Tab 400 winterization of plumbing and alde system using antifreeze method

Jj1

I've tried to follow the forum but i can not find the answer to winterization with antifreeze...

I'm lookimg for information on how to winterize my Tab 400 using the antifreeze method. I have had the procedure done twice at two different locations and the walk through that they gave me after each process was different at each dealership. When to open and close valves, whether to bypass the alde system (how to use the bypass lever), where to add the antifreeze (city water inlet or at the pump), leave drain valves open or closed after winterization, when to add antifreeze...etc. The dealerships seem to be guessing...and the manual says to consult the dealership for best method!

Please, I'm looking for a step by step list with pictures and valve postitions and locations during the procedure for the plumbing and alde system. I tried to contact nucamp for this info but no one will reply!

Sharon_is_SAM

Jj1 - can you please take a picture of your valves/ plumbing.  The 400 is the newest model and I have yet to see any plumbing pictures here.  

Jj1

Sharon_is_SAM

I remember jkjenn mentioned that nice Alde Bypass lever.  So, relative to the 320s you have an extra cold water drain through the floor and a simple Alde Bypass.  Do you know where your fresh water tank drain is located?  

Verna

@SAM, I don’t see any valves except for the yellow drain one at the Alde. It seems the three valves accessible from the outside are the only ones?  

Sharon_is_SAM

I agree.  That makes it simple.  After draining and flushing the toilet,  close all valves and faucets, turn the Alde Bypass lever, add antifreeze and turn on the pump, open the faucets individually, flush, make sure the tanks have plenty on both sides of the valves.  I guess you would keep the Alde Bypass lever in that position until after flushing the system in the spring, no?  I PMed Haloo as he has a 400 and was going to add antifreeze throughout the system.  

Sharon_is_SAM

Verna, I wonder how many gallons AF the 400 would take?  Think no more than 3-4?

Verna

The 320 would probably be the equivalent of from the 400’s Alde to the bathroom, with only going to the kitchen sink being added on. So, just two water pipes going about 6’ to the kitchen sink from the bathroom. I’ve never done the antifreeze method because the blowout method is so easy.  

Sharon_is_SAM

So Verna, there are only 3 drains through the floor, just like the 320.  

Jj1

fresh water drain is next to the driver side tire

Jj1

asfar as the three drains...red is hot water, blue is cold...is the middle one for the alde?

Sharon_is_SAM

Yes - that drains the Alde Hot Water Tank.  Did you see my private message?

Jj1

as far as adding antifreeze, do you add it through the city water or connect directly to the pump...i had two dealerships do it..one city water inlet the other attached to the pump...which is right?

Sharon_is_SAM

You can add antifreeze via the city water connection, on the inlet side of the pump or via the Fresh Water Tank using the pump to distribute.

ScottG

The middle valve does more than drain the Alde. There is another branch off that line that is visible in the upper left of the photo, bit it's not clear where it goes.

Since the yellow flap-thingy is also an Alde drain, there would be no need to put a second drain downstream from it.

The question of why there are two apparent CW drains remains unanswered without a full view of the plumbing layout. Perhaps the system in the 400 has multiple low points and this facilitates draining.  

Sharon_is_SAM

Scott, I think that branch off the Alde cold water line in the upper left goes to the Bypass lever.

Sharon_is_SAM

Can someone share the winterization info in the TaB 400 manual that comes on a thumbdrive?  Just curious how the instructions for the 400 compare to the 320.

Haloo

Winterization (from T@B 400 manual)

 Operating in Freezing Conditions can damage piping and equipment if camper is not winterized. Always winterize your camper if you are camping in below freezing temperatures. Propane for the appliances will work down to 44 degrees below zero (-44°). The windows have weep holes, which drain water from the window tracks. In heavy rain and wind, water could be blown into the camper through these holes. Put a piece of sponge in the track over the hole to prevent this from occurring.  Storage The following checklists will help you perform the steps necessary to prepare your camper for storage. Use the checklist that applies to the storage conditions you anticipate. These checklists do not include every detail required, and you may want to expand them to suit your needs.

Short-Term Storage (less than 45 days – Above Freezing)
1) Wash the exterior.
2) Park the camper as level as possible front to rear and side to side.
3) Before disconnecting the battery cables, check the charge in the battery. Recharge as necessary. Clean terminals, top and sides of battery and battery box. Leave the battery disconnected or switch the battery disconnections switch to the “STORE” position.
4) Drain the holding tanks, toilet, and fresh water tank. Turn off the water pump and water heater.
5) Turn off the propane at tank valve.
6) Turn off the refrigerator, furnace, all range and oven burner valves and pilot.
7) Remove all perishables from refrigerator and galley cabinets. Leave the refrigerator door open to reduce odor buildup. An open box or tray of baking soda in the refrigerator will help absorb odors.
8) Slightly open (1/4”) a roof vent.
9) Close and lock all windows. Be sure the vent fan and range hood fan switches are off.
10) Cap and close the holding tank drain, city water inlet and fresh water fill spout.
11) Turn off all radios, TV’s, interior and exterior lights.
12) Close the mini blinds and day/night shades.
13) Disconnect the 120-volt power cord and store in compartment.
14) Check the camper weekly.

