T@b 400 Battery Consumption

sranderle

We currently have a 2016 T@b Q, outfitted with a pair of Interstate 6V batteries offering 220 Ah.  I have a generator to recharge them when not on shore power.  We do not have solar.

We are thinking about a new trailer, and the T@b 400 is in the mix.  We will be visiting one in person this weekend.  Along with our concerns about the bed, I have concerns about the 12V refrigerator's battery consumption while not connected to shore power.  My assumption is that I will again not have solar.

I sleep with a CPAP machine nightly.  Currently, it will draw down a fully charged set of batteries to 12.2V by morning.  If we run the Fantastic Fan on low, that increases the draw to 12.1V.  This is definitely the bottom of where the batteries need to be recharged, hence the generator.  The generator can handle this in 1-2 hours.  This necessitates no interior lights and limited water pump use.  The Television is unplugged and the stereo has a power cutoff.  I believe all residual draw has been removed.

 Looking at the 400, just adding the 12V refrigerator, it would seem that I would need a larger battery bank.  And that doesn't allow for using the bathroom, which is one of my wife's requests in a new trailer.  

What are people experiencing for daily 12V refrigerator draw?   It would seem that I would need a pair of lithium batteries to get a usable 200Ah or more, and they would still need a daily recharge.  I would hate to buy a trailer and then not be able to use anything unless we have an electric site.  That cannot always be arranged, nor is it desired.

Thanks for your insight!

jkjenn

Hello @sranderle - in case you did not know, the 400 comes with 2 6v agm batteries. I believe it will also have between 225-240ah.

Travels with Delaney have a video addressing the battery usage:

https://youtu.be/saNx9s-gDWY

sranderle

I had seen this video, but didn't notice the voltages before.  So it looks like the refrigerator, in his scenario, was drawing about .5V a day.  Add that to my CPAP, and I'm consuming 1V of battery power a day.  To that add water pump, lights, etc.

How much more would the refrigerator work if you are in/out of it several times a day?  Minimal? Double?  Of course, outside temperature would come into play.

All of this is meant to design what I may need for new battery bank.

grubbster

Look at adding the optional 3 way refrigerator and running it on propane.  Take the battery out of the equation.

DenisP

I was pleased to watch the Traveling with Delaney video which represents battery usage without solar.  I am very fortunate to have a factory installed solar and a 12 Volt refrigerator.  We have found that the refrigerator is remarkably efficient and the combination of the two 6 volt AGM batteries with 200 watt solar allows us to camp without shore power for days.  When purchasing the 400 I was concerned when I found out that the refrigerator was 12v/110v due to the R-Pod I was trading had a 3-way refrigerator which was horribly inefficient on 12 volt.  Propane was the only choice when boondocking since the house batteries (two golf cart batteries) would be depleted within 8 hours.
An update:
Currently on our last camping trip of this season which is a change from the “sunny summer” camping we had experienced.   Dry camping during a mostly cloudy sky at a Harvest Host in central Maine. We disconnected from TV at 2:15 pm. 

The solar app noted 12.5v by 7:14am after night of Alde for heat and hot water, refrigerator,lights, water pump and brewed  kerig coffee. Full clouds at 6:46 am sunrise.  After a two hour ride down the coast to our new CS the batteries were  at 13.0 volts  

Cbusguy

Your CPAP machine.   Do you use a humidifier?   If you do consider not using the humidifier.    I use a dreamstarion....with humidifier it draws between 6 and 8 amps.   Without humidifier it draws 1 to 2 amps.

I am a Scoutmaster and have been tent camping with cpap for years.   

treefrog

We just picked up a new 400 and it came with the 3 way (propane) fridge. It holds more food and you don't have to bend over to get into it. You lose the closet but get 2 large drawers where the other fridge was. 

Michigan_Mike

I agree with CBusguy don’t use the humidifier and you should be fine.  I use a Resmed 9 unit and have the solar package on my 400.  Energy consumption is a concern, but if you have a suitable panel and available sunlight you should be fine.  I never use the humidifier when I’m boon docking.  

rajamar

@sranderle Are you running your CPAP on 120V through an inverter and using a humidifier? Before getting our T@B we tent camped and for the last 9 years I  have used  the same group 27 marine-deep cycle battery for my CPAP and device charging. It uses a cable that plugs into a cigarette lighter recepticle attached to the battery. Can't use the heated humidifier (and that can be uncomfortable on cold nights), but in 4 days of use it doesn't go below 12.5. I have a good desulfating trickle charger and start out at about 12.8 or more. Granted, you have other loads, but the CPAP without humidifier, by itself, is not that great a load.

Cbusguy

Cold nights while tent camping.   Tuck the CPAP machine in your sleeping bag.........the air is warm and reasonably humid.

sranderle

For me, I need the humidifier, or I end up with wicked sinus infections.  My only other option is to go without the CPAP, which I can do (motorcycle trips), but my wife vetoes this option in close quarters. 

I do use the 12V plug/power supply for my Resmed Airsense 10, so that helps.

After looking at at a T@b 400, and some slightly bigger trailers this weekend, we decided to stay with our current T@b for now.  The bed on the 400 will just not work for us.  My wife liked the bed on the Little Guy Max a little better, but that whole package was not in the same league as the nuCamp 400, in my opinion.  And the larger trailers all seemed to lack the quality of what nuCamp is putting out, except for maybe a Nash.  But that is still a 23' trailer, bigger than we want, and one of us still has to partially crawl out of the bed.

I will look into lithium batteries over the winter.  I have a long list of mods for the spring.  Woohoo!

Thanks for your feedback.

ericnliz

@Michigan_Mike,  boonficking....new type of boondocking that i'm not aware of????

Michigan_Mike

My apologies!  Using an iPhone and it’s making changes on the fly!  

seitzmike

FYI, we spent months trying to find a solution for battery drain in a 320 CS-S.  Purchased solar and generator.  Changed batteries to 2 6V golf cart batteries in series.  Thought the 12V DC frig was the problem.  Turnouts after spending all the dollars, the Fantastic fan was the big drain.  Now we take the solar panel and can stay for days off grid, even when cloudy, as long as we don't run the fan.

Verna

@seitzmike, look into upgrading to a 10 speed Fantastic Fan. I have one and it is great. Number one, the noise level on my high speed is the same as your #1 speed. Number two, the energy consumption is so little compared to the 3-speed Fantastic Fan. (No, I do not have exact figures.)

I had a discussion with a few of the Department Lead Techs at nüCamp earlier this year, and they were noticeably surprised when I said the stock 3-speed Fantastic Fan was an energy hog and I never used it when off-grid. I said I used rechargeable portable O2 fans because they were so much more energy efficient than the 3-speed Fantastic Fan.

Although I haven’t verified it, I did see where someone said nüCamp was changing their roof vent fan for the upcoming model year. Maybe my frank discussion was instrumental in this decision.

And there is also a thread here that describes a conversion to make the 3-speed Fantastic Fan more energy efficient. 

jkjenn

Agree with @Verna. If I am trying to be an energy miser and just need a little air movement, I use a small USB fan so that it hits my face. It is also a nice way to keep the AC air circulating. I also love the 10 speed fan upgrade. 

LSkrabut

I will 3rd the upgrade if one can to the Fantastic Model 7350 (14 or 13 Speed - I have seen it listed as both) fan.

My 2018 400 I custom ordered from the factory with this model and my 2019 400 replacement it came with that model. Note on the 2018 it did not have a cover lock which can be manually lock when closed. Also the rain sensor is a nice feature.