using a generator for air conditioning?

lkc001

Hello all--wondering if anyone here has a Predator 2000 Watt "super quiet" inverter generator from Harbor Freight?  Will it run your generator and/or a CPAP machine/nebulizer or instant pot or coffee pot?

Thanks for any info!  I have a 2017 Tab 320S

CrabTab

*2000 Watts is plenty to run the AC in my 2019 T@B 320

*Look at this discussion about CPAP usage (using a 12VDC power cord for a CPAP is the best way to go IMO)

https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/comment/137208#Comment_137208

* We are percolator pot over a gas fire folks, so can't help with coffee pot and instant pot question other than to say check the wattage on those appliances (Volts X Amps).

lkc001

@CrabTab thanks for the info on the AC!

VictoriaP

Unless you boondock in areas that have minimal rules, a generator is a bad idea to run a CPAP, because most places won’t allow them to be run overnight. Most won’t run all night on a single tank of fuel either, which means getting up to refuel. And out west, there are sometimes limits placed on using them due to wildfire risk. So relying on it to run a medical device is a bad idea except in disaster recovery situations.

But yes, absolutely should run the AC on your 2017 320 just fine where allowed.

MuttonChops

Agree, Predator 2000 will be OK for our 5,000 BTU window A/C units.

A/C draws about 4.8 Amps max while running {~ 575 watts} with a compressor start-up surge in the 1,600 watt range.

I have the iPower 2000 same as Predator just branded different (and a bit $$ cheaper) both are rated at 1600 watts running 2000 watts surge.

Driveway testing {have not used in field} it ran the A/C just fine . . . engine noise does do go when compressor starts but does not stop generator.

My planned usage is for  [A] A/C running to cool down T@B near bed time, [B] backup for solar battery charger, and [C] could even run Alde on level-1 if propane is gone.

lkc001

@VictoriaP Yes--I understand the running all night issue.  I don't have a CPAP but have a nebulizer that I use occasionally which draws @ the same as a CPAP for a medical device but runs only @ 15 minutes at a time.  Thanks!

VictoriaP

lkc001 said:

@VictoriaP Yes--I understand the running all night issue.  I don't have a CPAP but have a nebulizer that I use occasionally which draws @ the same as a CPAP for a medical device but runs only @ 15 minutes at a time.  Thanks!

Excellent, can’t imagine that would be an issue for a generator to run. Though I’d still look for a 12v cable for it...personally I hate firing up a generator, those pull starters just do not like me! LOL

larrygon

I have done just fine with the Predator generator. It did not like it when I tried to make coffee while running the AC.

Dutch061

When we had a TAB 320, I also had the Predator 2000. Runs the AC no issues, will make coffee no issues. As long as the AC is running while you are making coffee and doesn't try to start while you are brewing it will be fine. We upgraded to a TAB 400 in March, I had the 1year extended warranty on the Predator. Returned it and bought the 3500 with electric start. Works great for the 400 and the extra load, and I will let Harbor Freight replace it before it is 2 years old for a new one.

P.S. The 3500 weighs almost 45 lbs less than the Honda and is rated 2 points lower by Consumer Reports. It used to be 2 points higher, but it appears that Honda may have increased the fuel tank capacity. The difference is in run time from what I can tell.

Best Regards,

Brad

2Cougs

@lkc001- I am a bit biased... only telling you this for you to know where I am coming from, not to judge others or discuss the pros and cons of generators... but we choose to not own a generator.  DH uses a CPAP all night, and thanks to @AldebaranJill we have an awesome solar set up and can go forever boondocking.  That being said, the CPAP takes priority and we use ice chests instead of the fridge, perk our coffee, and don't use the AC when we boondock.  We are old tent campers... so still consider it a luxury to be in the T@b even with no amenities that require power.  I take a nebulizer along in case there is lots of smoke from fires.  It works great with our set up... and @VictoriaP is right that the 12v plug or an inverter plugged in to the 12v works great.  Remember it will not work great with things that heat up like hair dryers, coffee pots, etc.

You will have to prioritize what you need/want when you are camping and make choices based on your needs/ camping style... but I would encourage you to at least consider solar over a generator.

