2019 T@B 320 S noticeable drag increase after about 30-40 mins drive—resolved brake issue

nmdream

I am trying to rule out any mild paranoia versus instinct that something is off. I get a little OCD when I start off in a new adventure. I don't want to get 1/3 to Ca. and have a "moment of I shoulda" ( Gotten better over the years )

We are getting ready for a maiden voyage in Sept across country. ( Not a vacation trip, if anyone is making noise. Ashes and a promise ). We are using the T@B to minimize our contact.

Has anyone had this particular problem? Is this normal as the wheels heat up ? We bought this used and have no idea the miles it has on it.

1.) W/O Brakes; Trailer was picked up and delivered home with no electric brakes connected. The first thing to get my attention was what can be described as "added weight" feeling after about 30-40  mins of driving with no electric brakes. I was watching the mileage to get an idea how it would change for trips. It seemed to drop accordingly with the weight feeling. went from Approximately 15/16 mpg to 11.5 to 12 mpg on normal Ohio rolling hills 45-55 mph. ( FYI - The mileage is not my concern, just a reference)

2.) Echo brake controller added; After 40 mins the drag seemed to increase and the brakes seem to be grabbing hard after the electric brakes were connected, the first part of the test drive with the new ECHO was smooth and we did not notice the trailer behind us, 40 mins later, the grabbing started after the brakes were applied and it would definitely pull down and slow us before the TV brake fully engaged.

Today, 8/1/20, I am trying to get the underbelly stuff attended to before the storm says hello.
I have a temp gun on order and plan on doing everything I can before the big trip. I think I can manage a lot of things without all the high tech things at the moment. We have  month to get ready and want to try and know all I can about "quirks" and experience's with long trips.
 
Out of mechanic practice by about 20 years but basics are basics. 
Thanks in advance all ! 
Happy Travels and stay safe .
Rob

ScottG

Perhaps a wind shift explains the first circumstance--despite their aerodynamic appearance T@Bs are kinda' like big sails.

Your second scenario sounds like a brake or brake controller adjustment issue, and that may well be influenced by temperature or other conditions.

Hopefully others can chime in with some more specific advice or info. 

nmdream

I agree on the 1st that is how I describe the trailer. The 2nd concerns me why it might change during a drive. I may do another trip check and talk to CURT as well, after I go through the wheel checks today.
Good thoughts. Thank You Looking forward to the inputs.

Dutch061

First my disclaimer, I am borderline OCD and naturally keep a close eye on things either consciously or subconsciously. As an engineer who also comes from a MRO background, you already know this but it is worth reminding.

I always stop about an hour into a trip (coffee is the culprit) and walk around the tow vehicle and the camper touching each tire and center of the hubs for each wheel to see if one doesn't feel like the other. As you are aware, there shouldn't be anything really warmer than the others. IE side to side depending on sunlight there may be a noticeable difference but not a "wow is this warm difference". I typically have a non contact infrared heat gun (Harbor Freight <$25) to measure temps but rarely do.

That would be my first step, touch before I leave and touch again after you have driven and notice the issue (real or perceived). This will immediately confirm whether there is a problem or not.

Brake controllers, I am very fortunate to have owned vehicles for the last 15 years plus that come factory and they work, nothing more I can really say besides that. In fact 15 years ago it was my motivator to trade vehicles (because I was pulling a big trailer almost daily). I still miss my Eddie Bauer Excursion with a 7.3 PSD to this day.

Brad

Sharon_is_SAM

To me it sounds like you need to adjust the brakes.  Also, how high was your brake controller set?  Is it possible the controller setting shifted during travel?

jkjenn

A headwind and vefy flat terrain can make a huge difference. When I take I-70, west, through the plains states, my gas mileage takes a beating and it is just harder driving. Returning on I-70, gas mileage gets a bit if a boost and is easier. I also get better mileage when I drive I-80 or >-90 than I do on I-70. I think it  has to do with terrain and possibly jet stream.

My second though is to make sure your emergency brake has not been activated. 

There are times I am sure something has gone wrong and it just turns out to be a stretch of road. I am usually just about to pull over and check when the pavement changes and the sound or feeling has passed. I think a little paranoia goes a long way to keeping you safe.

One last thing: make sure you check your tire pressure and that your lugs are torqued, properly.

