FOAM IN WALLS QUESTION - 2019 T@B 320 S

Bayliss

I have seen photos of a circular cutout of the side walls of a T@B camper.  The photo I reviewed shows foam/stryofoam between the Azdell and inside panel.  I would like to confirm if all T@B campers have foam throughout the exterior walls and within the aluminum framing.  Does anyone know for sure, or have any photos that show the interior of a framed wall (other than the already posted circular cutouts)?  Also, if there is an "R"-rating for the foam, does anyone know what it is?  I have read that T@B campers are a "3-season" camper per nüCamp; however, I would think that foam in the exterior walls would provide some winter protection.  It would have been nice if the pex and/or drain pipes had been insulated with foam during construction of the camper, but I suppose that could just create problems in the future, such as making it difficult to locate and repair leaks.  Thank you.

ChanW

Hi @Bayliss.

We can confirm that the Tab is useable in the winter, with a bit of ventilation to reduce condensation on the inner walls.

I wouldn't depend on the plumbing in cold weather. We thought we could keep the plumbing un-winterized one winter, during our  4 hour drive home in zero degree weather. But in a very short time the inside of the Tab was below freezing, and an icicle was hanging off the kitchen spigot! The Tab isn't as "airtight" as it seems, particularly at 50 mph!

Keeping the interior plumbing thawed while the Tab is stationary is not too difficult, by opening cupboard doors and the wetbath door to allow the warm air to circulate.

But keep in mind that you also would need to concern yourself with the external plumbing parts, ie: the drains for the waste tanks. You'd want antifreeze in the waste tanks' gate valve mechanisms, else any fresh water in those would freeze with the potential to crack the gate valves.

But winter camping is great with the Tab. The Alde kept us cozy at -5°F (minus 5 F!)

We did appreciate having the add a room tent to store our winter gear, coats and boots, etc.

Do a search here in the forum for winter camping. There's been a bit of talk here and there about it, and some have even modded the holding tank area for cold weather.

ScottG

Judging by the photos I've seen, I'd say the foam is standard extruded polystyrene (EPS). EPS has an R-value of a little less than 4 per inch. I'm not sure exactly how thick the walls are, but I'm guessing 1" is probably about right.

Of course--as is the case with a house--it's not the well-insulated walls where most of the heat escapes, but rather the holes in them such as windows and doors (which typically offer far lower insulation value). Also like a house, there's the factor of infiltration (i.e., air leakage).

Heat transfer physics aside, many hearty souls do use their T@Bs in the winter and live to tell about it!  :-)

Bayliss

Thank you @ChanW and @ScottG for the cold weather info.  Can either of you confirm that there is in fact foam included within the metal framing of the walls and/or the ceiling?  I assume there is, but maybe not.  If necessary, I'll contact nüCamp to get the low-down from them.

I agree that there are places for cold air to enter the cabin, even beyond the windows and doors.  The exterior shower has a pretty good size opening where the hose retracts back inside the camper, plus the door, although a good fit, is not sealed.  Air easily enters the Alde compartment at that location.  I may consider adding some thin weather stripping on the inside of that access door.  Also, the outside electrical outlet box has openings around it that allow some air to penetrate the passenger side storage compartment, which in turn is open to the inside of the camper.  I may put some type of weather stripping there as well, or spray a small amount of expanding foam there.  Beyond those locations, I suspect that there may be some openings around the plumbing that is covered by the corrugated cover on the bottom of the camper.

Sharon_is_SAM

You will benefit by removing the air conditioner trim and stuffing in foam weather stripping.  Also, cover the outside grill to prevent drafts.

Bayliss

Thanks @Sharon_is_SAM.  I have ordered the aluminum diamond plate cover made by Enhanced Performance Systems to seal off (when I am not running the AC, of course) the outside air that enters through the exterior AC opening.  However, some weather stripping around the inside AC trim will provide extra protection.

falcon1970

This from my TAB 400, but I expect that all TABs/TAGs will be the same.  The wall thickness (1 5/16") is from the inside of the inner wall to the outside of the outer wall.  The expanded polystyrene foam (EPS) is 1" thick.
For the curious, this hole is where the sewage hose storage tube goes.  The white base plate sits inside this hole with the 5" PVC electrical conduit tube glued to it and running transversely across the back of the trailer.

