out the shore water hookup.  I connected my house hose to the shore water port, turned it on, and promptly saw water flowing out the back of my T@B.  Looking at the back, it looks like the water is coming out of one of the black hoses sticking out of the bottom of the T@B.  I realize many have indicated that a water pressure regulator should be on the incoming hose, but my house does not have high water pressure, and I've never had a problem with any other RV I've hooked up to it in the past.  

Verna

@JohnDanielsCPA, please do try using the pressure relief valve. It's amazing how little pressure is 50 lbs with water. The second thing is to look st the winterizing valves in the Alde compartment to make sure they are in the correct positions. The PDF files are in the Resource Category....I forget exactly what the name of the Category is, but you'll find it near the bottom of the Caregories. 

JohnDanielsCPA

I'm pretty sure the winterizing valves are okay, but I'll check again.  I've been running everything off the water pump (and fresh water tank) this year, and have had no problems.

I'll attach my water pressure regulator and give it another try.

ScottG

Ditto what Verna said. If it didn't leak when you used the water pump, it shouldn't leak on shore water. It's the exact same distribution plumbing in both cases.

PhotoJoe

I have had the same issue.  There is a tap valve on the hot water line that comes out of the Alde that may be opening.  There is another thread on the forum from someone with the same issue.  This valve will drain the alde hot water tank.  I can not run my alde when hooked to city water now because this valve opens intermittently.  I tried to order a replacement from Elsie but did not get it.  I guess I'll need to try again.

JohnDanielsCPA

@PhotoJoe could you give me some specifics as to where that "tap valve" is?  I'll take a look at that as well.

ScottG

In addition to the valve PhotoJoe described, there is valve with a yellow flap-type handle in the cold water line entering the base of the Alde. It drains out of one of those black hoses under the back of the camper. (There's only one--you can see it about halfway down, just left of center in the photo below.) It's used to manually drain the Alde tank, but I believe it also functions as a pressure relief valve for the entire system. Others have reported leaks here when using city water, particularly without a regulator.

I suspect some of these chintzy plastic valves get a little out of spec. However, the problem probably doesn't occur when using the pump since the pressure is so low to begin with.

PhotoJoe

John,
I may have misidentified the hot vs cold.  I did so because it was popping when I tried to heat water with the Alde.  It is the yellow handle flap type valve on the blue water line to the right
of the circular brass piece in the photo above.  It is the only one of this type in my trailer.
Joe

JohnDanielsCPA

Okay, great!  I do know what the yellow valve is; I just didn't realize it could be a release point for over-pressure, but that makes sense.  I'll take a look at that.  But it's sounding like a good water pressure regulator will potentially solve the problem if the valve is not defective.  I have a cheap, set "set" regulator, but I've ordered one with a setting screw and guage, so we'll see how that goes.  I'll report back with my findings.  Thanks all!

Verna

@JohnDanielsCPA, Walmart has a brass water pressure regulator that works very well for $9 or so. I keep an extra with me in case I leave it somewhere, or if it did happen to go bad. I tossed the blue rubber one I got with my T@B because it didn't work!

ScottG

PhotoJoe said:

John,
I may have misidentified the hot vs cold.
...

Regardless, you were on to something, PhotoJoe--there is a valve where the hot line exits the top of the Alde. (It's visible in the lower left of the photo I posted previously, and attaches to a clear hose that drains out under the trailer.)

I'm not absolutely sure, but I suspect this is another pressure relief valve to compensate for expansion in the hot side of the system. Theoretically, a failure in this device could also result in water running out below the T@B, though I don't recall any reports of that to date.

PhotoJoe

Thanks ScottG, I'll have to check that valve also.

ericnliz

@JohnDanielsCPA , I've had mine drain in the same fashion for a very short period of time USING a pressure regulator. It comes out of a short black hose towards the back of the trailer for a very short period of time, then stops, which to me, indicates a pressure valve of some sort. I've only had this occurrence once, and it lasted such a short period of time that I was unable to determine where the cause actually initiated. I've spoken with a couple other folks that have had the same occurrence, but with no conclusion because of the short duration of this event taking place. If you figure out the puzzle, please share your findings, as will I, if, and when it occurs again and I am able trace it down. Also, thanks to the rest of you chiming in as well.