TabberJohn

1. I'm not sure I'd be comfortable with an Echo controller in your situation (new user, cross country trip). Perhaps fellow Echo users will chime in with their experiences.
I prefer something I can look at and reach down to touch (test/adjust/activate). We have a hard-wired Tekonsha.
My understanding is the Echo is setup by BT connection to your phone and if you want to monitor how it's working (or manually activate it) you need to have your phone mounted on the dash running the app while driving.

2. Are you sure the Tucson is up to the task? What trim package and tow rating? Aren't you limited to 2000 lbs?

tabiphile

Key point. "we bought this used" "we have not idea how many miles are on it".
Starting with that and the knowledge that you plan to haul cross country you should not assume anything about the maintenance that has been done on the trailer up until you owned it. If it was used a lot or if it sat for a while it is due for both basic brake adjustment and more importantly wheel bearing service. It is fair to assume that such a new trailer will not require bearing replacements. It is however essential to grease them. If you have done basic mechanic work before the task of properly repacking the bearings will be really easy for you to do and it will give you great peace of mind. Do not rely on the Dexter EZ lube to do this job. You need to pull the bearings and makes sure that they are properly packed, show no signs of discoloration or galling and also that the spindles look good. This job will take to less than two hours to do both sides. You will need shop towels, rubber gloves, a jack stand, good floor jack, a screw driver, pliers, socket wrenches,breaker bar, ball peen. torque wrench, and a can of brake cleaner. Start by properly jacking the trailer (do not lift under the axle) and removing the wheels. Use the screw driver to remove the grease cap. Remove the cotter pin and then the castellated nut/washer so that you can pull the hub. When you pull the hub be careful not to drop the front bearing. Keep the bearing clean and move it and the hub carefully to the side. Now use the shop rags and some brake cleaner to carefully clean the spindle, the face of the electric brake and (if you are OCD) the shoes. This will make a bit of a mess so put lots of newspaper or cardboard under the wheel. Do not get grease on the brake surfaces. Now, take the hub where you can work on it. Put it down carefully and start removing the grease from it. Is the center of the hub filled? Does the rear seal look like grease has blown past it? Do the braking surfaces look good (not scored, burned)? Flip the hub and remove the rear seal. You will need to replace it with a new one. Take the number off of it so that you can buy the correct replacement at your local trailer shop. With the seal removed, pull the rear bearing and repeat the steps to clean and inspect everything. Since you are OCD you will probably get it right. The surfaces need to be immaculate. If the bearing and races are good, re-pack the bearings. To do this just put a big blob of grease in the palm of your hand and push the bearing into the blob over and over again until it is packed full of grease. Install the back bearing first using lots of grease on the races. Then install the rear seal. Two schools of thought on the rear seal, some use a bit of adhesive in the hub, others put it in dry. In either case, position it flatly, place a block of wood over it and give it a few good whacks with a hammer to seat it. Be careful not to get it started crooked. Once it's seated you are nearly ready to put everything back together. Take the hub back to the trailer. Generously grease the spindle (taking care not to get grease up on the back past the machined step, fill the hub center with a lot of grease (lots' of grease is not a bad thing, it's only bad when it shoved in with a grease gun past the seal) and then slide on the hub. Position the front bearing and then replace the washer and castellated nut. Hopefully you did not get any grease inside the hub on the brake surfaces! The next step is to tighten the nut. Again, two school of thought here...one, tighten the nuts as tight as you need it while turning the hub and listening and feeling it as you turn. Once it is very tight, back it off just enough to get the cotter pin to fit back through the nut and the  drilled hole in the spindle. This step is setting the load of the bearings on the races. Done right the bearings will be properly preloaded so that they can do their jobs of supporting the entire weight of the trailer. Done wrong (too tight or too loose) they will either not track correctly to carry the load or cog and damage themselves. The best way to get this right (unless you do this all day long and can go by feel) is to use a torque wrench to tighten the nut to 50 foot pounds. Once you hit 50 stop and try to put the cotter pin through. Don't put it in yet, you need to back off the nut as little as possible to find the next opening in the nut to push it through. That's your proper setting...tight and then back off just enough. Make sure the pin is properly set out of the way. Add a bit more grease over the nut and put the grease cap pack in place. Wheel back on, torque the lug nuts and you are done. Now, before you call it a day, check the brakes. There is a recent thread that walks through using the adjuster to get right. It's even easier to do than this bearing re-pack Once you are happy with the brakes head to the other wheel and repeat. Do not rely on the EZ Lube as your annual bearing maintenance. You are more likely to get to little or too much grease into the hubs without properly greasing the bearings. You can almost guarantee that the rear seal is blown on any trailer where the owner used the EZ lube after noticing a warm wheel....guarantee!
Keep track of what type of bearing grease you used. Do not ever mix grease types or even brands. A major peace of mind following this total re-pack is that you now know what type of grease has been used in your hubs...so no need to worry about mixing in new incorrect grease with whatever the previous owner used. Go out and enjoy your trip. Don't let the IR heat gauge get you too worked up with minutia...just putting your hand on the wheel as you have done provides a good point of reference on a hub that has been properly serviced.
If this seems like a bit much...a good trailer shop is the easy and safe option.

