Underbelly bolts keep breaking off on 2021 NuCamp Tab400

LammyWinn

Anyone else experiencing this on their brand new 2021 nuCamp Tab400 Boondock? Is this common for nuCamps? We got this new trailer and the bolts holding up the black panel on the underside keeps breaking off. We tried to remove one with a hand wrench so we can replace the 14 that broke on the drive back to our home and that bolt broke with one simple twist by me. We tried another and that broke and another I just tapped and that broke. Will more keep falling off? Any tips to fix this?

What should I do to get the broken bolts out? How does it corrode so fast? Did nuCamp use the wrong bolts for an exterior? Will the rest of my black underbelly fall out during a drive? Isn’t that a hazard? 

AirBoss

I trust you've contacted your dealer and advised nuCamp warranty folks? Does seem very strange. Perhaps a bad batch from the manufacturer.

And I'd not go much further with repairs unless and until you've resolved all the warranty issues related to this. 

falcon1970

Really strange.  If they had been over-torqued the heads would have damaged the Coroplast.  It is strange that so many have broken and that they seem so weak.  Are they steel screws or plastic?  Mine were steel self-tapping screws and several worked loose and disappeared somewhere on the highway.

Certainly notify nuCamp.

LammyWinn

Our dealership is over 1000 miles away. And a authorized dealer is more than 200 miles away. Going to give nuCamp a call. Otherwise, been pretty disappointed. 

rhyno

@LammyWinn please update us all when you hear back from nuCamp. We have a 400 set to start build on Feb 23. 

Hound

The failure of self tapping screws/bolts is a well known and widely studied issue in the manufacturering industry. There are a number of failure modes that could cause an over-torque failure without deforming the Coroplast. Some are: 1. Wrong size pilot hole. 2. Wrong size screw. 3. Wrong screw for the hardness of the metal. 4. Wrong insertion speed. 5. Lack of wax or oil lubrication if called for in the particular application. 6. Wrong torque setting associated with any of the aforementioned. 7. Wrong grade of screw. 8. Overheat of the screw during insertion. 8. And a number of other possible issues.

Since so many have failed on this one trailer there is likely one common thread (no pun intended), which may extend to others coming off the same production line. 

As an individual who spent most of my adult life investigating transportation accidents for the National Transportation Safety Board, I implore all Tab 400 owners to inspect your trailers to determine if you are missing any of these bolts. If this is a wide spread problem we need to make sure that NuCamp is not only fully aware of it, but also takes the required corrective action.

If the underbelly panel where to separate from the trailer while it was being towed, it has the clear potential to result in a multi-car catastrophic event!!!

Fitzpats3985

Do you have any pictures of the bolts you are talking about? Looking to check my 2021 400

Verna

My guess is they are self tapping screws.

I have sent a message to nüCamp. @LammyWinn, please call nüCamp Customer service tomorrow morning and have your name, address and VIN number of your T@B available.  They can only help if they know about it. 

LammyWinn

Update: So I went under the trailer and was able to pull out ONE good screw out of maybe 40. They are indeed self tapping screw. The screw has rust in them. I was also able to remove a few of the screws with the broken bolt head...and indeed those too had rust. These screws are NOT galvanized steel NOR are they stainless steel = RUST. 
I replaced what I could under the trailer with stainless steel screws.

Another testament to their poor quality control...I found protective glasses and LOTS of screws when I took off the under panel...which is corrugated plastic. I also have not heard back from NuCamp. 

I posted two photos, but it kept getting taken down.

To reply to @rhyno...If I knew then what I know NOW with ALL the problems we encountered with this trailer, I would not have purchased this trailer. Overall, it has been one big disappointment. 

bergger

Another disappointing lack of recent quality control.  We took delivery of our 2021 400 in March 2020 and so far, with the exception of the messed up solar wiring, we have not had any issues.  Not sure if things are slacking at the factory with the whole Covid thing and the possible increase in orders.  No excuses though.  Hopefully NuCamp will get back to you and make it right as they did in our case.  I'd be disappointed too.  

AirBoss

@LammyWinn
Can understand your disapppointment. Reach out to nuCamp Customer Service first thing in the AM and advise them of your issues, again if necessary. It certainly doesn't sound like SOP for nuCamp. They will take care of you, though. They do have that history.  

If you've found other issues from the factory perhaps you can share those as well so that others who own a '21 400 BD are made aware. As @Verna mentioned above, nuCamp can and does assist in these matters so long as they are made aware of them in a timely manner.

Good luck and here's hoping you resolve you issues soon and are back on the road again. 

Denny16

@LammyWinn have you been traveling with your trailer over winter slated roads?  The original screws on our Jan 2018 built TaB400 are fine, the dealer had them out to clean dirt out from on top the panel, and put them back in.

