Alde “Gas Failure” After Much Trials and Errors...HELP!

DigPolo

After a great weekend at San Clemente State Beach, with the temps reaching a brisk mid 40’s ( 40? Really Diggy?...I know...it is Southern California...hehe), we realized it would be nice to take a bit of the bite out of the air and run the Alde Heating System on our next trip. Upon returning, I spent days on end reading articles here, watching videos all over youtube, finding my fluid tank, reading the user manual several times and starting the heating system. 

I keep getting the same “Gas Failure” reading a minute into heating. I can hear the heat (fan) start up and everything looks and sounds great, then the red light pops up with the error reading. I have unscrewed the tank, lit the burner (from users on this site) and even yelled out loud a few times...with no avail. 

What now? It would be nice to have some heat for those 1 or 2 days a year we need it. Hehe. 

Diggy 

Bayliss

@DigPolo, I don't know if this will help, but I previously copied the following info posted on 04/26/2020 by @morey000:

"I was told by an Alde engineer that the gas failure error can occur when the battery is low.  I'm not sure what level the battery needs to have for the Alde system to function properly.  Per the Alde 3020HE manual:  “Low-voltage shutdown - If voltage drops below 10.5 V DC, the gas supply to the burner will be switched off.”

Since it sounds like you have tried lighting the stove element to get air out of the line, a few other things to consider are: (1) make sure you slowly open the propane tank valve; (2) you may have a bad propane hose line; or (3) you may have a bad propane regulator, which might have to be replaced.  Also, I recall that someone determined they had a bad gas solenoid, which had to be replaced.  I'm not familiar with where that may be located.

One other thing that may work, is to try to reset the Alde system.  You should be able to search and find how to do that on this site, but you can simply try disconnecting the battery for a few minutes, and then re-connect it.  Worth a try.  It doesn't seem that would be connected with a propane issue, but I recall it being suggested in the past.

Good luck!

DigPolo

Thank You @Bayliss for your input. I unhooked the battery and went through the steps. Again, I can hear the fan, motor or whatever it is, start up. This time, as I returned to the garage to put the battery wrench away i smelled propane at the rear of the trailer. I went to the front by the battery/propane, and no smell. I returned to the back and again smelled a heavy odor of propane. I immediately shut off the tank and the battery. 

At this point, I have no idea what to do. In SoCal, heat is not a necessity, but it would be nice to know that we have it if we need it.

Any help in this T@B world would be much appreciated.

Diggy

Sharon_is_SAM

@DigPolo - sounds like you need to have the gas line checked where it runs under the trailer.  Propane leak to the point that the propane pressure drops too low for the Alde to run - just guessing.  No propane smell inside and no alarm?  Maybe check under the bench to see where the line connects to the Alde to make sure the connection is tight.

Does the Alde work on electric?

HuCamp

@DigPolo I am also experiencing exactly what you describe (Gas Failure with the Alde) and have been in touch with Creed at NuCamp regarding the issue. The stove works normally while the error message is displaying. One other Tabber suggested that a faulty gas regulator could be the culprit here. I'm taking my Tab into the dealer today and will post if/when I get a resolution. My Gas Failure is intermittent - happens maybe 50% of the time.

HuCamp

Also, the Alde works fine on electric and this occurs while I'm on shore power with no indications of any problems with the 12vdc system.

pthomas745

These errors can sometimes (often) be cleared by "resetting the 12v" part of the system, which is what Bayliss is referring to.

Unplug the trailer from shore power.  Turn the Alde off.  Turn the battery switch off, or pull the fuse at the battery if you don't have a switch.  Wait a few minutes and turn things back on.

Here is a thread with a different "error" message, but it has the same fix.

https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/11818/alde-red-alert-warning-for-nucamp-tab-s-320-resolved

DigPolo

@Sharon_is_SAM I have not tried on electric but will tonight. And I will look under the bench as well. @HuCamp I will try to run it on shore power this evening.

DigPolo

@pthomas745 I looked everywhere for a thread on this...THANK YOU for directing me to it.

pthomas745

I live in Lakewood...and it has been a bit chilly the last 24 hours.  The only time I've had a "gas failure" error is after trying to light up the trailer for the first time in a long while on a cold morning here.  It "might" be just another Socal kind of thing when we can't function when it goes below 50 F.......

DigPolo

@pthomas745 HAHA! Exactly. I guess my only concern is the smell of the propane. I am going to try the above mentioned (link) you provided. Nice to see the sun out today!

AirBoss

To the extent possible use soapy water to spray on LP connections under trailer and in Alde compartment after you turn on the LP.

 Is the odor stronger outdoors or indoors? 

