Shutdown National Campgrounds?

DougH
DougH Member Posts: 1,110
edited December 2018 in Camping & Travel
On the RV Miles podcast this morning they said the 12/22/2018 federal shutdown probably won't completely close all national parks.  If it's like the last one, BLM and other boondocking areas may mostly be gone, but National Parks and Monuments will largely be open, but with dramatically less services like no trash pickup, bathrooms, showers, or dump stations.  Last time the piles of trash got pretty disgusting.

The Grand Canyon has already stated they will remain open with alternative funding found for supporting services.  That may be the case for selected other parks / monuments as well. 

This (non-political please) thread is just to report any first hand experiences of which federal lands to avoid until the USA is open for business again. 

http://timetravellerwiki.com/2018/12/22/national-parks-to-stay-open-without-staff-in-government-shutdown-thehill-the-hill/


2021 Jeep Gladiator, 2021 tiny toy hauler, Austin TX
Former steward of a 2017 T@B S Max

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Comments

  • ChanW
    ChanW Member Posts: 3,165
    edited December 2018
    BLM  Boondocking areas would be shut down?

    I don't understand how?

    What am I missing?
    Chan  -  near Buffalo NY
    2014 S Maxx
    2011 Tacoma 4cyl ... edit: 2022 Tacoma 6cyl - oh yeah! 

     A_Little_T@b'll_Do_Ya
  • DougH
    DougH Member Posts: 1,110
    edited December 2018
    I didn't understand that either since those are service free zones.  Maybe I misheard the podcast, or they misspoke, or it's a policy that dispersed camping is closed when there's no rescue folks around?  I only see that making any sense in the national forest land boondocking areas. 
    2021 Jeep Gladiator, 2021 tiny toy hauler, Austin TX
    Former steward of a 2017 T@B S Max

  • DougH
    DougH Member Posts: 1,110
    edited December 2018
    Found some possible albeit old clarification... 

    https://www.desertusa.com/dusablog/blm-faq-government-shutdown.html

    Boat docks and some BLM  campgrounds closed, some BLM access roads closed, but most free camping areas still available.

    In TX we don't have much BLM land but there's a bunch of paid and free RV camping run by the Corps of Engineers.  They've said that's all closed during shutdowns.
    2021 Jeep Gladiator, 2021 tiny toy hauler, Austin TX
    Former steward of a 2017 T@B S Max

  • ChanW
    ChanW Member Posts: 3,165
    Ok, thanks for looking into it. That makes more sense. 
    Chan  -  near Buffalo NY
    2014 S Maxx
    2011 Tacoma 4cyl ... edit: 2022 Tacoma 6cyl - oh yeah! 

     A_Little_T@b'll_Do_Ya
  • Michigan_Mike
    Michigan_Mike Member Posts: 2,858
    I understand the concept (of saying BLM lands are closed to camping/access) but don’t know how they’d be able to monitor or enforce it given the vast expanse of lands across the US?  Would be interesting to see how they are all fairing in Arizona as it’s a virtual city in some of the areas around Quartzsite and down in the SW corner of the state.  
    Mike - Elmira, Mi / 2019 T@B 400 / 2021 Chevy Silverado LTZ
  • db_cooper
    db_cooper Member Posts: 749
    I've found with national parks that they keep a fair number of enforcement rangers working, I imagine BLM does too.   So far in all the recent shutdowns every federal employee still gets paid whether they had to report, so it makes sense to keep enforcement on the job.
    2015 Max S Outback | 2010 Xterra  -- Retired
    2022 Ford F350 Tremor |  2022 Cirrus 620



  • pthomas745
    pthomas745 Administrator, Moderator Posts: 4,594
    A lot of these determinations come down to "essential" and "non-essential" employees.  What one agency would consider essential, another agency might not.  So, there may be law enforcement employees working, but staffing at campgrounds or visitor centers will probably not be considered essential, so they close a campground or a visitor center. 

