400 WITHOUT ALDE SYSTEM?

gulfarea

I have had two 320's with the Alde heaters, I know New Camp builds the wider 320 for Ultamate Campers without the Alde heating system whitch I wish I had bought. Does New Camp make the 400 without the Alde system? Just to much maitance with the Alde system for me. Art

RobynE

Hi Art, its actually called Alde and its very highly regarded in the T@B community. I've owned three T@Bs with the Alde system and I've never had a single issue in over 8 years, oh wait, I did have a blown fuse once, but that issue has been addressed in 2021 models and newer. 

However, if something does go wrong with it, then it's not an easy DIY fix more often than not which makes it undesirable for some (including me to some degree).  To answer your question though, I'm not aware of any T@Bs that don't use the Alde, but I'm not sure about their truck campers. 

Sharon_is_SAM

No, TaBs starting with the 2014 models have the Alde.

qhumberd

Seems like suddenly the online RV world is very concerned about Alde. Not sure why one person's experiences would warrant so much attention at RV travel, but there you are:

https://www.rvtravel.com/think-twice-alde-heating-system-1991/

VictoriaP

@qhumberd I don’t know about the RV world as a whole, but I personally began to change my opinion when I realized how much a basic flush and fill was going to cost every two years. This is an expense that you simply do not have with an industry standard furnace & water heater setup.

Add in that people do have trouble getting service. When Alde was on the west coast, at least we had good customer service from them, even access to parts, by calling them directly. When Truma bought them, a lot of that went out the window. Mobile RV techs often aren’t familiar with the product and certainly don’t carry spares for them the way they do with your typical furnace. Dealerships are barely better educated, as a number of people here have experienced.

Then the corrosion & Rhomar vs Century saga began, and honestly for me, that was the point where I started considering the Alde a liability versus an asset. But had nuCamp & Alde handled it the way Airstream did, I might have stayed a fan. Instead, only the newest rigs were provided with the very pricy new fluid exchange for free, and the rest of us got, in effect, *shrug* “well, maybe you should change over, but we aren’t really saying you have to, and oh yeah, any damage that occurs from our bad choice of transfer fluid is your problem.” Not the way to take responsibility for your mistake on a very expensive appliance, and not the way to make your customers happy or loyal.

Meanwhile we have multiple dealers who can’t be bothered to do that changeover correctly, failing to thoroughly rinse out the Century fluid. And it’s a process that only the most DIY savvy among us can handle ourselves because of the pump required to be sure all the old fluid is removed.

It’s a great system when it works, and if the flush & fill process were every five years as in Europe, and the corrosion issue hadn’t happened, I’d probably love it. But as it stands? No way will I ever buy another rig with one.

Denny16

After the changeover to Rhomar fluid, which requires the water flush, you no longer need to flush the system to replace Rhomar with new Rhomar in two year intervals.  I remener when one had to drain and flush an auto radiator every year, then every two years.  Yes, doing this on a car was easier, but the same procedure.  I have not had any issues with our Alde in a 2018 TaB400, and the Alde was one of the main reasons we chose the TaB.  I wouldn’t want any other cabin heater, especially forced air types.
 Cheers 

AnOldUR

Although I agree with much of what @VictoriaP is saying, I wouldn't give up on the Alde yet. Like @Denny16, I don't think the maintenance is the issue. It's the inconsistencies and incompetence from dealers and manufactures that cause the frustration.

bergger

First off we absolutely lover our 400.  And I do like the Alde in general, very quiet and love the radiant heat.  We've had our 400 for almost 3 years and have not any issues with the system.  It's operated flawlessly even at 10,200 feet where we live.  Yes the flush and change to Rhomar that I did myself took a lot of research and was a bit stressful, but now that it is done the 2 year replacement will be a bit easier.   But it is still a cost and issue I have to deal with every two years.   

That being said the Alde would not be my first choice for an RV system for several reasons.   First off is the glycol replacement every 2 years.  Second is that it does take a long long time to heat up the trailer in very cold temps.  I know for most people who live in normal climates that is not an issue but for us it is.  Another reason is that there is more that can go wrong with it.  The unit itself can have an issue (as all units can) but then add the fact it is a radiant system that has multiple locations that can spring a leak and or have corrosion (force air systems don't have this possibility). 

I honestly wish NuCamp would get rid of the Alde and use the Truma Combi unit instead.  I have a Truma Vario heater in my truck topper/camper and it is wonderful.  Is it louder? Yes it is but much quieter than the normal forced air systems.  And mine is mounted out in the open.  I can only imagine how quiet it would be mounted in a cabinet.  Also I do like the digital control panel it uses.  I think the Truma units would heat the trailer much much faster, are less complicated to operate, have less opportunity for failure and require less maintenance. If NuCamp could make that change along with switching to Arctic Turn windows and doors the trailer would be better off.   

jkjenn

After 8 years and hundreds of nights in the Alde, I can't imagine not having it.

