Any Thoughts On How To Isolate a Water Leak Source?

MuttonChops

Background:

I've now had two water-in-the-cabin events.
The first had about 1/8 inch of water over nearly the entire floor surface.

The second had a much smaller amount, 1/16 inch, over the same general area.

I thought the first event was my fault as I had just used a hand-wand car wash to clean the outside of a very muddy trailer.  So I though maybe the water pressure and water angle was too great.  We also had a heavy/windy rain downpour between the car-wash and water-the-cabin discovery.  And to increase the difficultly the water-in-the-cabin was not discovered until I was on the road.  That is the trailer sat for some days with water in it. While I was loading for a trip and there was no visual or other sign the trailer had water on the inside.  I generally have the trailer parked for storage without it being level fore-aft.  For event one I believe the trailer had been stored with the rear slightly lower - - - so water pooled along rear of bench seat storage area - - - which I did not detect.

Once on the road with the trailer more level and some good road vibration the water was discovered at my first Rest Stop, stop.

Every time it rained after that I would inspect the cabin . . . but never found any standing water.  This reinforced my hand-wand car wash theory.

All seemed fine until the second event.  Trailer was parked for storage and level.  We had a steady 20-hours light rain storm before I hitched up and started by drive.  Before hitching up I inspected the cabin floor - - - no water was visual.

However, at the first Rest Stop, there was the 1/16 inch of water.

Current Thinking:

The first event had the trailer sitting after the car-wash washing.  The day I discovered the water, during my trip, was a dry day with dry roads.

Each time I checked the trailer after rain storms the cabin seems dry.

I also was camped in a heavy rain while traveling in Montana.  During the rain and after the rain no water was visible in the cabin.  Special Note:  When I left that campsite the roads were dry as it was a few days after the storm.

The second event started with the cabin seeming dry, the water was discovered after driving for two hours on wet roads.  You know the ones that have lots spray until the sun dries out the pavement.

So I'm thinking the water is being forced into the trailer while driving or while hand-wand washing.
Wheel Wells are the first suspect.  The drive side is dry, the passenger side is wet but I can not determine if that is because that is the point the water-in-the-cabin has been draining or if it is the source.  Of course since the water does drain there resealing is needed but how to determine there is not another water source point?

Additional Info:

 ++ The Alde compartment and Driver side wheel area (WFCO Power Center) seem to be staying dry.

 ++ There has been water over the entire 'walking area', under the Fridge, in the passenger wheel well, and under bench (non-Adle) area.

 ++ There is floor damage due to the water.  I have had communication with nüCamp and I am still in the process of investigating how much damage and what repairs might be possible.

Request:

How would you find the water intrusion location?

Denny16

The only floor damage on a 2018, is going to be to the Lino possible lifting from the underlayment layer of the composite floor assembly.  The TaB floor is all composite, Greencore on the bottom, insulation and Azdel layer bonded on top. If you have the Infinity woven floor covering, I doubt any water got under it, as this is a waterproof marine deck and sole material, and is in one piece on a 320.  There isn’t any plywood on a 2018 floor to get damaged by water.  The Azdel and Greencore are also waterproof and will not rot, buckle or get damaged even if they get wet.

Hope you find out how the water is getting in.  You can check the seal around the door for any gaps when it is closed.  Our 2018 TaB400 has a small gap around the door latch area, but so far no water has come in here.
 Cheers 

Yoshi_TAB

Hi, As a suggestion, could you take it to  a hand car wash with a wand and do one side at a time, conducting an inspection after each side?  Line some paper towels along the entire inside perimeter which may show where the water is coming in.  You can use painters tape to hold them in place where they may not stay.  Is it possible that the water could pooling somewhere and when you hitch it up, the fore and aft angle could be different than when sitting level unhitched?  The pooled water would then move toward the low spot.  Again, using paper towels to help locate the leak. 

Another idea is too use a leaf blower to pressurize the interior (via a window) of your TAB, then use soapy spray solution to spray around the outside perimeter.  The soap bubbles should show up where air is escaping.  Good luck

BrianZ

I seem to recall there was a maintenance bulletin some years ago about checking seals around wheel wells and under the door, where road spray could enter.  This included removing the outside fenders over the wheel wells to inspect seals.
Edit:
Here it is..
https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/2895/attention-special-factory-maintenance-notice/p1

cottonmouth

Could you have sprayed water into the a/c vent? If you weren't level, it may not have drained properly. Same with the original leak. If you were running the a/c, and the trailer was low on the back end, the water from condensation may not have drained from the pan.

Bayliss

On a recent three-month trip, we hit some very strong and windy rain storms around the Great Lakes area and Oklahoma.  Somehow, water entered the trailer and was visible on the floor, generally between the side entry and the shower.  We discovered the water within a couple hours and were able to clean it up, but I was unable to determine how it got there.  I seem to recall at some point during our trip that outside light was visible near the lower part of the side entry door near its rubber seal, so I need to take another look at that as being the possible source of the water.  If so, I'm not sure how to deal with that, because there does not appear to be any easy way to adjust the door, which may not have been properly aligned at the factory.

AnOldUR

Bayliss said:

I am now planning on closing those off completely so I do not have a repeat experience during heavy rain storms.  Also, we get way too much cold air entering the trailer compartment through those vents, so that is another reason to close them off.

I'll be interested to see how you approach this. Blocking them off with a plate is an option. Even though the old refrigerator gas vents were a commercial product, I had a hard time finding something the same size to replace them. The closest I could get were these Boat Deck Hatches from Great Lakes Skipper, but there's probably something better out there.

schwartzki

I had several leaks just after picking up my new trailer this year. Luckily I was camping right by the dealer that weekend and dropped it off at the end of the weekend. Left wheelwell, back of the AC was leaking inside and bottom of the entry door. Dealer got all of them fixed and it has been dry since.