Bayliss

Thank you, @falcon1970.  That answers my question (assuming nüCamp configures all their campers the same, which seems likely), with photographic proof to boot!  Much appreciated.  (Greg)

Awca12a

@falcon1970 Curious if you happened to have that cover off and tube removed for a reason we can learn from?

falcon1970

@Awca12a
I found that my sewer hose (15' RhinoExtreme) wouldn't fit into the storage tube.  Well, it could be squeeeeeezed into the tube if I worked hard enough, but it was a real fight and the ends had to be stored elsewhere.  I realized that the storage tube did not go all the way across the TAB and the space at the end of the tube wasn't really useful for anything else so I decided to extend it all the way across.  It turns out the tube is a piece of 5" PVC electrical conduit.  The base plate and screw-on cap on the outside of the trailer are held on with 6 screws and silicon seal and are what the boating people call a "deck plate."  I have no idea how or why they are used on a boat.
The first problem I encountered was that the PVC tube was solvent welded to the base plate and I expected I would manage to destroy the base plate trying to get them apart.  I figured it would be easier to just use a new base plate.  All the deck plates on the internet were listed as 4" or 6" and I couldn't find out how that dimension was measured so I  called nuCamp. Of course, they directed me to my dealer.  Whitney, in Parts, knew what part I was talking about though and gave me the nuCamp part number (56-00-3982 if you care).  I called my dealer and he agreed to order it and have it shipped to me.
The next problem quickly became evident as I piddled with the tube and base plate. The 5" PVC electrical conduit is 5" inside diameter with 1/4" thick walls for an outside diameter of 5 1/2".  The base plate sleeve (where the tube fits) has a 5" inner diameter and a 5 1/4" outside diameter.  Since the tube needs to slip over the base plate sleeve I will have to figure out how to rout an 1/8" rabbet on the inside of the tube.  I have a plan, though.  Whether it works in practice is another matter.
I will post updates as I go if there is any interest.

ChanW

@falcon1970, did you check drain tile dimensions? It might be what you need.

falcon1970

@ChanW
Between the opening in the side of the TAB and the size of the PVC tube the dimensions are pretty well set.  It just seemed easiest to go with the original materials.

Awca12a

While putting together the spare parts list, it seemed logical that the cover would get lost at some point so I noted that the assembly is a Viking Manufacturing ABS5W per the attached draft copy of the spare parts listing that I've been working on.   Curious if the part you receive bears this marking.

Parts rev 2 posted

falcon1970

The problem with Viking Marine is the phone number on their website "is no longer in service' and they don't answer emails.  At least not yet.  Nor do they offer any way to purchase their products. 

Awca12a

Amazon lists it under ASIN: B07H8HDQ4Y

falcon1970

That sure looks like the one.  NuCamp charged me $13.20 but added $14.55 for shipping.  I can't imagine how they are shipping it for that price.               Prohibited comment deleted per Sharon_is_Sam

Bayliss

I posted the below video this morning on the"320 S Passenger Wall Frames & More = = What do we know?"  thread, but I am including it here as well since it helps answer my question about the foam insulation on the T@B 320 (S and CS).  I do not believe the video has previously been posted on this forum, but it provides a good depiction of how the camper is assembled.  The information I was particularly interested in  regarding the roof framing and insulation starts around 4:19 in the video.  (Greg)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YvzuQUGto-g

DougH

Another odd winter camping note.  If it's 0F outside, I just discovered the Norcold 3-way fridge doesn't know to warm the fridge up.  At least not on shore power electric.  For now I'm just leaving it off and periodically leaving the door open until a fridge thermometer inside reads 40F again.  But with the window shades open and a high of 20F, with the Alde set at only 50F, the sun has warmed the camper to 72F.