What Do People Think Of The New Little Guy MAX Compared To The T@B 400?

Homebodyatheart

@maddmike many folks with big pups use the Pahaque side tent as a second room for overflow, including stuff and pets. It would actually give you more usable space than a 400 as your daughter grows. I know that @Dalehelman has one for sale right now, and it would be cheaper than a new 400. Just an option. If his is sold, keep checking the Pahaque outlet store online for specials. Good luck!

maddmike

Homebodyatheart said:

@maddmike many folks with big pups use the Pahaque side tent as a second room for overflow, including stuff and pets. It would actually give you more usable space than a 400 as your daughter grows. I know that @Dalehelman has one for sale right now, and it would be cheaper than a new 400. Just an option. If his is sold, keep checking the Pahaque outlet store online for specials. Good luck!

Thanks, but I don't believe the tent works with the CS. In addition, 75lb bullies would make quick work of a $500 tent if left alone in it. I could go and sleep with them but then I may as well just bring my camping tents and sleep out in the dog house. Cheaper for sure as I have existing equipment but not optimal.

maddmike

So, I had fun comparing the two side-by side with the wife and 11-month-old daughter.

Both of them show very well initially. The LG seems much more spacious when you open the door as the hall way is wider and the table that greets you is bigger. The Corian looking counter top is nice and my wife was impressed with the real mattress.

Then, the initial impressions wear off. You realize that the hallway is wider as the bathroom is smaller. The sink is deeper but you have less usable counter space--which is what you need for cooking. The 400 bed felt comfortable but we would need to get a topper to hide the seams. The secondary bed/dinette is bigger on the LG but there is this huge, useless shelf that a TV pops out of.  I don't want that, the weight, or any TV for that matter. I don't watch TV at home why would I do it camping when I there to enjoy nature?

Both units have a microwave--which to me is pretty useless when camping but I guess it can be used to store stuff. Decent storage in the 400 as the closet is nice and takes away from needing a bag full of clothes that now resides on the bench in our CS-S. I loved the floor covering in the 400 as well as the wall coverings as they look very high-end and are on par with the Airstreams that we looked at. The texture of the floor also helps the dogs not slide around and the cloth material on the walls is attractive and sound deadening. In the LG, I thought the wife would like the fridge but her reaction was "we don't need that for camping". The bathroom on the 400 wins hands down. We also looked at both a blond wood interior and a dark wood interior. Both were attractive and I would be hard pressed to choose. Maybe the dark wood is better as I have a small child. Did I mention the huge AC on the roof on the LG that looks like an afterthought?

Closer inspection of the LG started revealing some issues. The exterior rubber trim was coming off of all of the units on the lot. The front tongue frames had rust bubbles and peeling paint. The interior walls were not square and there was caulking to help cover up the gaps. I pointed this out to the dealer and he then showed we a host of other things that he had to fix on every LG before it went out the door such as the door stop which is plastic and always breaks (he replaces them with metal). He sands and repaints all of the frames and re-screws the rubber trim back in which he said was not a big deal. However, these are not things that I would want to see in a brand-new $30k trailer. The dealer tried to excuse them saying that it was a new production line etc. Perhaps these are superficial issues but I'm going to assume that there are more corners cut that I didn't see in a 5 minute inspection that may be troublesome down the line. I asked if has a list of things that he fixes on the 400 and he said "not a single thing". He was very impressed with their quality and went on about how they studied it for three years before releasing their first unit.

In the end, the answer was clear to us, we want the 400.  Since we don't "need" it right now as our baby co-sleeps with us and the dealer really didn't want more CSs on the lot as he had quite a few so we would have to sell ours instead of trading it in. We decided to keep our CS for another year. Do some upgrades (installed a new XL visor this week and ordered a Domestic CFX40 refrigerator as our CS has a cabinet where the usual fridge would go (which we like for pantry space but decided we also need a fridge), and are ordering the Outback platform for the front as the new one has a generator spot).

Overall we are happy with our CS-S. It is so easy to tow and has everything we need. However, we have a growing family and are starting to look at options to accommodate and we do want to take our four-legged family with us. We will try them in a tent for the 4th of July trip and see how that goes. I was going to order the $800 tent that fits the CS but lets see if they destroy a $80 Coleman tent first.

The 400 with empty tanks is pushing it for our TV ('16 CX-9 with 3,500 tow rating) and the LG would be pushing it even further. With my current CS-S, I set the cruise control at 75 mph and it just hums along with no issues (I do use premium when towing as it adds 23hp to this engine). I know with the 400 I may need to slow down a bit. But now we know what we want when we upgrade.

On a side note, I love the distance sensing cruise control and the auto breaking that comes in modern vehicles. Great for road trips and especially towing. I set distance to maximum and it maintains 75mph until you come upon a lower vehicle and it auto adjusts to their speed, go to pass and it picks right back up--no touching the brakes or accelerator. The other day a traffic accident made the traffic come to a complete stop. The vehicle reacted a fraction of a second before I did sounding an alarm and applying the brakes. I was impressed. The active AWD system seems to delete any sway that comes up and the lane departure bumps me back into the lane if I start to drift. I used to tow with my old Mercury Mountaineer and that thing was a lot of work to keep up speed, brake, and control sway. It had a V8 and and trailer brakes but I can't count the white knuckle experiences I had in that thing--the difference is night and day. People complain about modern cars but when it come to towing and road trips, progress in technology is obvious.

