Manuals for winterizing T@B's - questions

I doubt you could make me mad unless you used your magic wand on ME.

I just feel this is the one area where I could seriously mess up my trailer if I do it wrong.

I did the same as Verna as there were no manuals at all back then. I didn't do the labels though.

Hmmmm - I didn't.

Photomom, it's recommended by the manufacturer (Alde), that the water heater part of the Alde should not be in contact with any winterizing antifreeze.

I usually just blow out the system thoroughly, and leave it dry for the winter. Of course, I also put antifreeze in the drains/traps and in the black and gray water gate valves.

If I used antifreeze to winterize, I'd first drain all the lines thoroughly, being sure the Alde itself was thoroughly drained, tilting the Tab this way and that just to be sure, then redirect the bypass valves to isolate the (now dry) Alde. Add the antifreeze to all the lines, by filling the fresh water tank with antifreeze and pumping it through all the fixtures: shower hot/cold, toilet, sink hot/cold.

As I said though, I prefer simply draining and blowing out the lines and spigots, not messing with the antifreeze. Less to deal with in the spring.

HTH.

I usually drain everything possible and then connect the compressor and blow out each line individually for five minutes or so. There is still a minimal amount of water at rhe bottom of the fresh water tank. I put antifreeze in the sink drain and add enough that it goes into the grey tank. Marvin told me at Tearstock this year that I should run a little through the pump also but I have not done that for the past two years and have survived a couple of cold Indiana winters. I have never put antifreeze in the water lines because I felt that I had thoroughly blown them out. This method has served me well on a 2014 CS.

Photomom said:

I just feel this is the one area where I could seriously mess up my trailer if I do it wrong.

Your fear and concern was exactly how I felt after I picked up my 2015 T@B trailer and brought it home to Michigan during the fall as I knew that winter was fast approaching and there wouldn't be room for error with the onset of cold weather looming on the horizon.   As Verna noted above and told me (yes, we talked a few times on the phone) when I was trying to figure things out, take the time to open up the bench area where the Alde unit sits, study the piping and you will figure it out easily.  It did click and made sense when I took her advice as the T@B water system is a rather simple set-up and it's easily maintained/manageable if you look at the piping, see where it runs and compare it to both the camping season/winterizing photos shown in the PDF.  

The Alde has a built-in 2.5 gallon hot water tank, water flows into it cold, the water is heated, exits the Alde hot water tank and is used in the shower and in the sink in the kitchen area.  That is it!..... Your fresh water tank drain is located beneath the trailer and to the left of the trailer step.  That needs to be opened to drain the water from the FW tank.  Additionally there are valves in the Alde bench area that are opened that drain the hot water tank and the hot/cold water lines inside your trailer.  

The gray & black water tanks must be emptied too.... I installed pink RV antifreeze in these tanks, eventually dumped it (as noted below) and even if there were some residual water remaining in either, what difference does it make should it freeze up, expands some, etc.?  This applies to the freshwater tank too as a small amount of water will not kill the tank as the water lines will be aired out via pressure (I used a bicycle hand pump) and the valves will remain open until outside temperatures allow for the system to be used from spring, through summer and into fall the following year.    

By lowering the front of the trailer down to its lowest point and forcing air into the water lines, this will force the water out and also allows gravity to help in this entire process.  I performed the above a couple of times, ensured that the pump was free of any water (followed their instructions) and poured RV (pink) antifreeze into the gray & black water tanks, into the sink and tub p-traps too and I was good to go.  

I was also instructed to "open up" the gray and black water valves, remove both caps, allow the contents to flow out and then install a screen over these areas and allow air to flow freely into both tanks so that they could dry out.  The screens also eliminate any rodent entry (or nest making) into the tanks and my trailer was stored in a barn all winter (with mice present) and everything worked out fine and without any rodent entry (or subsequent issues) into either the tanks or my T@B unit.  

I also charged up my battery good in the fall, turned the battery on/off switch to off and left it that way until spring time and all was well and the battery remained charged.  This is something I do religiously with all my toys/boat/lawn gear here in the harsh winter area of Michigan and I have lived here all my life and never had any issues.  I was once told to "go with what works best for you personally and stick with it" and this is what I have done and it's been effective for me.  

Piece a cake!  

Thanks for the upload Verna...  Our dealer (Madison, WI) is going to have a demo near the end of Sept to show us newbies the procedure also...

