Best Portable Solar and how many watts is best?

TerryV6

Thanks.  When the postman makes his delivery, all will become clear...

”this is an addition...” I  got up early this morning, I volunteer on Fridays.  That’s not important to the discussion, just a personal point.  Anyway, I’ve tried to examine my own confusion on this issue.  I went back to the renogy site and saw the pictures of the panel didn’t show the cables, so I “assumed” that I came with a cable with alligator clips and one with a plug in type.  Thinking that and seeing the reverse polarity adaptor, I figured that I plugged that into my port, and plugged the solar cable into the adapter... Easy Peasy ...   Apparently, this isn’t the case, but I’ll figure it out once the unit arrives.  

Side note:  I just bought a better surge protector.  We made the jump from a tent to the Tab and my wife had said, once we get the camper, we are set.  If we decide to go someplace on the spur of the moment, we will just have to hitch up and go...  Not so, I found out....   It will be our last purchase.  Not so, I found out....    It will be a simple small camper, with little additional knowledge required.  Not so, I found out....  

Joe

Here is my setup:

- Renogy 100 watt solar panel
- SAE connector (I used a multimeter to make sure polarity is correct)
- 100 AH AGM battery
- Charge controller
- Marine battery switch
- DIY solar panel stand

The battery switch goes between the charge controller and the solar panel.  The charge controller needs to know if the battery is 24 volt or 12 volt and it can only determine this if you connect the battery to the charge controller before the solar panel.  Thus, I plug the solar panel in with the switch set to off.  Once the charge controller figures out the battery voltage I turn on the switch, which allows the solar panel to charge the battery.  

Photo below in Ouray CO.

Sharon_is_SAM

TerryV6, I believe you bought the panel with the controller, but is the controller attached to the panels or free to be placed closer to the battery?  

If it is attached, the short wires coming from the unit end in MC4 connectors which will connect to the above cables which terminate in MC4s.  The kit also comes with very short wires with a fuse ending in battery clips - you could easily cut off the alligator clips and place an SAE on the end wired for the Zamp outlet.  But the easiest thing is to get the SAE adapter.  One more thing, you will need an MC4 to SAE adapter inline ahead of the SAE to SAE adapter.  Also, call Renogy as you need a fused line that connects to the battery and you will need the MC4 tool to take apart the MC4 connectors.  

ScottG

@TerryV6, unless Renogy has changed their suitcase configuration since I bought mine two years ago, it does not come with a "plug in type" cable--at least not in the sense that I think you are referring.

If memory serves, mine came with <10' cable that had MC4 connectors on one end and bare wire on the other. The bare wire connected directly to the controller which was mounted on the suitcase. The MC4 end connected to MC4 pigtails on the battery clamps.

In order to use my Renogy suitcase with the Zamp port on the T@b tub, I cut off the battery clamps and replaced them with a separately purchased  SAE connector. When I spliced the connector in, I was careful to match the polarity of the Zamp port, eliminating the need for a "reverse polarity adapter" or other additional hardware.

Freshaire

Thanks @TerryV6 for asking the questions.  I have ordered the 100W suitcase and am waiting fore delivery to see if I can make any sense out of the cables and connections.  Your questions and the answers are helping both of us.  Thanks @pthomas745 for sharing your knowledge with the group at large.  You never know who is lurking and listening. 

Sharon_is_SAM

You folks can always call Renogy in advance and have them walk through your plans.  They are very helpful!

TerryV6

Even after ordering?

pthomas745

Keep in mind I had many questions about how the solar panels worked with the Tab when I bought mine last year.  With the help of many others on these forums, they helped me with the answers. 

mgreen2

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01N1TALFY/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_10?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER

Sharon_is_SAM

Terry - just give them your order number, tell them you have a Tab with a Zamp outlet and they will tell you exactly what you need.

TerryV6

Sam,  I was going to post and let you know that is what I am going to do.  I figure I’ll share that info here then.. I’ll be on the road tomorrow, so I’ll probably give them a call on Monday..

Ratkity

I have the 37# 100W renogy suitcase. My cables are about 1 ft and have MC4 connectors at the end. I have the 20' extension cables. They are not enough to find the sun if camping. Right now I'm using them to maintain the battery on the toy hauler. With all the phantom power in the toy hauler, my battery goes down to 12.55V overnight, the MPPT controller (Victron) goes into bulk mode for 2-4 hours depending on the shade/sun/rain and then the battery is topped off and it goes into float mode. It rarely goes into absorption for some reason. 

I have the Live Data app for the Victron controller. It is way too cool to see the historical data. 

Keep in mind, I have a turn off switch installed on the Jenson Unit and I have no 12V TV inside. What is the hog is the Maxx remote control, rain sensor fan. The rest is the same as the T@B: usb ports, converter, CO/propane sensor, the tiny bit the solar controller uses, and the SeeLevel panel.

TerryV6

Well, I received my solar panel yesterday and I have to say I'm pretty happy.  The Sale site had said that these panels are refurbished, and to expect some scratches, dents etc.  I opened the box and and I would say that my panel is brand new, not a mark on it anywhere.  It looks very well made.  It has the two connectors coming off the controler and also includes a cable with connectors at one end and alligator clips on the other.  I sent off a question to Renogy technical support which is listed below...