Find me another furnace hot water heater and furnace that I can at night and still hear the coyotes and elk. Good luck. Instead, they would be drown out by the sound of forced air.

Also, find me another furnace that uses LP and battery so efficiently and is so perfect for boondocking.

MuttonChops

Wow, that Dave S. article (web-blog-post) has created a bunch of discussion . . .
One FB comment correctly noted the article was just "One Owners Opinion" . . .

I was also disappointed that Dave S. even shared the letter, as Dave S. has zero real-world experience with the Alde System.

Several comments here note a few of the real-world issues with an Alde System and Yes it is not perfect.
And while a Truma Combo Plus system (forced-air {reported to be quieter than standard RV furnaces} and tank-less hot water) might be an acceptable option . . . for me the Alde is amazing and well worth the learning curve and maintenance.** 

**    I for one am somewhat belated on the 2-years fluid change.  I did a half volume change (gravity drain) at 3-years and next year I'll do a Ph Strip Test to see how the system is doing.
    In general I question 'manufacturer' guidelines on fluid changes.  As my Consumer Product Industry Manufacturing Experience has dozens of examples of Marketing, Sales, or Distributor Senior Management 'reading' Engineering Department data as they feel is needed to promote revenue growth.
    For example, when the Big-3 shifted to 100 Thousand Mile major tune-ups all of a sudden oil changes dropped to 5,000 - 7,500 miles from 10,000 or 15,000 the years before.  All while the motor oil quality had improved, standard oil filters had improved, and engine build quality improved - - - - that has far more to do with Dealership Service Revenue than actual engine performance.  Yes, the engineering department reported those intervals but as very ideal or very hash use . . . not their 'typical' owner experience.
    So those other department VP's could justify requiring the computer to beep-beep-beep oil change is overdue

DenisP

@jkjenn I couldn’t agree more. After trading an RPod with a loud hot air furnace, a dual propane/Ac hot water heater (requiring regular maintenance) for a 2018 400, I enjoy the Alde system to the max on every camping adventure.  With 195 (quiet) nights in our 400 with temps ranging from 12 to over 100 degrees and altitudes over 8000 ft, the Alde provides a consistent result: It works!  This is one camper’s opinion but I would not buy another camper without an Alde. 

gulfarea

Another problem with Alde is what to do with all the waist after flushing with almost 15 gals of water when changing between the 2 different fluids they used. I live on a beautiful rivers edge so that is a BIG deal to me as I will not spill all that on my land. Why Alde did not use an oil for the fluid is beyound me!  That would have taken care of the corrision problem and last for years between maintance. For years small electric type radiators with heating elements in them have used oil. Art

techietab

gulfarea said:

 Why Alde did not use an oil for the fluid is beyound me!  That would have taken care of the corrision problem and last for years between maintance. 

Static oil-filled radiators are one thing, but using oil for heat transfer fluid rarely usually doesn't make sense for low temp applications where the fluid needs to be pumped around. In an ideal world, the most efficient thing to use would be pure water, but that comes with disadvantages in terms of boil/freeze point and corrosive properties, so something like glycol is usually blended in to mitigate. There are other substances that could be used in lieu of glycol, but propelyne glycol in particular has the best safety profile.
Oil is less efficient due to relatively lower specific heat and higher viscosity. It also carries more risks (it's a fuel source in a fire; much messier to clean up a leak; higher environmental impact for disposal)

Denny16

The waste water from a one time flush is not going to be n ongoing issue.  Take the flush water to a hazmat facility and tell them it is glycol flush water.  Problem solved.
 Cheers 

manyman297

I know I’m in the minority but I find when the Alde is working overtime the exhaust fan and rumbling (yes, even with high altitude option activated) keep me awake being right under my head. 

I love the Alde but it is the achille’s heel of these trailers. So far ours has been trouble free…but it’s only been two years. 

On the flip side I can’t imagine going back to the old suburban forced air furnace in our popup. It was so loud…like loud enough to wake your neighbors. 

I also believe the Truma Combi would be the best compromise. Very quiet and less maintenance. And the Alde requires a lot of space dedicated to the piping. 

Binghi

Been using our Alde for the last month on our trip to DC. Lows have been in the twenties the last week. 27 deg as I write this. No problem. Quiet, efficient, effective. If you’re on shore power you can rid yourself of the mild furnace rumbling by turning the propane function off and utilizing the 2 kW electricity. Works a little slower but still gets the job done. Our Alde beats the heck out of the loud systems in nearby trailers. Just sayin’…

manyman297

@Binghi We use propane maybe 95% of the time (boondock or primitive camping sites) so electric rarely gets used. Maybe I just need a white noise machine