Reliable source for Alde fuses

ChanW

Yes, the fuses in ours are both fast blow too. Radio Shack (RIP) didn't carry them, so I went with Digikey, as @photomom did (Digikey is great!)
It sounds like the Tab factory started including the spare slo-blow fuses after the reports of the problem. No telling if it's Alde approved.
It would be nice to get the official word from Alde. I'd rather not be a trial-and-error test subject.

Michigan_Mike

Ratkity said:

I vaguely remember one person had ONE fuse a fast blow and ONE a slow blow fuse in their Alde. The fast blow kept going out, so the owner replaced it with a slow blow. No more problems after that. 

My theory was that people may be accidentally leaving on the manual Alde thermostat. Then they plug the camper into the campground power pole, causing a brief surge. I found several holes in that theory, however. Some folks had surge protectors (good ones). Others weren't even on 110V power and the thermostat was off. 

Sorry, no answers here. I'm as flummoxed as you all!

I have experienced several scenarios where the Alde fuse has blown as follows:

• The Alde fuse (e.g., the small cartridge fuse on top of the Alde unit) blew when the Alde unit was left on via the thermostat and when I plugged the trailer into shore power, resulting in (what the Alde viewed IMHO as) a power surge/voltage imbalance to the unit.  
• The Alde fuse also blew when my trailer was plugged into the 30 amp power supply port on the side of my garage and after a passing storm interrupted power to my home briefly (the substation operated momentarily, but power did remain on), the lights blinked on and off and my home did remain in power.

I do make it a point to and as a part of my trailer ritual if you will, to ensure that the Alde unit is powered up properly and turned off properly every time I use the trailer as follows:  

• I hook the 30 amp trailer power cord to the trailer first, to shore power last (and with the campground circuit breakers in the "off" position) and then "flip the circuit breakers on" to provide power to the trailer.  I do have an "in-line" Progressive Industries surge protector too that analyzes the circuit and shore power connection and voltage.
• After shore power has been properly hooked up and power is safely flowing into the trailer we then turn on the Alde unit.
• When we are completed with our camping activities for the weekend we then shut the Alde thermostat off and unhook from shore power in reverse, as noted above.  

I have not experienced any issues with my trailer's Alde system after using the above criteria and understand that everyone has their own Alde Voodoo or steps therein that they stick to.    As they always say, "to each his own" and I believe that should people find ways that allow things to work best for you personally, you should stick to your own game plan/procedures as we are all creatures of habit.  Thus far my lucky string has continued and am only passing along a few tips that have worked well for Linda and I.  

Photomom

We haven't had any issues with power failures at home, but we have a whole house surge protector on our circuit breaker panel. 

ChanW

I'm guessing that any surge that happens on the 12V side isn't going to be caused by our shore-power, protected or not by 120V surge protectors. I think the 12V system and the 120V system are relatively independent, or should be. 

It seems that it's a surge that happens specifically on the 12V system, and would therefore be caused by the converter, possibly being caused by the converter's electronics suddenly powering up.

So I'm thinking that our Progressive 120V surge protectors aren't really going to affect this downstream 12V problem, unless there's a bad filter in the converter's rectifier or other leak of some kind between the 120V side of the converter and the 12V side.

Also, I wonder if the 12V side of the Alde's circuitry is powered up no matter what position the control switches are in. I might have to check that. (Edit: in fact, the Alde looks to be drawing @ 50mA when all switches on the control panel are 'Off') Note, we have the analog control panel on our Tab, but I'd think the digital one would operate the Alde in the same way.

In any case, @Michigan_Mike's routine makes lots of sense, to maybe keep the Alde somewhat electrically isolated as we apply power to the Tab, at least isolated on the 120V side. 

Photomom

Our voodoo is:
- turn the fridge and the battery disconnect off (we travel with everything else off)
- check the pedestal outlet with an outlet tester and 120v voltmeter 
- plug in the surge protector and check the lights
- connect the power cord to the surge protector and then the trailer
- turn the battery disconnect and the fridge on

ChanW

@Photomom, your 'test the pedestal' voodoo point is well taken. I've had more than one pedestal wired wrong, and heard (read) many others speak of it.

I have to say though, that with all the various voodoo steps I've taken, Mike's included, I've still had one of the Alde fuses blow mysteriously. 

That's why I'd like to hear from Alde directly, about slo-blow fuses.

Photomom

@Verna and @Michigan_Mike would you be able to ask someone from the factory to check with Alde about the slow-blow vs. fast-blow issue? I would think since nuCamp buys Aldes in mass quantities they are in a better position to get an authoritative answer than us minions.