Couldn't agree more. Below 50 here and I'm significantly less productive! More rain coming. We can use it. 

DigPolo

@AirBoss The odor is coming from the rear exterior. Nothing inside. Good idea with the soapy water. Plenty of clearance underneath the Boondock edition. 

ScottG

I had the same symptoms a few years back after replacing a leaking propane pigtail (though I'm not sure why that would be relevant...). The blower fan would go through its start-up cycle but the boiler would fail to ignite and then everything would shut down. I have the older analog controls so I couldn't specifically tell if it was a "gas failure" or not.

I ended up shutting everything down, disconnecting all power sources, and going for a long walk. When I returned, all was back to normal. Still no real idea what happened, but it hasn't repeated itself yet.

I don't recall smelling propane, however, so that is a little more concerning...

Tampakayaker

Do the ALDEs have a safety thermocouple in them?

I've got a large outdoor firepit that had a bad thermocouple.  It wasn't sensing that the flame was lit, so it would shut down the gas.

DigPolo

@Tampakayaker No idea if our T@B has a thermocouple. It seems like the gas is still working, just doesn’t want to light the heater. Definitely going to try everything stated in these two threads when I get home this afternoon. 

DigPolo

@pthomas745 How do I actually turn OFF the Alde system? Are you meaning on the key pad or is there a switch on the heater itself?

pthomas745

When you hit the little power button on the Alde, it is off.

Tampakayaker

DigPolo said:

@pthomas745 How do I actually turn OFF the Alde system? Are you meaning on the key pad or is there a switch on the heater itself?

This was an answer I got a while back from pthomas745

The Alde only goes off with the Power button.  The Alde display could have "timed out" and turned itself off, but the Alde could still have been on.  If the display is dark, the only visual way to tell if the Alde is "on" is checking for that tiny green light embedded into the power button. 

That light is tiny and had to see in bright light.

Sharon_is_SAM

@DigPolo - the power button on the Alde touchscreen pad.

DigPolo

@Sharon_is_SAM @pthomas745 @AirBoss @ScottG Last night I plugged into power and the heating system worked perfectly. Within 30 minutes the temperature had risen 4 degrees. I unplugged the power and waited for the rig to cool down and restarted the heater using the propane. The red “Gas Failure” came back on but this time I didn’t smell any gas. Hmmmmm. I am going to crawl underneath it this weekend and really see if I can find the issue. Thank you to all that have replied. This is exactly why I love the message board.

ScottG

FWIW, here the link to the discussion of the similar problem I experienced.

HuCamp

@ScottG thanks for cross-posting that - so a "hard reboot" fixed your problem for good? I saw another thread from @TCretro where he ended up replacing the gas regulator to fix the "Gas Failure" issue.

HuCamp

@DigPolo are you currently suspecting that there's a propane leak somewhere under the T@b? I'd say disconnect the tank and take it into the dealer. Not something you want to find the hard way.

ScottG

HuCamp said:

@ScottG thanks for cross-posting that - so a "hard reboot" fixed your problem for good? I saw another thread from @TCretro where he ended up replacing the gas regulator to fix the "Gas Failure" issue.

Yes, in my case it was a one-time thing. I don't have the digital panel so can't say specifically if it was the same "gas failure" error, but it certainly had similar symptom (although I didn't expressly notice any gas smell). 

I can't say with certainty the problem won't resurface, but it did not do so for the entire 2020 season. As others suggested in the discussion I referenced, I'm going on the idea that it was just temporary insufficient propane stemming from the leak in/replacement of the propane pigtail.  

jkjenn

Two other things to check:

I find that if I close the gas and then open it extremely slowly sometimes that corrects the problem.

One time my Alde exhaust hose had wiggled loose enough to trigger it.

DigPolo

@HuCamp I smelled gas twice a few days ago but nothing yesterday. I am going to spend sometime this weekend under the trailer, testing for leaks.

DigPolo

@jkjenn I have tried unscrewing the tank, opening it very slowly and tightening anything with a screw cap next to the actual Alde System under the seat. The error still happens. It runs perfectly fine when plugged in. 

jkjenn

The exhaust connects to the vent to the outside. Mine worked fine on shorepower but gave the equivalent of the error you are getting (I had the non digital panel at the time.) The exhaust fan had wiggled just enough loose to the the issue.

DigPolo

jkjenn said:

The exhaust connects to the vent to the outside. Mine worked fine on shorepower but gave the equivalent of the error you are getting (I had the non digital panel at the time.) The exhaust fan had wiggled just enough loose to the the issue.

This is excellent information @jkjenn Thank you.

DigPolo

Another thing I noticed was the Glycol in the clear thin tube was only partially “Up or Down” the tube and never moved. Is this normal?