Denny16

If you are not up to doing the wheel bearings and brake adjust yourself, do take the trailer to a trailer service shop and have this done.  I had the bearings and brakes serviced and a basic safety check done on my used TaB when we got it, just to be sure all was well and the trailer could be towed safely.

We also use the Echo brake controller, it needs to be setup for your TV and trailer combo.  Go,out on a open area or parking lot eight space, take someone along to watch the trailer wheels when braking.  Start with a low setting and gradually adjust up until you can feel the trailer braking, then back off one or two settings.  Your assistant should see the trailer wheels if they lock up, and listen to hear the trailer brakes work, when applied, and any other odd sounds.
cheers

nmdream

Lots of good feedback.
Trip will be minimal weight, already edging toward rated max.
Pulled it from Ohio to SC w/o electric brakes in operation. It seemed to pull really well for the most part.
Only issue was the driver adjusting to the length added and the wind sail factor on highway.
Even Uncles Big Z51 felt the sail effect, we tried it on his when I thought something felt a little off after an hour on the road. He tried our SUV later and was surprised how well it pulled. Said he hardly felt it back there until we increased to faster speeds.
A lot of thought went into the purchase and the abilities of both vehicles. No sag, no bounce as far as we can tell on the drive to SC. We had good acceleration and good stopping. If all goes relatively well we hope in a few more years to begin the long slow adventures.

As for bearing, Yep - I am old school - dirty hands and tighten by feel and sound.  I will be very thorough. 
 
Good points all, not dismissing the TV concerns. We wanted a larger TV but made it very awkward for my "good things in small pkgs. lighthouse" aka Wife..
This trip is mostly for a place to lay our heads, not overloading for comfort. Vacation is not on the agenda this time. But I truly hope to always enjoy sights of all the country we pass through and take time to rest and take it all in..  16 days round trip and 3 are already taken at the first 300 mile start. 

** Minor Update - finally rain has stopped and the first wheel I got up is dragging on slow rotation, feels like pads are a bit tight on a cold hub. ( I think of that as good news)  But it looks like I will definitely pull it and inspect all the other stuff then go to other side. Better to know and fix now.

You are all great Thanks - will update the final results in a few days Isaias is getting closer, need to make sure other things in order also. 

nmdream

As for the ECHO - I started brake controller at 50% and 5 sensitivity.. seemed pretty comfortable at first, but after the first 40 nothing managed to stop the sever grabbing. - I don't think the controller is the problem. It changed as I adjusted but the grabbing became almost consistently hard and fast.
Made adjustments down to 20 % and as low as 3 .
It did not seem to make a beneficial change to the reaction I got after it started acting up.
Only the reaction time. Either way it grabbed hard early or late.

Denny16

Sound like the brakes need adjusting, as they are dragging, and heating up, making them feel grabby.
cherrs

nmdream

OK , repacked and adjusted brakes out a little, not grabbing fast violent anymore. Wife commented on what  big change.
The bearings looked nearly new , very little discoloration and the grease looked almost fresh. 
Thanks all for the input and advice! 
Ordered a spare set of shoes and a a bearing set for the trip. You never know.

Denny16

Good idea, and take some tools, Jack and jack stand too.  I had to replace an overheating wheel bearing on a boat trailer roadside once, not fun, but we had spares, and tools for the job.
cheere

nmdream

IF you use an Echo, I suggest finding a way to secure it or remove it when stopping overnight. - Someone has one Almost new in California  :( .  I got up and it was not there. Bad way to start the day but the world did not end and I opted to make the best of it and find a camping world.  
For the record, it did not change the incredible trip we had.