    These shutdowns are real disasters for all agencies, no matter what.  I was an air traffic controller and was considered "essential" (after Congress mandated a hard shutdown and then realized that controllers would stay home, too) but our support staff and anyone in a training status were not considered essential.  We had to use overtime budgets to staff some crucial support functions with controllers. 
    2017 Outback
    Towed by 2014 Touareg TDi
  • Ratkity
    Ratkity Member Posts: 3,770
    Essential employees have to report to work (even if they are on vacation). I'm a non-essential and just don't get paid. My friend (essential) has "use or lose" vacation time she was taking for a well-deserved break and was recalled to work. She loses the vacation time. Most managers with direct reports are recalled to come into the office for shutdown procedures for a half a day on Wed. 

    Of the 800k workers with approx half non-essential, many workers live paycheck to paycheck (I'm ok). There is a paycheck that's supposed to be out on Dec 31 within the agency I work. That paycheck doesn't get processed. 

    No politics, just think thoughts of strength for those who are struggling making ends meet during these holidays. Be gentle to those who are exhausted working double+ shifts to keep essential tasks going (e.g. wildfire firemen! [fire-people?] - just love to all of them). Military, I love you. I can't list all of you. Be safe, know this is not forever, and there are those who care. <3
    2017 820R Retro Toy Hauler from 2015 Tabitha T@B from 2009 Reverse LG Teardrop (but a T@Bluver at heart)
  • ChanW
    ChanW Member Posts: 3,165
    Yes, many military are working without pay too. 

    Sorry to hear that.

    Best wishes.
    Ratkity said:
    Essential employees have to report to work (even if they are on vacation). I'm a non-essential and just don't get paid. My friend (essential) has "use or lose" vacation time she was taking for a well-deserved break and was recalled to work. She loses the vacation time. Most managers with direct reports are recalled to come into the office for shutdown procedures for a half a day on Wed. 

    Of the 800k workers with approx half non-essential, many workers live paycheck to paycheck (I'm ok). There is a paycheck that's supposed to be out on Dec 31 within the agency I work. That paycheck doesn't get processed. 

    No politics, just think thoughts of strength for those who are struggling making ends meet during these holidays. Be gentle to those who are exhausted working double+ shifts to keep essential tasks going (e.g. wildfire firemen! [fire-people?] - just love to all of them). Military, I love you. I can't list all of you. Be safe, know this is not forever, and there are those who care. <3

    Chan  -  near Buffalo NY
    2014 S Maxx
    2011 Tacoma 4cyl ... edit: 2022 Tacoma 6cyl - oh yeah! 

     A_Little_T@b'll_Do_Ya
  • DougH
    DougH Member Posts: 1,110
    edited January 2019
    The Corps Of Engineers parks all (EDIT: mostly) seem to be closed for now... 

    2021 Jeep Gladiator, 2021 tiny toy hauler, Austin TX
    Former steward of a 2017 T@B S Max

  • Marceline
    Marceline Member Posts: 1,757
    San Francisco Bay Area
    2013 CS-S us@gi
    2015 Toyota Tacoma PreRunner Double Cab
  • T@Balong
    T@Balong Member Posts: 317
    Not all Corps of Engineer parks are closed.........I don't know if it is a case by case situation but where we are headed in mid January has a notice that it will be open during the shutdown.
    2015 T@B 320 S, 2019 Jeep Cherokee
    States Visited Map
  • DougH
    DougH Member Posts: 1,110
    I wonder if some municipalities, counties, or states kick in some funding to certain COE sites... 
    2021 Jeep Gladiator, 2021 tiny toy hauler, Austin TX
    Former steward of a 2017 T@B S Max

  • jkjenn
    jkjenn Member Posts: 6,422
    This was my experience in the Tetons in 2013....it was quite a show. It seems as though they are trying not to disrupt people's plans. 


    2021 T@b 320 Boondock "Mattie Ross" | 2021 T@b Nights: 239 | Total nights in a T@b 455 | 2022 Jeep Grand Cherokee L Overland | T@b owner since 2014

  • Verna
    Verna Member Posts: 6,876
    Well, I guess I need to make alternative plans. I checked Death Valley’s website. Scotty’s Castle’s roads were heavily damaged during heavy rains, so it won’t open until 2020, and most of the other places I had planned on seeing in Death Valley are closed. 