Denny16

We also went with Solar over getting a generator, looked into one, but did not want the added issues with a gas generator, and letting one run all night is a non-starter.  Yeti has some new lithium based Power Banks that can charge off solar and they have two units that will run an AC in the TaB.  Cost is more than the Honda, but it does not make any noise, and you can run it at night.  No fire danger either.
cheers

lkc001

@Denny16 They have power banks that can run an AC??  I'm going to have to check that out!  They have come so far with Solar in the last few years. . .. 

N7SHG_Ham

The biggest GoalZero (Yeti) is 3000wh. That would run an AC unit 2-4 hours I am guessing max and it costs $3500 with 200w of solar panels. As an example run time they show a Circular Saw (13 Amp) (1500 Wh) which might be close to an AC depending on Tab and which AC unit. The 200w of panels is shown as taking 18-36 hours to recharge. They list a six hour recharge time with 1200w, lot of portable panels! Weight is 70 pounds without the panels.

I don't think if you want to run AC any length of time that product will make you happy.

Can you run AC with LiFePo4 battery bank and solar? YES, but it is a huge system and probably $10k minimum. With a small trailer like a Tab, not enough roof real estate to mount the panels nor space to add a battery bank large enough. It could be done with the a full size pickup as tow vehicle and placing the batteries/power plant there and carrying maybe 2000w of portable panels, anything less is going to get you short run times for heavy loads like the AC.

DougH

I dunno, I run my air conditioner all the time, or at least frequently without shore power or a generator.

300W solar and I see at least 220W+ most non-winter cloud free days and 18A+ solar charging. 330Ah non lithium batteries. Yes the A/C unit can peak as high as 600W, but that's rare... with the compressor on it's usually in the 400-500W range, and I also usually run it in Eco mode cycling on and off which can extend cooling from 3 hours of run time to up to 6 hours or more depending on the thermostat setting before the battery bank drops to 50%.  And yup, it takes 10+ hours of solid sun to recharge it all the way to 100% with such a "small" system.  So no, at this point I can't reliably have 4 hours of compressor-on air conditioning day after day after day.  But T@bbers are known to kayak, bicycle, or do touristy things most of the day anyway, so we likely don't need 24h of A/C a day.

So my guess would be somewhere between the 300W and 2000W numbers, with a matching size battery bank.  That's only for the 320 T@B.  For a T@B 400 or larger all bets are off?

Mortons on the Move just went to a 2750W new solar setup on their 5th wheel.  They run air conditioning and everything else with no worries. Ever. 5000W inverter, and I think it was 8 Battleborns.

We need somebody here with a T@B 400 to put on 900W of solar and 900Ah of Lithium and then sit in the Texas Hill Country for all of July or August and let us know if they can keep the camper at 80F or lower the whole time. 

Maybe nüCamp will fund a 900W and 1200W experiment in preparation for the new T@B 540?

Denny16

Yeti has a new Yeti 1500X/ 3000X series that can deliver more power to run refrigerators and small AC units, long enough to cool down a small RV (hopefully).  

  Yes they are as much or more than a generator, especially if you include their portable solar panels.  But you are correct, the 3000 unit might only run the CoolCat AC for 2 to 4 hrs max compressor running time, so depending on its current draw after the compressor is running, and how long each compressor cycle is, you could get 4 to 6 hrs of run time, if the compressor cycles less frequently.  The more cycles (very hot weather) the more the compressor runs, and more power required.

  Yes it takes a full day to recharge, and I was thinking only using the AC at night to cool off before bed time.

The new X series seems to be doing something different than the original 1500/3000 units did to get more bang per amp hour of battery.
see: https://www.goalzero.com/product-features/yeti-x/?utm_campaign=Yeti_X_Out_of_Stock&utm_content=touchpoint_1_message_a&utm_medium=email&utm_source=zaius
cheers

TNOutback

Technology and cost has a ways to go yet before solar+L-Ion batteries will be cost-effective.  I have also yet to see a portable power lithium battery company like Battleborn or GoalZero make any kind of statement or pledge about responsible cobalt sourcing for their batteries.  Half of the world’s cobalt supply comes from DRC, a war-torn country which has a terrible track record of forced child labor and poor health and safety standards in the mines.  Other companies, like Tesla, Apple, GM, etc., have made responsible sourcing pledges, but I haven’t seen any kind of statement or pledge from Battleborn or GoalZero on this.