As for your photos getting deleted, they were probably over size, you need to reduce the pixel size/resolution to a medium quality before posting them.  See posting photos at the top of the forum main page.

Sounds like nüCamp ran out of galvanized screws, or had a bad batch of replacement screws that were not up to snuff or galvanized.  I agree stainless screws would have been better.  Since you are in NorCal Bay Area, did,you get the trailer from a local dealer?  If so, you should be able to get them to sort out all the issues you have been having.
cheers

Sharon_is_SAM

@LammyWinn - https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/47/what-size-should-my-posted-forum-photos-be#latest

Verna

@LammyWinn have you contacted nüCamp?  They were informed, and they were anxious to help you and get to the bottom of your problem. As I said before, they cannot help you if you do not contact them. 

manyman297

You found an entire pair of safety goggles under there!!? Yeah, stories like this do scare me and we’re due to take delivery of our 400 in the next month or two.

I listened to a podcast about the decline of Detroit auto manufacturing in the 70s and dealer service stations used to find tools and garbage in the door compartments of new cars. Stuff like this is inexcusable and pretty embarrassing for Nucamp. 

Man, I know they are known for quality but I have noticed a lot of issues being posted as of late. I’m sure they’re under the gun over there but if they screw the pooch on QC now at the height of production they’re going to be paying for it in reputation and warranty claims in the years to come. 

Now’s the time to really put quality and attention into every build since these trailers are basically rolling billboards and Nucamp has thousands of these out in the wild.

Denny16

Unfortunately, you only hear about the exceptions, not the many who are happy with their RVs or cars...

The OP has decided to sell his/her TaB, rather than deal with a few minor issues.
I had to deal with a floor replacement, that nüCamp provided without any issues. or questions.  Their service is second to none, and you are not going to find a better product anywhere else.  Sure there are issues, mistakes are made, but nüCamp stands by their product and customers.  And as Verna said, nüCamp can’t help if you do not ask...
cheers

LammyWinn

Denny16 said:

Unfortunately, you only hear about the exceptions, not the many who are happy with their RVs or cars...

The OP has decided to sell his TaB, rather than deal with a few minor issues.
I had to deal with a floor replacement, that nüCamp provided without ant issues. Their service is second to none, and you are not going to find a better product anywhere else.  Sure there are issues, mistakes are made, but nüCamp stands by their product and customers.  And as Verna said, nüCamp can’t help,if you do not ask...
cheers

If you read, I did ask for help and had not gotten a response. I also tried to get help when the hot water didn’t work and the heater didn’t work. Heard nothing back, so I (female) had to figure it out on my own. Now as another have stated a solar issue...make me now need to test that out too and see if that works properly. 

For the cost, there shouldn’t be these basic issues that could be resolved with proper QA. And hauling my trailer hundreds of miles each way to have something repaired is NOT ideal. 

Denny16

I agree 200 miles to the nearest dealer is a drive.  How long ago did yiu reach out to nüCamp?  Sometimes it takes more than one call.  We had to exchange a few emails to get our floor issue sorted, but sorted it was by the nearest dealer, not the original selling dealer.  Sorry you are not having a good experience.  

In your TaB For Sale listing you say you are in NorCal Bay Area.  There is a nüCamp dealer in SanJose, Salinas , Roseville and Ukahia. The distance from SanFrancisco to Ukahia is less than 150 miles. The distance from Sacremento to San Francisco is 87 miles, from Santa Rosa on the north side of the Bay Area to Monterey, Carmel and Salinas on the south side is around a137 miles.  Where are you located, that it is more than 200 miles to Sacremento, Ukahia, SanJose or Salinas?  I am just curious on this.  It takes me about a two hour drive to get from my location to the dealer in Ukahia, not so much a long distance, but back country mountain roads that are slow driving to get there.

I agree you should not have to crawl under the TaB and replace all,the sheet metal screws thst are holding the underbelly panel in, nor should you have to worry about the heating system not working correctly.  We are all here to help as a group, and according to Verna, nüCamp wants to help you sort this out.  Sometimes it takes more than just one call, try giving nüCamp another call to customer service, from the nüCamp website,  “If you need assistance, please contact Customer Service at (330) 852-4811.”

RV industry is not perfect, but if nüCamp is not giving you the service you want, doub’t any other manufacturer is going to either.  All the other small travel trailers I looked at were junk by comparison to the TaBs, quality wise.  The only one coming close was Airstream Bambi, or their new BaseCamp.  But they are even more expensive.
cheers

xdr

Denny16 said:

Unfortunately, you only hear about the exceptions, not the many who are happy with their RVs or cars...

