Permanent Side to Side Sleeping for T@B 320 S

SolidCamper

@AnOldUR I found your modification very interesting. Your excellent photos have helped me to understood better what's going on back there.  I'm relatively new to my TAB and was unclear, until reading your post, where exactly the glycol tank was, and how the heat exits or doesn't . My TAB is of the same vintage as yours, and I plan to check it for proper venting when I return to it.
Can I ask- what is the actual final width of the bed?

AnOldUR

@SolidCamper ... Thanks. Lots of informative pictures and info posted here by other forum members too.

We did cut the length of the mattress yesterday. Made it a much better fit. It’s now a 70.5” long x 54” wide.

I got a lot of negative feedback on relocating the glycol expansion tank, but it’s been working fine that way for over a week with no noticeable down side. Time will tell, but I see no reason to change it.

Good luck!

ScottG

It seems to me that so long as the "upper" mark on the glycol tank is above the top of the Alde (specifically the top of the Alde's internal glycol chamber), everything should work fine.

I suppose if the camper was tipped nose up at an extreme angle, the top of the tank could end up below the Alde, and glycol would overflow the tank. This may be the reason Alde recommends the spacing that they do.

It's also possible the increased height creates a standpipe effect that facilitates the return of glycol from the tank to the Alde, but I would think the circulator pump would be adequate to keep the glycol moving.  

AnOldUR

@ScottG ... I though about raising the front of the trailer being a problem, so jacked it up as far as it would go and it was OK. The worse case would be that I'd lose some glycol out the overflow onto the ground if it were a more severe angle.

I talked to my engineer son about this. He said the probable reason is that the additional pump head from the higher mount could prevent cavitation. He said if that was an issue, I should notice vibration or noise coming from the pump and possibly air bubbles in the expansion tank.

Funny (or not) thing is that the nuCamp tech was never able to give me a reason for the mounting requirement. He just kept repeating what the manual said. Never once mentioned cavitation.

DougH

I often hear / see roiling in the expansion tank as if cavitation is unfortunately endemic to the design. To reduce risk of impeller / pump failure, I suppose you could turn the pump control either on the control panel, pump control unit, or both down from 1.5 or 2 down to a lower setting like 1, and see if you still get adequate circulation and heating. But if your expansion tank doesn't act like its boiling during normal heating, I wouldn't bother.

AnOldUR

Seat cushions (actually repurposed dog beds) got here this morning. When ordering, I gave it a 50/50 chance that they'd be going back to Amazon, but seeing them in place, they are keepers.

Tabaz

Just curious - where does the heat from the rear convectors enter the cabin?

AnOldUR

@Tabaz .. The stained board across the back is spaced about a 1/8” out from the white panel.

Tabaz

Got it. Hard to tell from the photos.

AnOldUR

We made an appointment to bring our T@B to the local dealer, Miller’s in PA, on April 8th. Curious to see the reaction to this mod. Preparing for a wrist slapping. 

DougH

@AnOldUR I called them up this morning. They said they're planning on putting you on a $50k a month retainer for any future camper modification designs customers ask for... across the various lines of RV they carry.

AnOldUR

@DougH ... That 50k / month would really help with my wimpy retirement fund, but they'd soon see that I'm a one horse pony show. I did send them an email for an opinion of a mod. They came back with, "Unfortunately we can't comment when it comes to aftermarket modifications​." My guess is they were trying to be polite and did not want to criticize what I had done.

AnOldUR

DougH said:

... But if your expansion tank doesn't act like its boiling during normal heating, I wouldn't bother.

Checked this out yesterday. When the pump is running I could see movement in the expansion tank, but no bubbles at all. Just enough to confirm that there is circulation. Also, before you mentioned it, I didn't know that you could control the pump speed. It's was set on 1, so that probably aids in reducing cavitation. I bought the trailer used. Is 1 the default setting for a 2020 320S?

Sharon_is_SAM

@AnOldUR - glycol pump speed about 1.5 to 2 is plenty for the 320.  Just know that you must set it at the control at the Alde.  The Alde display pump control does not work.

AnOldUR

Home from a real life test with three nights camping. One at a Harvest Host the other two at a State park. My wife and I were very pleased with how this setup worked.