Ratkity

@maddmike, sounds like you have a good grip on your tow vehicles' limitations. I wanted to mention some potential limitations on the camper tire speed. Some camper tires have a max speed of 60 mph. They are different than regular vehicle tires because the camper side walls are stiffer to handle up and down forces. Just something to consider. Forgive me if you already are aware of the tire thing.

Be careful, don't white-knuckle traveling and have a wonderful time camping!! That's the goal here, right? You are so important to us. People here are family. 

I need a camping trip!!!!! OMG I want a second camper now that the 400 is out. *sigh* Not in my immediate future, especially with a German Shepherd puppy. He's not destructive, but high energy!  

Sister just bought an easy-to-put-up screen tent called a Clam tent. She loves it after last weekend. Everyone without screened in awnings, tents, etc were nearly being carried away!!! I'm looking into one to camp with the ADHD puppy lol. A wee bit cheaper, but certainly not cheap or cheaply made. My toy hauler has a full pull-down screen when the ramp is totally down, but since it's at the back of the camper, it's not as inviting as a screen tent when making new friends.

Happy camping!!! Just thinking about relaxing with the Kindle (or real book) and just chilling is making me want to escape. 

maddmike

Ratkity said:

@maddmike, sounds like you have a good grip on your tow vehicles' limitations. I wanted to mention some potential limitations on the camper tire speed. Some camper tires have a max speed of 60 mph. They are different than regular vehicle tires because the camper side walls are stiffer to handle up and down forces. Just something to consider. Forgive me if you already are aware of the tire thing.

Be careful, don't white-knuckle traveling and have a wonderful time camping!! That's the goal here, right? You are so important to us. People here are family. 

I need a camping trip!!!!! OMG I want a second camper now that the 400 is out. *sigh* Not in my immediate future, especially with a German Shepherd puppy. He's not destructive, but high energy!  

Sister just bought an easy-to-put-up screen tent called a Clam tent. She loves it after last weekend. Everyone without screened in awnings, tents, etc were nearly being carried away!!! I'm looking into one to camp with the ADHD puppy lol. A wee bit cheaper, but certainly not cheap or cheaply made. My toy hauler has a full pull-down screen when the ramp is totally down, but since it's at the back of the camper, it's not as inviting as a screen tent when making new friends.

Happy camping!!! Just thinking about relaxing with the Kindle (or real book) and just chilling is making me want to escape. 

Thanks for the concern. Yes most trailer tires are underrated for liability reasons. I wish I had the patience to drive under 60mph but alas, I do not. To be fair, my white knuckle towing experiences were never with a T@B but rather towing a race car to and from the track and that was a few years ago.

I have been looking for a good screen tent as my wife and baby have sweet blood and anything within a 100 mile radius that can bite will find them. I bought a cheap one a few weekends ago at K Mart (yes, there are still K Marts) as the bus were bad. However, it was so bad that we had to return it. I'm always driving around camp sites looking for good solutions. Usually when I see one, there is no one it it to ask about it. Wind is an issue when beach camping so I look for shelters still standing. I'll check out the "Clam".

We have not done any big trips yet as we work during the week but every other weekend we are going somewhere in the T@B. Love my Yoga book with the Kindle app. Never runs out of books to read and I can read it in bed next to a sleeping baby without light shining in her eyes waking her up.

Verna

A bit off topic, but the Clam Traveler (the 6’x6’ model) is marvelous!  I used one all winter in Arizona as a woodworking shed and a “garage” for my bicycle. I did purchase 4 wind walls and it did keep the inside relatively dry....as much as could be expected in 40 to 60 mph winds. Yes, it withstood 60 mph winds, although one quick 50 mph gust gave it a bit of trouble. Be sure to attach down guys to each top “corner” and to each “pull-out” and it will withstand winds. And put tent pegs inside in each “corner”, be it a 90* or a 22.5* corner (I’m guessing on the 22.5*.....)

Ratkity

I think my sis got the green octagonal one that can fit over a picnic table. She said she will get the wind panels later. When I camp, we camp in groups that wander from camper to camper and catch up with everyone (we eat our way around the campground). Sis said the octagon one holds 6 comfortably and was impressed. It takes a lot to impress her! She saw the little one and said it wouldn't fit her needs or mine, but that's the one she saw up close and personal. That size was perfect for the folks that had it.

maddmike

So, I went ahead and ordered the tan six sided one on Amazon as it has better rain protection and only costs a bit more than the green. I ordered six walls and will experiment with it as the place for the dogs to sleep. Cheaper than adding a tent to the side of the T@B and serves a secondary purpose as a mosquito protection area for the baby. Walls will help keep the dogs calm (I hope) and not barking or trying to chase everything that walks by.

We will see.

Ratkity

I think a screen tent is a nice addition to a 400 or Max or any other of the teardrops. Those bugs... they vex me!!! (getting back on topic!).

jkjenn

@maddmike that was a very good detailed comparison of the 2 units. I also found some quality issues with the other trailer and thought that overall, the 400 made better use of space. Like, you, the bathroom seemed to be a huge difference, to me. No comparison, there.

Enjoy another year in your CS!

LSkrabut

Note on T@B 400 tires (build date 11/2018)

Clearly marked on the sidewall

ST205/75R15

Radial ST226
Speed Rating "L" (75MPH/120KM/H MAX )

Not to say all 400's have the same rated tires! Best to check to see what your tires are, including the spare!