AirBoss

Cruious if anyone has the following set up to run their Cool Cat or Air 8 in the 400

Honda EU2200i inverter generator
Hutch Mountain Propane Conversion Kit for Honda
Microair Easy Start Module

Hutch Mountain claims the East Start eliminates the need for a companion Honda to start and run a 13K-15K A/C unit. 

One thing I do like about the conversion kit here is it does not eliminate the gas option. Most others I've found, so far, is an "either/or" scenario. If you install the kit, you lose the gas option. 

@TNOutback
A very good point, made well. Thank you for enlightening the forum. 

Denny16

@TNOutback, very good point.  Yes, this technology has a way to go yet, but seems to be moving in a good direction.  

@AirBoss, there have been posts here about using the Honda 2200i with the CoolCat, both with and without a soft start.  I too am leaning the same divas you due to costs for lithium alternatives, and practical use of larger units like AC.
cheers

N7SHG_Ham

@AirBoss I don't have those exact components, instead having the Genconnex conversion. I do not have the MicroAir Easy Start. The propane converted Honda 2200i will start and run the CoolCat, even in Eco mode. I haven't tried above 3000 feet elevation.

Even though the single Honda 2200i does work, I am probably going to add the easy start, as it seems that will make the generator and compressor much happier.

I went with the Genconnex due to no regulator on generator, very clean factory look to the Genconnex conversion and may be one of the few if not only kits that has a warranty and is EPA approved. You do go to single fuel only (propane).

AirBoss

@N7SHG_Ham
Thanks much. Good info. As much as I hate to drop $1700 on the Honda w/conversion and easy start it may be the direction to go. Runs what I need without needing to parallel a second genset and it's hard to argue with Honda quality. 

Denny16

You may want to get the generator and propane conversion first, and see how that works, as it seems several have stated it will run the CoolCar, so it should run the smaller Air8+.

Cheers

TNOutback

I need to amend my earlier comment about cobalt sourcing and Battleborn batteries.  Looking at the battery’s chemistry, Battleborn’s design uses a phosphate cathode, so they are not dependent upon cobalt like other designs.  Their battery design results in a higher/kWh cost, lower cell voltage, and subject to self-discharge more, but otherwise a safe design, less impacted by abuse or overcharging. However, GoalZero’s NMC chemistry battery, while lower cost, is cobalt-dependent.  Most of our lithium power tools also use this battery chemistry.

Watching this closely.  I‘ve already invested in a gasoline 2250 kW unit, but if I could find a good price point on a propane-only, I would go that route, but it looks like the only way to get the higher kW capacities is via a duel-fuel unit.  My Wen 2250 starts my Air8 with no problem.

Others have made the point, and I think it is a valid one, that the higher displacement of the Honda 2200kW unit gives it a leg-up on running through larger locked rotor/inrush current startups than the typical 79cc displacements, like my Wen generator.

AirBoss

Denny16 said:

You may want to get the generator and propane conversion first, and see how that works, as it seems several have stated it will run the CoolCar, so it should run the small Air8+.

Cheers

Good point, @Denny16
Likely how I'll move forward. 
Cheers

N7SHG_Ham

The reason I am thinking of the easy start is my built in EMS chatters like crazy due to what I am guessing is the low voltage disconnect relays struggling during that initial startup current. I suspect the initial draw of the compressor is causing under voltage disconnect. No issues with the CoolCat and the Honda 2200i on propane once running. In fact iirc the current is still a good bit under rating of the Honda.

Denny16

Sounds more like an issue with the EMS, some units do not like inverter power.
Cheers 

N7SHG_Ham

Fine running, I think it is doing what it is supposed to due to low voltage on initial surge.

Tundra57

I have a slow start on my 2019 Tab 400. I have a 2800 honda inverter generator. It looks like its open frame, but it has economode and is very quiet.

It will run my AC and the alde in 1kw mode. Only time i ran it all day was after a storm knocked out my house power. Ran overnight on less than a gallon. I could hardly hear it running outside. Starts first pull. I never leave gas in the carb nor let it run out of gas while providing power. Change oil regularly.

TNOutback

I’ve read some reviews on the Microair that says it hurts the performance of the air conditioner due to the longer cycle time on the soft start capacitor to ensure it cools off.  Anyone experienced reduced a/c performance with a Micoair installed?