    Decisions, decisions......
    Verna, Columbus, IN
    2021 T@B 320S  Boondock “The T@B”
    Towed by a white 2019 Ford F-150 4x4 Supercab, 3.5L V6 Ecoboost “The Truck”
  • jgram2
    jgram2 Member Posts: 1,522
    @Verna I’ve got it - Disneyland! 🤭
    John, Judi, Guinness & OD in PDX
    T@Bit@t 2015 S Max Outback, ‘18 V6 4Runner 


  • Verna
    Verna Member Posts: 6,876
    @jgram2, Sunny can't go there. But, she can go whale watching from the beach!  And, there’s sand for her to frolick in!
    Verna, Columbus, IN
    2021 T@B 320S  Boondock “The T@B”
    Towed by a white 2019 Ford F-150 4x4 Supercab, 3.5L V6 Ecoboost “The Truck”
  • jgram2
    jgram2 Member Posts: 1,522
    That’s it! The desert with lots of water! You two have fun wherever you go🙂
    John, Judi, Guinness & OD in PDX
    T@Bit@t 2015 S Max Outback, ‘18 V6 4Runner 


  • jkjenn
    jkjenn Member Posts: 6,422
    Verna said:
    Well, I guess I need to make alternative plans. I checked Death Valley’s website. Scotty’s Castle’s roads were heavily damaged during heavy rains, so it won’t open until 2020, and most of the other places I had planned on seeing in Death Valley are closed. 

    Decisions, decisions......
    Yeah, it has been closed for a while. There was tremendous damage back in 2015.

    @Verna if you are on the Nevada side, there is a pretty cool BLM site called Gold Butte National Monument.

    https://www.blm.gov/programs/national-conservation-lands/nevada/gold-butte

    2021 T@b 320 Boondock "Mattie Ross" | 2021 T@b Nights: 239 | Total nights in a T@b 455 | 2022 Jeep Grand Cherokee L Overland | T@b owner since 2014

  • Verna
    Verna Member Posts: 6,876
    Thanks, @jkjenn. I’m playing “how many mods can I complete today”, and I haven’t thought much more about it. This is the 5th year in a row that I’ve planned on going to Death Valkey and it hasn’t panned out yet. I WILL see it one of these days. Thanks for the info. Right now thete’s a lot of snow between me and Flagstaff and then NV.....that might be seen on another trip. Alaska is for next summer, too!
    Verna, Columbus, IN
    2021 T@B 320S  Boondock “The T@B”
    Towed by a white 2019 Ford F-150 4x4 Supercab, 3.5L V6 Ecoboost “The Truck”
  • Homebodyatheart
    Homebodyatheart Member Posts: 2,516
    @Verna Alaska? It's amazing! So... will you be coming north via Eastern Washington and meet up with the SpoTabbers?  =) Just a suggestion! 
    2017 T@B 320 Max S silver and cherry red, L@dybug ("Bug" aka my esc@pe pod), TV 2015 Toyota Highlander aka Big Red
  • Verna
    Verna Member Posts: 6,876
    @Homebodyatheart, I will be traveling with a couple who own a Silver Shadow teardrop. Neither of us wanted to travel there alone, and I know the 3 of us will enjoy the sights. 

    We will be entering Canada at Montana and coming back the same way. 

    Don’t worry, I’ll get up your way, but probably not next year. I’ll only be “home” for about 6 weeks before üCamp19 and the 3 of us plus Sunny will leave for Alaska from there. We have absolutely no timetable, so I have no idea how long we will be gone. 
    Verna, Columbus, IN
    2021 T@B 320S  Boondock “The T@B”
    Towed by a white 2019 Ford F-150 4x4 Supercab, 3.5L V6 Ecoboost “The Truck”
  • Marceline
    Marceline Member Posts: 1,757
    San Francisco Bay Area
    2013 CS-S us@gi
    2015 Toyota Tacoma PreRunner Double Cab
  • DurangoTaB
    DurangoTaB Member Posts: 754
    Mesa Verde...https://durangoherald.com/articles/255915 We’ve had a lot of snow this week, don’t know if that windy 23 mile road up to to the park is plowed.