Anyone else have to fight with a dog for foot space?

fstop32

Yep, with our German Shepherd!  That's what pushed me to drop the coins for a Lagun table mount (our 2015 2nd owner came with the original table that takes up most of the floor space.  With the Lagun we reclaimed the path to the "in house"!

Sharon_is_SAM

The sleeping side to side is really the best of both worlds as you can leave half of the bench for seating.  Sweet!

SubaruLou

I love the privacy screen/chalkboard on the privy door!

AnOldUR

AnOldUR said: Anyone else have to fight with a dog for foot space?

fstop32 said:

Yep, with our German Shepherd!

We learned a lot of things on our first outing. Among them was that our T@B is plenty big enough for the two of us, but adding a 60lb dog to the mix makes it a challenge. More experience and some training and we’ll be fine. She’s part of the family.

fstop32

@AnOldUR, that's a pretty awesome mod you did there!  
In your very first posted pic where you have already removed the shelf cubbie and the two wing pieces...was the rest of your headboard a one piece U shaped piece or was it a bottom cross piece with the two side upright pieces mounted on top of it?  I can't quite tell from the pic if it was one piece or not.
I'll be rebuilding mine before too long and I wanted to alter my 2015 to look more like what your 2020 does.  I'm going to drop my convectors down to the tailpiece floor where yours were originally and then build the cubbie to drop in like yours did (originally).  Our 2015 only had a shelf and I'd love to add the storage space.  We sleep "twin bed style" and I built my table with wings that fold up so at bedtime we can swing the now narrow table between us for a "bed side table".

AnOldUR

fstop32 said:

... was the rest of your headboard a one piece U shaped piece ...

Yes, it is a single u shaped piece. I’ll be interested to see/read how this works out for you.

AnOldUR

My wife didn't like the dog bed seat cushions, so she took on the project of cutting down the factory cushions the 6" needed to fit after adding the new larger mattress. She did a really nice job of restiching the covers. They look more professional than my dog bed solution and are a lot more comfortable.

Before:

After:

Obvyoghurt

AnOldUR said:

My wife didn't like the dog bed seat cushions, so she took on the project of cutting down the factory cushions the 6" needed to fit after adding the new larger mattress. She did a really nice job of restiching the covers. They look more professional than my dog bed solution and are a lot more comfortable.

Before:

After:

Hi, newish Tab owner here. My husband and I are planning on fulltiming in a couple of months and your post inspired us to mod our bed too!
Came out great and gives us so much more space and less set up with a permanent bed. 
Thanks for the tips and posts! 
Here are some photos of our build, it's a 2021 model so the part under the overhanging closets is a little different. 

SLJ

Nice job on the mods. No daily set up/take down is a plus. Would be good for solo. We couldn't do it though. We spent a couple of our camping years climbing over each other in a camper van to get in and out of bed and swore we'd never do it again. We're taller so we sleep front to back. One big bed with both of us and our dog or a single twin when I'm using it solo. Gives us more room for our toes.

Oneota

This is a very interesting project.  I look forward to some photos/comments after you are completed and have tried this out.

scott14

@obvyoghurt - Can you provide us an update on your bed modification?  How is it working?  What size is the bed?  Can you post some pictures?  We have a 2022 320S and are considering a modification like the original poster completed, but the cabinets are lower, just as they are for your 2021.

AnOldUR

Updating this thread for anyone interested. We've already been on the road for over five months this year including uCamp. This sleeping arrangement has worked really well for both one night stops and extended stays. The only change has been to relocate the glycol expansion tank again. For the entire trip it was fine below the bed. The problem was that I like to periodically check the glycol level and it was a challenge to get to the tank. Short of taking the mattress out, contorting my body under the mattress to be able to see inside the tank was not fun. Someone here once called it T@B Yoga. I'm going to switch to the new glycol, so it was a good time to drain and rethink the plumbing. Moving it forward will make life a lot easier. The question is why did I not put it there to begin with?

Here's the before, after and new location:

GigHarborTom

We are thinking, on our 2020 we do not have that gap behind the lidded compartment in the back. When wifey did the twin bed mod, the rear under cushion panel was raised to meet the side panels. This was accomplished with strips that allows flow from beneath. We do have that infamus gap in front of the lidded compartment.