I now check under cabinets, floor after washing/driving in rain to ensure it is staying dry. 

Bayliss

@AnOldUR, thank you very much for your post.  The boat deck hatches shown in your photo are an excellent option, so I will definitely check them out.  Were they a perfect fit and easy to install, or did you have to do anything special to make them fit?

@schwartzki, that is crazy that you had a leak around the wheelwell on a new trailer.  I have a 2019 and the caulking still looks good, but I check it occasionally since leakage there is a known issue.  I keep the trailer covered and stored under a roofed storage facility, so that likely has helped a great deal.

AnOldUR

@Bayliss the width of deck hatches were good, but I had to make the vertical size of the opening a little bigger. It was not an easy job, but not that difficult. The stress of taking a saw to the side wall was the worst part.

Bayliss

Thanks for the additional info, @AnOldUR.  It is very helpful.

MuttonChops

So far I've only completed part of my Visual Inspection for Water Entry points.  And have found two promising spots in the wheel well area.

I'm still in the process of removing the belly air-flow shield so I can inspect the floor bottom .  .  .  .
expect re-installing the air-flow shield will be a real pain .  .  .  . 

MuttonChops

Minor update:
Today I tried the 'light test' . . . . for leak detection
All lights on in the cabin, see if any light is coming out well after dark . . .

But of course there is no smoking gun.  Not a big surprise as water will travel a zig-zag path and light won't but it was worth trying.

Bayliss

@MuttonChops, did you check around the side entry door seal as well.  Specifically, down at the bottom or lower side of door?  You could also check it in the dark with all lights inside the trailer "off" while having someone shine a bright light along the length of the door frame from outside the trailer.

I have never had any water infiltration prior to our most recent trip.  This includes no water penetration in the side bench compartments (where the wheel wells are located), the Alde compartment, or the rear bench/storage area.  I specifically checked those areas during our trip and all remained dry.  Also, the last time I checked the seals around the wheel well area there were no issues or separated caulking observed.

Unlike your situation, we discovered the water infiltration in the kitchen area within a couple hours (two separate incidents during our trip, but fairly close in time by days.)  Thus, we were able to use some towels to soak up the water before it could travel to any other area of the trailer.  That particular area (generally below the sink) has always had a slight "soft" spot at one location of the vinyl flooring.  However, it is minor and hasn't been something we were concerned about.  I suppose we just assumed it was normal with the soft vinyl flooring, but maybe not.  But, last weekend we discovered what feels like what can best be described as a "lump" (raised flooring?) in the same area you have described where there is a seam between the two underlayment sections of flooring come together below the interior vinyl flooring.  I don't know why that has suddenly appeared.  Maybe the glue/sealant between the vinyl and underlayment has failed/separated?  Regardless, it was not noticeable when we thoroughly cleaned our trailer (inside and out) after returning from our most recent trip at the end of October.  We noticed it for the first time this past weekend. 

While I had the trailer home, I also removed the coroplast cover under the frame to take a look at the fresh water tank and plumbing due to a water line blockage.  At that time, I do not recall any visible sagging above the axle, but I wasn't actually focusing on that area of the trailer.  I happened to take a photo of the the fresh water tank.  It is supported by a metal frame and is situated just slightly above the axle (i.e., not resting on the axle.)  I do not know if that is how it was oriented when we purchased the trailer.

ALSO, RE YOUR ORIGINAL POST, you wrote: "The drive side is dry, the passenger side is wet but I can not determine if that is because that is the point the water-in-the-cabin has been draining or if it is the source.  Of course since the water does drain there resealing is needed but how to determine there is not another water source point?"  I am unclear if you suspect the water may be draining toward the passenger side, or if you have actually determined it is "draining" away in that area.  IF you know it is draining there, how did you determine that, and where is it draining to?  Thanks!

MuttonChops

Bayliss said:
. . .  I am unclear if you suspect the water may be draining toward the passenger side, or if you have actually determined it is "draining" away in that area.  IF you know it is draining there, how did you determine that, and where is it draining to?

Twice now after driving on wet/rainy highway I've stopped at road side Rest Stops.
These rest stop 'truck, trailer parking areas'  were not level but nearly so.

Both times water was draining, as in a stream of water, from aft of the Passenger wheel well.
At this time I still suspect the draining is the result of seal failures on the inside of the trailer as damaged materials are visible while on the outside I've not found any clear gaps of missing sealant/material.

As noted in early comments - - - rain when the trailer is stationary does not appear to enter the trailer, while driving on a wet road does get water in the trailer - - - So far the one passenger wheel well outside sealant gap (front side) is the only possible water enter point found.

My greatest fear is after months of drying the floor structure and resealing the vinyl back down to the floor structure - - - my next wet road drive will again include water in the trailer.

Bayliss

Thank you for the additional info, @MuttonChops.  Next time I bring my trailer home, I am going to re-check the seal under the entry door and both wheel wells.  If I find anything, I will note it here, but I just spent the weekend doing other work on the trailer and put it back in storage, likely for a while since XMAS is fast approaching.  Good luck with your troubleshooting.  If you do get a chance to check the side entry door with a light source to see if there are any openings, I will be interested in hearing the result of that examination.  I will continue to follow this discussion.

stepheng

I have been reading about sealing wheel wells. Has anyone had tried removing the wheel and spraying or brushing Flex Seal over the entire wheel well area. I’ve used the brush-on between window flange and framing when installing new windows in home remodel applications and it works great. It comes in black and is very flexible.