JohnDanielsCPA

My leak, coming out of the short black hose, was not for a short period of time, unfortunately.  And it wasn't a leak; it was actually a stream, as if the full force of the water coming into the trailer was coming right back out.  However, I did not have any kind of pressure regulator on it either.  I have a water pressure regulator coming tomorrow and plan to remove the coroplast, underneath, to install the Alde "high altitude" fix.  While I've got the coroplast off, I'm hoping to connect the pressure regulator and run some shore water through to make sure it is actually JUST coming from the black hose in the back, and not leaking underneath.  I am assuming what I will find is what has been said here; that it's coming from the Alde from a pressure relief valve of some kind (or that yellow flip valve).  Hopefully, the pressure regulator will end the drama.  Otherwise, at least I'll know where the problem is sourcing from and can proceed down whatever path that may be.  I won't give up - I don't like leaving things undone!

JohnDanielsCPA

I hooked up my pressure guage to my shore water and took a reading; 40 psi.  That seems low enough that I shouldn't have had a problem.  Nevertheless, I reduced it to 28 psi, then hooked it up to the T@B and turned on the water.  No leaks.  So, the problem WAS a pressure issue that the pressure guage resolved.  I am surprised that the T@B's plumbing is not able to handle normal household water pressure; (e.g. 50 psi).  Regardless, 28 psi is, at least, as good as the water pump and am glad to have this issue resolved.

Michigan_Mike

ericnliz said:

@JohnDanielsCPA , I've had mine drain in the same fashion for a very short period of time USING a pressure regulator. It comes out of a short black hose towards the back of the trailer for a very short period of time, then stops, which to me, indicates a pressure valve of some sort. I've only had this occurrence once, and it lasted such a short period of time that I was unable to determine where the cause actually initiated. I've spoken with a couple other folks that have had the same occurrence, but with no conclusion because of the short duration of this event taking place. If you figure out the puzzle, please share your findings, as will I, if, and when it occurs again and I am able trace it down. Also, thanks to the rest of you chiming in as well.

The event you noted above is a result of the Alde boiler releasing hot water pressure building up inside the hot water tank via the yellow safety/drain valve.  This is normal and shows that the system is operating as it is designed to do.  I've seen this occur on one occasion too and discussed it with an owner last summer at the Tearstock rally in Ohio who had seen it occur too.  

JohnDanielsCPA said:

I hooked up my pressure guage to my shore water and took a reading; 40 psi.  That seems low enough that I shouldn't have had a problem.  Nevertheless, I reduced it to 28 psi, then hooked it up to the T@B and turned on the water.  No leaks.  So, the problem WAS a pressure issue that the pressure guage resolved.  I am surprised that the T@B's plumbing is not able to handle normal household water pressure; (e.g. 50 psi).  Regardless, 28 psi is, at least, as good as the water pump and am glad to have this issue resolved.

I had to install the pressure reducing valve at a friends place in AZ this spring as his home's water pressure activated the trailer valve, requiring me to install the brass reducing valve at his faucet on the side of his home.   It stopped the water from flowing at the back of my trailer and all was well again!  I'm glad your issue has been resolved.  

ericnliz

@JohnDanielsCPA, You'd be surprised at how high the water pressure from shore water (house spigot) gets. I know that at times, mine is in excess of 50 psi. Haven't even tried to hook it up to my trailer without the pressure regulator for just that reason. Glad you got yours figured out!

Verna

@JohnDanielsCPA, the easiest way for me to remember to install the pressure regulator is to keep it attached to the end of my main hose, with a brass 90* connector to keep the hose from kinking. I haven't forgotten to attach the regulator since so started doing this. 

Ratkity

I think you need to realize that 50 psi is the MAX pressure that should be going into your camper. It even said it on my city water connect. Also be aware that pressure regulators fail occasionally. I had a plastic one that cracked after 2 uses. I heard someone else had sand particles from the water make hers fail. I always carry an extra. Because of that... mine will never fail! LOL.

Sharon_is_SAM

@Verna, I have a spigot that attaches to the city water connection and I leave the regulator attached to that.  Can't miss that!