===================================================

I have a Tab camper with the Zamp plugin.  I just purchased your excellent Renogy 200 watt solar panel suitcase, order #59334.   I realized that theire was an issue with reversed polarity.  I am not an electrical wizard, but I tried to figure this out. 

So, after much searching, I’d like to know if I’m on the right track using the installed plugin.  I would plug in the optimate to the Zamp.  Then, I’d plug in the Renogy mc4 to save adapter.  Finally, I’d use the extensions to connect to the panel.  Is there a length limit?   Do I need the Optimate, or is it the same as the Renogy mc4 to save adapter.  Also, what kind of fused line is anyone talking about?  I know, I should just use the clips and skip the Zamp plug.  Also, I realize that this particular question gets asked a lot.  But, I sure could use the help.

Terry Van Domelen

Links to products:

OptiMATE CABLE O-27, Adapter, polarity, SAE

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00AHCWGOO/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

RENOGY MC4 to SAE Adaptor

https://www.amazon.com/RENOGY-MC4-to-SAE-Adaptor/dp/B01N1TALFY/ref=pd_bxgy_263_img_2?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=3CBXJVND9EDRVZGPWBG7

Finally, Someone said I am limited to about 20 ft. of extension cable.

One Pair 20 Feet Black + 20 Feet Red 10 Gauge Solar Panel Extension Cable Wire MC4 Connector

https://www.amazon.com/Black-Gauge-Solar-Extension-Connector/dp/B01D7VBKQG/ref=pd_sim_263_4?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=3CBXJVND9EDRVZGPWBG7

===================================================

Here is their response:

Hi Terry,

Thank you for reaching out to us and choosing Renogy. We have had customers purchase our suitcases and use the Zamp connectors on their RVs, a few have reported reversed polarity at the Zamp connector. Unfortunately, we have not been able to perform any tests to verify if there is reversed polarity in some of the Zamp connectors. We would recommend always using a digital multi-meter to establish a positive voltage reading and confirm polarity. If you determine that your RV has reversed polarity at the Zamp port, you can disconnect the battery cable from the Adventurer charge controller and reverse the polarity by inserting the positive battery cable into the negative battery terminal and doing the opposite with the negative battery cable. We would not recommend extending the battery cables between the charge controller and battery bank by more than 10 feet. If you wish to have a longer distance, we would recommend replacing the entire battery cable with 10 AWG wire.

We would recommend contacting Zamp solar and purchasing the MC-4 to Zamp adapter they offer to ensure compatibility. Please let me know if I can be of further assistance or if you have any follow up questions, have a wonderful day.

===================================================

I did  see this link on a Jayco site:

https://www.jaycoowners.com/forums/f18/convert-zamp-pre-wired-rvs-to-standard-mc4-connectors-43052.html

So, my question to anyone here is, maybe it would be better for me to just plug in the cable with the alligator clips, raise the tub cover and clip the leads directly to the battery..  Yes?

I am calling this message, War and Solar Peace, as it is so long....  no Russian names though...

Sharon_is_SAM

Terry, ultimately you need to do according to your comfort level, but the Zamp solar outlet is plug and play and it would be a shame not to use it. Renogy is of course going to tell you to check with a multi-meter as it is not their product and they do not want the liability. You do not need to do that as you can see the wiring at the battery and you can tell which part of the SAE is positive and which is negative.  Renogy is giving you permission to simply align the solar outlet wires on the battery and then plug in the Renogy.  At that point the issue of reversed polarity is solved.  In addition, the Renogy tech addressed extending the battery cables which was not your intent, rather you wish to extend the solar panel cables to add distance from the RV.  You can easily use up to 30 feet of 10 gauge cable without significant voltage drop.  The alligator clip positive wire is fused (15 amp) so no need for further fuses, just would need to add your extension cables and plug into the alligator cable.

 You have 3 options that avoids changing any wires at the batteries and you can use the 20 feet cables:

1.  use the Renogy MC4 to SAE adapter and the Optimate adapter
2.  buy the Zamp MC4 to SAE adapter
3.  or just hook the panels to the extension cables to the battery cables

Keep in mind, the Optimate adapter can also be used for a battery tender plugged into the Zamp outlet that requires opposite polarity of the Zamp outlet - or just hook the battery tender directly to the battery.

pthomas745

I guess Renogy has never heard of the Zamp connector despite 80 million emails from their customers and internet forum discussions.  They simply ignored your question and said "good luck" since they don't want to be anywhere near the dreaded Zamp issue. (You can hardly blame them.)

Your alligator cables will work out of the box.  SAM's other options will work, also.  You are almost there!

ScottG

@TerryV6, just to clarify, your controller is mounted right on the panels, correct? 

seajeeper

Rather than buying the $25 adapter, just switch the wires at the battery for the existing Zamp (SAE) connector and remove the Zamp sticker.  Then the plug works with the battery tender and the MC4 adapter to your charge controller.  I did this and added a label indicating polarity.