    J.D. & Sue

    Durango, CO    2014/15 S M@xx :  "Dory's HabiT@B"  Keep on swimming...

  • MuttonChops
    MuttonChops Member Posts: 1,985
    The early 2018 shutdown fouled -up last year's snow bird adventure (motel hopping).
    If this latest shutdown continues it will foul-up my upcoming T@B snow bird adventure which has two Federal campgrounds planned.  Not a happy camper - - that is Voter - -


    How The Government Shutdown Is Affecting National Parks

    January 2, 2019


    '18 320 Spitched axle, 3020HE; PNW based
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  • jkjenn
    jkjenn Member Posts: 6,422
    The Larimer County sheriff is assuring tourists that they can still hike in the park and that emergency assistance is still available through the county. The park gates are closed for motor vehichles but you can hike, bike, or ski into the park. I believe the park CGs are all closed at this time of year, anyway. There are year 'round CGs in Loveland and other spots across the front range.

    https://www.facebook.com/SheriffJustinSmith/posts/2033635823391583?__xts__[0]=68.ARBXH0rh-hQujnT8XFalFwjcVDNDFt4KRnMkzIqIIQph89Z_J2wjmObAxpsMq1ZABLe7HSbSnS03OiC72LE2aWBqIkMZLyKWXXGP_0E23MVCLTy6Ha6V0_vVf82o_ryrb00eZJxUbQ2McolwwrkHWf2QgNUQ7nvwE0Go61tJML8qAEaJM4E7fooLbHGv2JLYZhm27fN1_lrsiY8fyg6aCFTD1z0I3-mO4PBh4Mqik5iA17cS6NMHDZxGQ63jesSZj2BfVI8UOlh3DmOYe5TYlW6Ja-5EkzKV_L65cWnS8iW9tIICFAVldpwgTujBDmDt19Q91uwg8U9obKNH4_yQ8Y2f2w&__tn__=-R

    2021 T@b 320 Boondock "Mattie Ross" | 2021 T@b Nights: 239 | Total nights in a T@b 455 | 2022 Jeep Grand Cherokee L Overland | T@b owner since 2014

  • Photomom
    Photomom Member Posts: 2,217
    If you all do visit a national park that is technically “open”, please, I beg you, clean up after yourselves and continue to follow posted rules. There are reports that trash is piling up, human excrement and TP is all over, people are off-roading where they shouldn’t be, and people are trampling ecologically sensitive areas. I read that people are even using metal detectors on the hallowed grounds of Civil War Battlefields.

    The question should not be “Can I go?” But “Should I go, and do I know how to be a good steward when I get there?”
    John and Henrietta, Late 2016 T@B S Max in Western New York
  • Travelin3D
    Travelin3D Member Posts: 174
    Richie, Mickie and Satchmo
    2020 320S Boondock Lite (silver w/blue)
    2019 Subaru Ascent Premium
  • falcon1970
    falcon1970 Member Posts: 758
    @photomom That ought to be our policy all the time--not just when someone might be watching!  There is an old outdoorsman adage that says "Always leave your campsite better than you found it."  I know I'm preaching to the choir here, but too bad we can't educate all the un-caring out there.
  • DougH
    DougH Member Posts: 1,110
    Behind Denver Post soft pay wall...

    http://enews.denverpost.com/q/ZTgbtqxjfoukanbGlQtOi20Xl0o9Wbu5Vc1mlbcsvfafC6oGnjDO7iYXVapQ

    RMNP reaching garbage / toilet limits. 

    2021 Jeep Gladiator, 2021 tiny toy hauler, Austin TX
    Former steward of a 2017 T@B S Max