JohnDanielsCPA

@Michigan_Mike, your "voodoo" is the one I've always used on all of my rigs, and I've never had a problem.  However, to @ChanW's point, if fuses are blowing while off of shore power, that is a 12 volt issue, and a bad converter (surging et al) could certainly cause something like that.  I believe T@Bs (at least the newer ones) use WFCO converters, but I'm not certain.  I have not had any problems, yet, but if I did, that is certainly one area I would be scrutinizing.  Of course, I am assuming the Alde is NOT the problem, and that could be a bad assumption.

Michigan_Mike

JohnDanielsCPA said:

@Michigan_Mike, your "voodoo" is the one I've always used on all of my rigs, and I've never had a problem.  However, to @ChanW's point, if fuses are blowing while off of shore power, that is a 12 volt issue, and a bad converter (surging et al) could certainly cause something like that.  I believe T@Bs (at least the newer ones) use WFCO converters, but I'm not certain.  I have not had any problems, yet, but if I did, that is certainly one area I would be scrutinizing.  Of course, I am assuming the Alde is NOT the problem, and that could be a bad assumption.

I am guessing that the majority of these issues probably go back to the fusing of the Alde and the fact that the light fusing is so sensitive to any voltage imbalance that they blow quickly when the system senses what it considers to be a surge or potential fault.  If the Alde units themselves were faulty the factory would be receiving an inordinate amount of repairs and potential warranty claims and to my knowledge this is just not the case.  

As for the WFCO converters, I have one in my 2015 T@B.  I understand the 12 V scenario and all of that, and have experienced two fuse failures which I still believe were a result of both operator error and because the system picked up an imbalance in voltage.   I will defer to my prior comment and believe that the Alde unit needs to be turned off, the trailer!s electrical system energized whether on shore power or 12V battery and then you can turn the thermostat on.  If people fail to turn the unit off, the sensitivity of the fuse will result in it failing when other circuits and load in the trailer are powered up.

Ratkity

I never had a problem with the Alde fuses in my 2015 and I converted the analog thermostat to digital too. I have a ritual much like everyone else.

Check the breakers are off on the campground pedestal
Connect the cord to the trailer side first
Progressive surge protector connected to cord, the connect to pedestal.
All Alde, pump, frig, AC, fans, anything plugged in are off from last camping trip (I'm a weekender.. I just put frozen jug of ice in frig and use it for drinking and brushing teef - food is ok, frig has been cooled down the night before).
Flip breaker on campground pedestal, check lights on surge protector.
Turn on lights inside (I usually get there in the dark.. bleh).
Turn on propane and light stove, extinguish stove.
Turn on Alde.

I never pulled the fuses to look at them. I was afraid gremlins would get in, or more than likely, I'd drop the fuses behind the converter or in it! I would test the outlets, but my Progressive protector does that (reverse polarity, proper voltage). 

BTW, I've never known anyone (not speaking about Dutchman T@Bs) that didn't have a WFCO converter in their T@B.

gbell

We'll, so far my alde has blown 3 fuses and all times it is turned off at the digital themastat, and the last two times I turned off the breaker to the alde also after turning off at digital. I seem to do the hook up and unhook properly with surge protector and the next time we hook up it is blown .  
I did notice that all my fuses are fast blowing. I will get slow blow and see what happens.
I sure wish I had the old fashioned heater in here.  And separate water heater. Wonder if it could be reto fitted.
The alde is the weak spot on the t@b to me.

Also I am going to buy a surge protector that will be were the alde plugs into the 120v  maybe this would pick up any bad volts before alde. What do you think.

Ratkity

@gbell When you don't plug into 110V and are only on battery, do you blow fuses? Your Alde 110V plug doesn't have to be in the socket if you don't want. No AC power will be going to it. 

I was under the impression that this was happening on both battery power and 110V. Is it? If not, then I'd drop by an RV repair place to check out ALL your wiring connections to your converter for 110V. Something is loose or needs replacement.

Michigan_Mike

Ratkity said:

@gbell When you don't plug into 110V and are only on battery, do you blow fuses? Your Alde 110V plug doesn't have to be in the socket if you don't want. No AC power will be going to it. 

I was under the impression that this was happening on both battery power and 110V. Is it? If not, then I'd drop by an RV repair place to check out ALL your wiring connections to your converter for 110V. Something is loose or needs replacement.

I agree with your assessment that something is wrong when someone continues to blow fuses and disagree that the Alde is the weak point of the trailer.  The Alde is a gem, the heart of my trailer and the most valuable piece of my trailer as an "all in one unit" that provides heat and hot water for me when camping and in remote areas.  It is compact and efficient and I prefer it to separate heating units for heat/water.  