ChrisandAlexis

@seajeeper, isn't there a fuse built into the cabling that goes from the Zamp port connector inside the TAB tub to the positive lead of the battery? If you reverse the cable leads to the battery, would the fuse still work to protect the Zamp circuitry?

ScottG

I don't recall a fuse between the Zamp port and the battery. On my Renogy suitcase, a fuse was incorporated between the controller and the positive battery clamp.

On a related note, some batteries have different size posts on the positive and negative terminals. Swapping the Zamp leads may require changing out the ring terminals.

ericnliz

On my set-up (Renogy 100w suitcase w/controller) I incorporated a fuse in the extension line from the controller TO the Zamp outlet on the side of the tub. I got it on Amazon...it came with a waterproof holder & fuse the you connect in-line.

ScottG

Yes, that is a good point. If you replace the clamps with something else (like an SAE connector) be sure to also include a fuse holder in the positive line! 

seajeeper

I'll have to look tonight, but if there was I would have cut it off and added one on the pos.

TerryV6

Patience oh wise ones.....
  
But, further questions...So, if I switch two wires, the red and white from the zamp plug to the battery posts, and I can just use the Renogy MC4 to SAE adapter?  Is this what everyone is recommending or is the optimate to the Renogy MC4 to SAE adapter a better way?  Like the TV show... What would you do?  Some say they wouldn't do the wire switch.  Also, like I could figure out how to test for reverse polarity....  That would be a whole bunch of new things to figure out.  Youtube here I come.....

Then, I looked online and found 30 foot cables:
 https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01D7VBLME/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A2TN19FHI2Z5KL&psc=1

Okay?

Lastly, I see the fused line on my battery lines with the alligator clips.  I'm trying to figure out if an extension line is available with one that I would swap with one of the cables mentioned above.

A quote:
"I incorporated a fuse in the extension line from the controller TO the Zamp outlet on the side of the tub. I got it on Amazon...it came with a waterproof holder & fuse the you connect in-line."

I don't see this Eric.  Any links...  Or is this a fuse I have to cut the line and add to.?

Master:  Grasshopper, a long journey begins with the single step....
Yes Master, but what happens when one trips and falls......

Funny, I've seen a lot of discussion in other places on this forum about this, many questions I am asking were asked by those who are now giving advice...

My wife, working in IT, fielding a computer question by first asking, is it plugged in?

 

Sharon_is_SAM

If you switch the solar outlet wires on the battery, you can avoid using the Optimate Cable.  You can use this (Renogy MC4 to SAE adapter).  https://www.renogy.com/renogy-mc4-to-sae-adaptor/

You would also need to fuse the positive 20 foot extension cable leading from the panels.  I looked at the Renogy site and the current alligator clip cables has a 15 amp fuse, no?  So, if you don't use the alligator clips and you plug into the solar outlet, you need a fused line.

Ratkity

Keep it simple. I think @SAM made a great suggestion (as others have done). I do want to caution that 20 ft of extension cables aren't quite enough! I have the Renogy 100W suitcase and am using it to keep the battery going. The suitcase doesn't have a controller because I obtained a Victron controller. I have a bit more camper solar experience having installed panels on 3 campers. This time, I wanted to try portable. 20 ft is not enough, especially if routing around obstacles to prevent tripping. Yes, I did almost trip.. fortunately, I was rolling the trashcan and didn't fall! This is an extreme form of recycling and I don't recommend it.

Sharon_is_SAM

Ratkity, I agree.  We have 30 feet of extensions and it works well.  

TerryV6

SAM said:

If you switch the solar outlet wires on the battery, you can avoid using the Optimate Cable.  You can use this (Renogy MC4 to SAE adapter).  https://www.renogy.com/renogy-mc4-to-sae-adaptor/

You would also need to fuse the positive 20 foot extension cable leading from the panels.  I looked at the Renogy site and the current alligator clip cables has a 15 amp fuse, no?  So, if you don't use the alligator clips and you plug into the solar outlet, you need a fused line.

Do they sell a positive fused line?  

Sharon_is_SAM

Terry, You do not need a different line.  Renogy sells a fuse that has MC4 connectors on each end called a “Waterproof inline fuse holder with fuse”.  Renogy recommended a 10 amp fuse and that is what we are using.  So, plug the fuse into the end of the solar panel positive wire, then plug the other end of the fuse into the extension, then plug the extension into the MC4 adapter, then plug into the TaB (after you change the wiring at the battery).  Make sure you buy the MC4 tool to use to help pull apart the connections.  You can do this!!!  I want pictures, too

ScottG

@TerryV6, If you are running 200W panels you probably have a larger capacity controller. While a 10A fuse is typical for 100W applications, a larger fuse may be called for with a larger controller.

According to Renogy's formula, a 200W suitcase (which would produce 10A at 20V) would call for a minimum 15A fuse when taking into account the safety allowance.

https://www.renogy.com/blog/how-to-fuse-your-solar-system/

Sharon_is_SAM

Good catch Scott.  Mine was for a 100 watt panel.