The OP has decided to sell his/her TaB, rather than deal with a few minor issues.
I had to deal with a floor replacement, that nüCamp provided without any issues. or questions.  Their service is second to none, and you are not going to find a better product anywhere else.  Sure there are issues, mistakes are made, but nüCamp stands by their product and customers.  And as Verna said, nüCamp can’t help if you do not ask...
cheers

We had our floor replaced in our 2021 400BD due to minor bubbling in a few spots. It only showed up in hot weather. We sent pictures to NuCamp and talked to them over the phone. Nothing but outstanding service from them. As a retired manufacturing professional, I have dealt with lots of suppliers on quality issues. All companies have them, what sets the best apart from the pack how they deal with issues. NuCamp is solid.   

4ncar

...as I used to tell my employees & customers, "we all make mistakes, its what we do about them!"

LammyWinn

Since I already replaced all the underbelly screws with stainless steel screws and nuCamp hadn’t replied to my multiple emails...thank you all for your suggestions to calling them more than once or twice and letting me know they have outstanding customer service. When another issue arise, I will make sure I call and email more than once.

In your TaB For Sale listing you say you are in NorCal Bay Area.

As a convenience for if there are serious buyers interested, I would find a place to store the trailer out in the Bay Area. No one will drive out to Twain Harte/Long Barn.

ChrisFix

xdr said:

Denny16 said:

Unfortunately, you only hear about the exceptions, not the many who are happy with their RVs or cars...

The OP has decided to sell his/her TaB, rather than deal with a few minor issues.
I had to deal with a floor replacement, that nüCamp provided without any issues. or questions.  Their service is second to none, and you are not going to find a better product anywhere else.  Sure there are issues, mistakes are made, but nüCamp stands by their product and customers.  And as Verna said, nüCamp can’t help if you do not ask...
cheers

We had our floor replaced in our 2021 400BD due to minor bubbling in a few spots. It only showed up in hot weather. We sent pictures to NuCamp and talked to them over the phone. Nothing but outstanding service from them. As a retired manufacturing professional, I have dealt with lots of suppliers on quality issues. All companies have them, what sets the best apart from the pack how they deal with issues. NuCamp is solid.   

@xdr
What was the issue causing the floor to bubble? Did Nucamp replace the vinyl flooring, or the actual floor itself?
I have noticed a bubble near the dinette table leg on several occasions on my 2021 T@B 400 BD (like you, only when the interior was hot), but it goes completely away when the interior is at a normal ambient temperature - so I haven't paid it much attention. But if they replaced the floor due to this, I guess I need to investigate further.

manyman297

I have no doubt Nucamp has better customer service than most RV manufacturers but I think the bar is so low that you don't really have to try that hard in the first place. 

This is the same mentality that we all take with contractors. The bar is so miserably low with most trades that whenever one comes along that does a "decent" job we're ecstatic. Take that same guy and put him in an industry with a higher level of expectation and they'd drown. That's not to say there aren't amazing contractors because there are. It's just more the exception.

As a future owner of a 400 I am a bit on edge as I see people on the forum voice concerns about little issues turning into larger issues. I've gone through this already with the Forest River tent trailer we own now. Different animal but the quality is abysmal and I spent a lot of time rectifying many of the deficits it had from the factory. It was junk.

I'm still hopeful but I do feel like @LammyWinn is justified in her frustration. These aren't cheap trailers and they really should be flawless out of the factory door considering their mission statement is about quality. Like I said earlier, these are rolling advertisements for a fairly young, small RV manufacturer that is capable of doing some awesome stuff in the future. Now's not the time to be skimping on quality in favor of profits. Let Forest River do that.

Denny16

Lammy, you are even more out in the bonnies than I am.  That said, it takes me 4-hrs to get to the Bay Area (Golden Gate Bridge) when traffic is light.  You are about 2.5 to 3 hrs driving time to either Roseville or SanJose.  

What we did, was make up a list of issues on the TaB400, contacted nüCamp and our nearest dealer (Ukahia), who was not the original selling dealer for our TaB, and scheduled a trip to them when all the required parts had arrived.  They kept the trailer for several months, got all the issues resolved, fixed, including replacing the floor under warranty, front window under warranty, sealed holes in the floor, and added the Boondock Pitched axle and wheels.  Vogel RV was grand in getting it all fixed back up.

One trip to take the trailer in and one to pick it up, in time for a camping trip (shake down cruise) to Lake County, Clear Lake for a week.  This way, if any new issues came up, we could drop it back off on the way back home to the Lost Coast area.  As it worked out, everything was grand, and no further issues.

Good luck with your TaB, hope you get all the issues resolved to your satisfaction.  

Cheers

manyman297

@LammyWinn I noticed you bought your 400 from ParrisRV. I'm assuming it's the ParrisRV in Salt Lake City? How was your experience with them?

We actually may have hung out in your exact trailer on their lot. I think that configuration was the only one they had there at the time (we were there maybe in late November).

LammyWinn

manyman297 said:

@LammyWinn I noticed you bought your 400 from ParrisRV. I'm assuming it's the ParrisRV in Salt Lake City? How was your experience with them?