Photomom

I love the Alde and the ONLY time I've had a problem is when the 110v plug came out of the outlet while driving on a very bumpy road in a construction zone. BUT the engineer in me wants a definitive answer to the slow blow / fast blow fuse question. One of those is correct and the other is not.

Michigan_Mike

Photomom said:

I love the Alde and the ONLY time I've had a problem is when the 110v plug came out of the outlet while driving on a very bumpy road in a construction zone. BUT the engineer in me wants a definitive answer to the slow blow / fast blow fuse question. One of those is correct and the other is not.

I will see if I can get an answer from the factory and will post up any information they provide. 

ChanW

Thanks Mike, appreciated! 

RollingLagrima

I have never had an Alde fuse blow and I have used it on shore power and solar many times in cold temps for both heat and hot water. I too follow the "make sure all switches (analog in my case) are off, test the pedestal with diagnostic surge protector, attach power cord, flip breaker on pedestal, turn on Alde" sequence. No issues in 2+ years with my 2016 Max S Sofitel (April 2015 build/delivery).  Very grateful. 

Michigan_Mike

Photomom said:

@Verna and @Michigan_Mike would you be able to ask someone from the factory to check with Alde about the slow-blow vs. fast-blow issue? I would think since nuCamp buys Aldes in mass quantities they are in a better position to get an authoritative answer than us minions.

From Elsie at the factory:

Good Morning Mike

It is the fast blowing fuse, F3.15AL Fast-Blow Fuse 3.15A 250V Glass Fuses 

There are 2 fuses in the system, no extra. They are available through nücamp or Amazon.

 

 

ericnliz

Thanks Mike & Elsie!

Photomom

Thanks Mike.

Ratkity

Just FYI.. what does that L mean, was it a typo? Nope...
T = time delay, H = ceramic and L = glass
3.15A = the current rating
250V is the maximum voltage rating

Photomom

You may be sorry you asked.

https://www.swe-check.com.au/pages/learn_fuse_markings.php

The L means that the fuse is "low breaking capacity": 

INTERRUPTING RATING: Also known as breaking capacity or short circuit rating, the interrupting rating is
the maximum approved current which the fuse can safely interrupt at rated voltage. During a fault or short circuit condition, a fuse may receive an instantaneous overload current many times greater than its normal operating current. Safe operation requires that the fuse remain intact (no explosion or body rupture) and clear the circuit.

I believe high breaking capacity fuses ("H")  have a solid body instead of glass and are used where there might be enough current to cause a glass fuse to explode. 

Ratkity

Welp, color me red! My source was the interwebs and I thought it was true!!!  

Thanks for the correction.

I'm glad to know the Alde doesn't need H thicker glass fuses because they have enough current to cause them to explode!!! I do know the "L" are usually used for delicate electronics in music and audio stuff. 

Photomom

Explosions not good.

Ratkity

Photomom said:

Explosions not good.

Well, now.. wait a minute... sometimes they're fun. Especially when there's sparklie things that shoot into the sky (fireworks).

dmerzbac

When on a trip earlier this week to see the eclipse, I again blew one of the fast blow fuses. I replaced it with a slow blow that I had received from Elsie. No luck -  the display did not come on. I then replaced the remaining fast blow with another slow blow and the display still didn't work. Everything was correctly plugged in along with a surge protector. I also plugged in to 15amp service when I returned home. I still can't get the display to work. Has anyone else had the same problem? What else do I need to check? Oh yes, I have ordered some fast blow just to check those again.

Photomom

dmerzbac said:

When on a trip earlier this week to see the eclipse, I again blew one of the fast blow fuses. I replaced it with a slow blow that I had received from Elsie. No luck -  the display did not come on. I then replaced the remaining fast blow with another slow blow and the display still didn't work. Everything was correctly plugged in along with a surge protector. I also plugged in to 15amp service when I returned home. I still can't get the display to work. Has anyone else had the same problem? What else do I need to check? Oh yes, I have ordered some fast blow just to check those again.

Pull both fuses and check them visually or with an ohmmeter. The first one you replaced may have blown again.

ericnliz

@dmerzbac, Just gonna throw this one out there since it sounds like you've checked just about EVERYTHING it could be. Have you checked the receptacle for the plug in, and the other end going in to the Alde unit itself?
I have to agree with @Photomom about re-checking the fuses again as well. Since I haven't seen any mention of your particular issue here, I'd be curious to know how you resolve it, and what you find. Thanks, and keep us posted.

ScottG

I believe there is also a fuse for the Alde in the converter's 12V panel. Did you check that one?

The Alde's display should run exclusively on 12V. It should come on even if the unit is unplugged or the 120V circuit breaker is off.

dmerzbac

Will check, Scott. Thanks!