Long-Term Storage (Above Freezing)
1) Perform all the preceding short-term storage steps.
2) Operate air conditioner periodically to lubricate compressor seals.
3) Remove and place the battery in a cool, dry area. Check the battery charge every 30 days. Recharge as necessary.
4) Check the sealants around all roof seams, body seams, and windows. Reseal if necessary. See “Sealant Renewal” section.
5) Prepare the generator (if equipped). See generator Operating Manual included in the Owner’s Information Package.
6) Remove the smoke detector’s battery. Leave the cover open as a reminder to replace the battery.
7) Cover exterior vents; Alde, air conditioner shroud, refer, to prevent insects and small animals from getting in the camper. Be sure to remove all covering materials before using appliances and vents.  

Storage Below Freezing
To avoid damage to the plumbing fixtures and other components, we recommend that your camper plumbing systems be properly drained and have antifreeze protection. The following is a procedure checklist you can follow if you prefer to winterize your camper yourself. Many owners prefer a nüCamp RV Dealer Service Center perform this service.
1) Perform all steps in the short and long term storage procedures.
2) Drain the fresh water tank by opening the water tank drain and leaving open.
3) Turn the water pump ON and open all hot and cold water faucets. When the flow of the water stops, turn the pump OFF. Open the low point drains on the hot and cold water pipes. 4) Drain the water heater by opening the drain plug at the bottom of the heater and open the pressure relief valve.
5) Depress the toilet flush pedal or hand-operated lever. turn OFF all faucets, close the water line drain valves, fresh water tank drain valve, water heater drain and pressure relief valve.
6) Drain the showerhead and hose by disconnecting the hose at the faucet from the inside and outside shower.
7) Drain the waste water system by following the normal procedure for draining the holding tanks. See “Waste System” section.
8) Be sure ALL water from ALL plumbing has been drained.  

Draining the water system alone will not provide adequate cold weather protection. If the camper is to be unheated during freezing temperatures, consult your dealer for the best winterizing procedure for your climate. Your dealer can supply you with one of the special non-toxic antifreezes that are safe and approved for use in RV water systems. Follow the instructions furnished with the antifreeze. 

Sharon_is_SAM

Thanks Haloo.  Same info as the online TaB manual.  The 400 shower does not have a faucet like the CSS model.  Does the shower head unscrew to all for drainage?  No mention of Alde Bypass or blowing the lines.

Haloo

Yes, I unscrewed the shower head to drain the hose. No water came out, but I'll keep doing the same every time I winterize, just in case. 

I read the Alde manual regarding winterization. It was somewhat helphul. But various forum threads have been far more useful. 

ScottG

SAM said:

Scott, I think that branch off the Alde cold water line in the upper left goes to the Bypass lever.

Ahh, right! I apparantly missed that detail in Jj1's first photo.

The bypass itself must be the white line shown in the second photo. It's interesting that there are not separate quarter-turn valves to isolate the Alde as there are in the 320. Perhaps in-line check valves serve the same purpose?

It's still a little unclear to me how the CW side is configured, and why their needs to be two CW drains (in addition to the yellow flap valve). A photo from a different angle showing how the CW feed to the Alde is configured would be helpful, but it looks like a tight squeeze in there! 

Sharon_is_SAM

The middle cold water drain is the Alde Tank drain.  

Haloo

ScottG said:

...It's still a little unclear to me how the CW side is configured, and why their needs to be two CW drains (in addition to the yellow flap valve). 

If you ever figure it out I’d like to know the answer too!  

Jj1

Here is rhe response I received from nucamp rv with regard to the third valve and relief valve-

"The middle drain valve you see on your Tab 400 is the drain valve for your Alde Hot water reservoir. You can drain the Alde with the Alde Relief Valve as well, but we installed that third valve so you have easier access for relieving the Alde system itself while you are draining the Hot and Cold water lines."

Haloo

Jj1 said:

Here is rhe response I received from nucamp rv with regard to the third valve and relief valve-

"The middle drain valve you see on your Tab 400 is the drain valve for your Alde Hot water reservoir. You can drain the Alde with the Alde Relief Valve as well, but we installed that third valve so you have easier access for relieving the Alde system itself while you are draining the Hot and Cold water lines."

Sweet!  Thanks for finding out the answer to this question!