We actually may have hung out in your exact trailer on their lot. I think that configuration was the only one they had there at the time (we were there maybe in late November).

We have a home in UT, and our family has purchased several 5th wheels from them before. They are ok...not the best compared to other dealers in other states. They didn’t really adjust anything or setup anything before handing over the trailer. The walk through was quick and even though the trailer was winterized, we asked to test the hot water, but they just said it should be good...it wasn’t.

My one suggestion is to only buy the trailer and not any of their other stuff they try to sell you or say you’ll need. And make sure they set everything up, ie hot water and heating (glycol) in tank...before you leave the lot.  

The dealer was fair and quick at completing the transaction. 

They were the only place with a new T@B 400 BD in the west coast for immediate purchase besides Montana. 

Denny16

@LammyWinn did the Alde work to,provide heat when you finely got to test it.  Or was it just not heating water?  When the TaB leaves the factory,Mtge hot water mixing valve in the Alda compartment is set on low.  You can readjust this to her the water temp in then hot water lines to a higher temp.  Then the Alde control panel needs to have hot water option turned on to mid point, or high for showers, which times off to the mid point.

You also need to open the hot water taps when water is connected up, set the Nautilus vale position correctly and get water back into the Alde hot water heating units, which consists of both the main boiler and Flo tank.  You can open the safety valves in the Alda compartment floor (yellow flip up handles) and see water do out the bottom drain under the trailer.

The Alde has a fairly steep learning curve, and is not very intuitive.  Give the Alde manual a good read, and ask questions here if necessary.
cheers

xdr

@ChrisFix
When I took it in they tried to replicate the bubbling by bringing it up to 88 deg. They could not replicate it. When we had bubbling, I feel sure that the interior was a bit hotter than that. 
They suspected that there was less glue in that spot. Ours was just outside the bathroom door and the fear they had was that there would be water damage. They did not find any water damage when they took it out. 
They took out the underlayment and vinyl flooring and replaced it all. The floor looks perfect. They completed it and the other mods in 3 days. Austin took the time to answer all questions and the service dept was great. 

We tried to get the floor fixed locally, but our nuCamp dealer who lives ten minutes away refused to work on it because we did not buy it from them. Actually he said he didn't want to work on it but would 'work it in if he had a chance in a few months'. His response to us did not give us confidence in having it done well. 
We made the decision to take the trailer all the way back to Ohio, a 3000 mile round trip. It was planned as a Christmas break vacation but because of covid, I had to travel without my wife. A son joined me midway and it turned out to be a great trip. 
Long story to say that we took it back, we are glad we did, and the nuCamp crew did a fantastic job. 

ChrisFix

xdr said:

@ChrisFix
When I took it in they tried to replicate the bubbling by bringing it up to 88 deg. They could not replicate it. When we had bubbling, I feel sure that the interior was a bit hotter than that. 
They suspected that there was less glue in that spot. Ours was just outside the bathroom door and the fear they had was that there would be water damage. They did not find any water damage when they took it out. 
They took out the underlayment and vinyl flooring and replaced it all. The floor looks perfect. They completed it and the other mods in 3 days. Austin took the time to answer all questions and the service dept was great. 
mer

@xdr
Thanks.
I've observed the bubbling after driving in the 90+ summer heat, where the interior was over 100...so I agree with you that 88 probably wouldn't reveal the issue. 
Guess I should give nucamp a call and talk to them about this, because I have that exact same issue, and if that requires a new floor, I sure want to get it on record while it is under warranty. 
I do wonder what happened with the 2021 models during assembly that is leading to this issue.

LammyWinn

Thanks @Denny16
The Alde finally worked in providing both heat and hot water after adjusting everything and attaching a hose that wasn’t attached going into the Alde. The hose was pinched shut (capped?) but was left lingering just under the Alde. QA issue I guess.

The heat is still finicky and draining glycol like crazy. Already needing to refill the glycol. Otherwise, after 3 days of troubleshooting, figured it out. 

The Alde has a fairly steep learning curve, and is not very intuitive.  Give the Alde manual a good read, and ask questions here if necessary.

There’s an Alde manual??? We weren’t given an Alde manual in our packet of documents when purchasing. Is there a PDF version somewhere online? 

Denny16

Chris, the lack of glue would cause a bit of raised spot when the air under it heated up, lifting the Lino.  Azdel does not rot, it can get wet, then dry back,out without any damage.  Limiting the moisture barrier to check for moisture or signs of the bower leaking is good, and re-gluing a new layer back down insures it is relaid back properly to prevent any future lifiting.  

The tech at our dealership, spent time with Austin at nüCamp learning about and  assisting in coming up with how to replace the 2018 recalled TaB floors that had a delaminating issue.  This was why our floor was replaced, as part of this recall.
cheers