I am still trying to get my head around this winterizing thing. The PV manual for 2016 models shows pictures of the valves in summer mode and winter mode, and notes that the winter mode positions are only needed if winterizing with antifreeze. Does this mean I can leave the valves in the summer position all the time if I use a blow out plug?

Also, where is the Alde drain valve? It is not shown on the picture.

If I drain the Alde and don't put antifreeze in the lines do I need to do anything with the Alde bypass valves?

Need to winterize this weekend and feeling really stressed out. And no, looking at the rats nest of tubing under the sofa does not help. It makes no sense at all.

ScottG said:

If you are not using antifreeze, you will need to open the valves to drain and blow the lines, but it really doesn't matter what position you leave them in after that.

You mean open the drain valves, right? I'm thinking all of the other 57 valves in there can stay in the summer position, right?

Why is it that something so really basically "simple" (simple might not be the best choice of word) cause so much stress and second guessing?  I figured since Mr Weatherperson said it might get down to 23-34 tonight, today should be the day to do the "Big W!" Winterize. Using the handy handout I compared my plumbing under the sink.  With marker I noted the primary parts. Double checked the drains that I had previously emptied. Poured 1+1/2 gal of the pink stuff into the fresh water tank. Turned on the pump and opened the bathroom and galley faucets and stood back in case it blew up!  I was surprised to see quite a bit of water come out of the bathroom faucet before tinges of pink appeared.  (Wonder what drain I missed?). Eventually, although still pumping out bubbly liquid it showed more pink than water. Also flushed toilet until some pink appeared.  Turned off the pump and closed the faucets.  Poured some pink down each drain and toilet including the shower floor.  Opened the gates of the black and gray and waited until they stopped draining.  Closed everything up and here I sit hoping I covered all the bases.  Only got out of the driveway twice this season but spent quite a few nights in it driveway camping.  Replaced the overhead fan fuse and changed an Alde fuse when I thought I was having a no heat issue.  The only other thing I wondered about was a fan noise (compressor?) that runs ALL the time (I'm plugged into shore power).  Is that normal?  Don't remember hearing that last year.  Well...sorry to carry on so, but it helps me to write things out, especially if there are folks who might read this and understand what I'm talking about.  Thanks for listening.. All comments/corrections welcome. 
Martha in VT with her '16 GMC Sierra double cab Big Blue and '15 T@B CS-S Max H@ppy C@mper!

I hate to keep beating the horse but it's not dead yet. There is no drain valve attached to my Alde. There are only two drain valves, one for red and one for blue. Near the top of the Alde there is a red hot water outlet and attached to that is a clear hose that runs down through the floor. When we opened the hot water drain valve on the red line we could see water running down this clear hose thru the trailer floor and air bubbles coming back up. 


Will this drain the Alde tank sufficiently? Neither of us could see any other way to get water out of it.

I don't understand what the red fitting is, or why water doesn't come out of it all the time.

Photomom, That yellow flap thingy on the blue line IS IN FACT the drain for the Alde tank, believe me, I know. You need to flip it up [straight up] to drain the tank. If there is no water coming out of it, it is because there is a in-line pressure valve that restricts the water from going back the other way to fill the tank. I had a hard time emptying mine because of that valve, and the fact there was no pressure left in the lines because I blew all the lines out BEFORE trying to empty the tank. You can get it to empty by re-filling the lines, and tank,with water, and then emptying that one first, or do like I did, and put air pressure in to the city water fill-up to create pressure to open the valve. I hope this answers your question. If you follow the line with the flap thingy TOWARDS the tank, you will see the blue line that comes out of the bottom of the tank, [almost straight down from where your red arrow is] not only to fill, but to empty the tank also.

Photomom said:

Why? Because it looks like this.

Your Alde power cord is the culprit above that adds a lot of tension/business to the photo you posted.

If It were me I would unplug the Alde power cord, uncoil that mess wrapped around the center, recoil/re-position/relocate the power cord nicely and secure it out of the way with a couple of tie-wraps (to eliminate the mess above) and re-position it near the lower floor area.  

Once this is done the water piping system is a much easier/simple system to figure out since the blue (cold water) and the red (hot water) piping basically head off (via the white hosing shown above) to your shower/sink/stool and to the Alde areas (blue & red pipes) and emptying out the bottom of the trailer via the valves.  

Cold water enters the Alde system (via the blue water pipe) at the bottom of the Alde unit and leaves the Alde (after the water is heated) via the red pipe at the top of the Alde unit.  It's a very simple set-up and can be easily sorted/figured out if owners would take a few moments to open up the bench area and follow the pipes out.