Hot Water By- Pass

newell

     So I blew out all the water in the T@B.  Put the required anti freeze in the fresh water tank and pumped it through per the handbook.  Drained the liquid out of the sink, shower, toilet one at a time as instructed.  When I got to the outside shower, after draining some through the cold I tried to drain the hot and nothing came out.  Upon further examination,  I found the hot water shower tap was behind the hot water by-pass there for allowing antifreeze to back flow through the shower faucet into the hot water tank.
     A little anti freeze won't hurt the hot water tank but I think these two fittings for the bypass and the shower are backwards.  (see photo)  All you engineers out there, any thoughts?

 

ScottG

I agree with your assessment. It doesn't really affect the functionality of anything, but in a perfect world all the hot water taps should be outside the Alde's isolation loop. 

If you're at all concerned about it, just unscrew the HW from the pipe before pumping your antifreeze. That way any dribblege can be drained into a cup rather than the Alde.

newell

Good idea ScottG.  That would be easier than switching the fittings.  Is this just me or is this the way they all are?

Roamey

I can't tell from the picture, but when you open the bypass valve, you close the hot and cold water valves. Then does the problem still exist?

newell

When you open the bypass valve the water flows freely to all the fixtures.  When you close the bypass valve it should block any flow to the hot water heater.  Since the hot water was tapped behind the bypass valve, when you try to drain antifreeze through the hot water outside shower, it backfeeds through the outside shower faucet and into the hot water tank.  

Roamey

I thought the bypass valve was closed in summer, open in winter (winterize). Then the two other inline valves are the opposite. 

ScottG

newell said:

Good idea ScottG.  That would be easier than switching the fittings.  Is this just me or is this the way they all are?

I looked at an image in my file from another trailer. I believe it was a 2016 with the outside shower added as an option. It was plumbed the same as yours.

Roamey

Here is a photo of the 2018 320 with the hot water valve at the bottom. It is closed and the shower and Alde are on the other side. 

ScottG

Roamey said:

I thought the bypass valve was closed in summer, open in winter (winterize). Then the two other inline valves are the opposite. 

You are correct. I think the concern is about a small amount of antifreeze entering the shower head from the cold side and back-flowing into the hot water side (and ultimately into the Alde). newell, please correct me if I'm wrong, here.

Although, now that I think about, just closing the HW tap on the shower should prevent this. Of course, you would have no antifreeze in the shower's hot water line, but as long as it is fully drained that really shouldn't matter. 

Roamey

Ok, out to the camper again. The vertical blue water line from the Alde goes down to the shut off valve between the black hoses and the shower water line is on the other side of it. 

newell

Scott, you are completely correct.  

newell

Roamey, I can't see in your photo where the outdoor shower hot water line ties into the main hot water line.  In othere words whether it is ahead or behind the bypass valve. 

Roamey

The open bypass valve is below the bottom of the first photo. Then working up the hot water line brings you to the closed hot water valve with the tag laying on the floor, then up to the hot water shower connection. In the second photo, the open bypass valve is below where the two white shower lines criss cross over the black hose. Then you come to the cold water shower hose, then the closed cold water valve. 

Ratkity

The shower heads have a backflow valve at the faucet connection. It's the little fragile little plastic connector to the water valves.

newell

Okay Roamey, I refered back to your first photo.  Yours is just like mine.  Thanks.

Roamey

Let's see if this works

newell

I confused, this does not match your first photo.  If mine looked like this, I would be happy.  

Roamey

(poof)

ScottG

I'm confused, too. Of the three T@B innards I've seen photos of, the outside showers are all plumbed the same way...

Roamey

My apologies, I drew the arrows where I thought it should be. 

newell

Roamey you've got it. The hot water to the outside shower is between the hot water bypass and the hot water heater (Alde) as you have shown it above. 

Roamey

@newell, good catch. I wonder if this is a manufacturing defect?

newell

It looks to me like they had 2 fittings and one short piece of hose and just got confused which fitting went where.  I sure would like to here from Q.C. on this one.

ScottG

I suspect it's more about having limited options for tapping in the outside shower. This fixture was (and maybe still is?) an optional feature. There doesn't appear to be any convenient place to install a tee downstream from the bypass without reworking the current configuration.

With backflow prevention, the only drawback to this arrangement is that when the bypass is used, antifreeze won't be pumped into the short line feeding the shower's hot water tap. Practically speaking this shouldn't pose a problem provided the line has been drained along with the Alde tank. Many of us don't even bother with antifreeze and get by just with draining and blowing the lines. 

Roamey

I think what we are saying is just flip the hot water shut-off and the hot shower take off and everything would be fine. I actually didn't order the outside shower, maybe it's standard now. 

newell

If this is the worst problem I encounter with my T@B, I'm a happy guy.  Enjoy the winter all and thanks for the conversation.....

Roamey

Thanks for teaching me something new. 

ScottG

@newell and @Roamey, I have alerted nuCamp to this thread and they will be taking a look at the issue. It's keen observations like yours that drive continual improvements to the T@B!

Roamey

Thanks, Scott!

newell

Yes, thanks Scott.