Help Me Decide.......Please!!!

Denny16

I agree with the restoration comments, can become a major undertaking.  A DIY floor replacement can be a major undertaking, but having  nüCamp replace the floor is just the cost of doing so, if it is going to be worth it to do so, for the owner involved.  If other repairs are needed, maybe a pass, but in the OP’s case, the floor is the only issue right now.  I was under the impression nüCamp has many of the older Tab parts available as spares, especially wheel bearings and brake bits.

A new trailer in this day and age, is no guarantee that you will have a trouble free experience, I have read many reports of new trailer owners having to deal with a variety of issues, yes mostly fixed under warranty, but agin at the mercy of the dealers, some of which seem iffy.  Buying a slightly used one to two year old trailer will normally have these issues resolved.  So this might be the better trouble and major maintenance free choice.
cheers

DougH

Another reason to go with a 2017 or newer T@B...  while Austin quoted $5-7k for a floor rebuild on a Dutchmen T@B, for my fractured Azdel floor (soft spot in center of floor) he quoted me only $2k out the door.  That was to delaminate and rebuild the floor, with presumably a fresh top sheet of Azdel, or at my option Azek for a bit more.  Perhaps models from the last few years are more modular, easier to unscrew to lift the shell, or something like that. 

But the conundrum is real. I'm still waiting for the perfect solo full-timer 4-season boondocker from NüCamp that's towable with a mid-sized truck. I look at the quality of the T@B versus videos of what's out there, and it's tempting to put a couple more years on the T@B.

Denny16

Note: this entry is in direct reply to DougH comment about the difference between DM Tab ply subfloor and the newer TaB Azdel composite floors.

@D@DougH, When repairing a delaminated Azdel floor, the entire camper is not removed from the floor.  Our TaB400 is having the 2017 bad floor recall replacement done, the the new floor goes down in two bits, from what I understand, and the trailer body is not sitting on top the floor, but rather the floor goes up to the trailer inside wall.  

Unless you had a shower pan or washroom leak, they do not remove the washroom, closet or under the rear bunk area, all of which are not walked on, and some of which is covered by a plywood bottom bit.

They just remove the front of the galley cabinets, the front dinette lockers and from the trim (not the CoolCat unless water damaged has occurred under it), and slip the two new main trailer area panels back in and laminate them down with a new top floor covering.  So not quite as bad or involved a job.  

When I get some updated photos of the interior removal, I will post them here.

Cheers

tabiphile

So....having given this a bit more thought....the trailer has next to no value unless it is repaired. A proper repair will cost far more than the value of the repaired trailer. The owner likes the rig she owns. A self repair done correctly (lifting the trailer from the frame) is a major undertaking and more of a project them most folks would care to do... I would 100% go down the path of putting a fresh floor in over the top of the spongy floor. Is that the nüCamp way, not even close. Does it address any damage that might not be visible, no...but it could make the trailer useable for a few more years and possibly for even longer. Probably yes.
The argument about the hidden damage is one that suggests that nüCamp has done a poor job sealing openings on most of it's builds, not just an occasional one. Given their reputation  for quality, wouldn't you assume that lousy leaky builds were the exception, not the norm? What's the risk? Is there a danger of going down the road and the cab flying off?? Well let's say for almost all pre-2017's there's that chance. Would anyone say that?
A 4X8 sheet of marine plywood costs about $100 and will last forever...it's anti-fungal and could be installed by anyone with even the most modest repair skills. Put a piece of laminated floor in on top and ride off into the sunset....that's what I would do faced with this decision. What's to lose?

Sharon_is_SAM

I found the thread with the pictures of the sides pulling away from the floor.  2005 DM TaB.

https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/6636/help-side-wall-of-t-b-pulling-away-at-door-frame-floor

Here’s the thread from Irving who “repaired” instead of replaced the floor.  Also Geo’s comments regarding structure.

https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/3406/repair-of-dutchmen-soft-floor-problem#latest

https://tab-rv.vanillacommunity.com/discussion/6689/soft-floor-repair-replace

VictoriaP

tabiphile said:

The argument about the hidden damage is one that suggests that nüCamp has done a poor job sealing openings on most of it's builds, not just an occasional one. Given their reputation  for quality, wouldn't you assume that lousy leaky builds were the exception, not the norm? What's the risk? Is there a danger of going down the road and the cab flying off?? Well let's say for almost all pre-2017's there's that chance. Would anyone say that?

nüCamp did not build the trailer in question. Dutchman/Thor did, and let’s just say in terms suitable to a family friendly forum that Thor has never had what one might call a reputation for solid builds. It speaks to nüCamp’s nature as a company that they would help find a solution for these older rigs that they technically are not responsible for.

Trying to resurface a rotted Tab floor is just a bad idea, due to the structural issues, as @Sharon_is_SAM has linked. And surprisingly, a Tab in need of floor replacement may be sold for a couple thousand, I saw two I can think of sold that way last year. Both buyers were supposedly going to have the new Azdel floor shipped to a local dealer for a DIY replacement.

Alternatively, the demand for parts is high. Parting it out can net a fair amount. It’s certainly isn’t a “next to no value” situation as you described.

Denny16

Outputting a dry bit of ply over the wet damaged, rotting ply, even if it is Marine grade, will only eventually get the new ply wet and it will start rotting and breaking down.  If you want to go the route of rep,axing the ply floor with a new ply floor, a good grade of real marine grade, no voids, no fills ply will be closer to $150 for grade A/B in 3/4-inch thickness.

Here is an overview of plywood, not marine grade is not more rot resistant than any other exterior grade plywood:

Marine Grade Plywood is not treated with any chemicals to enhance its resistance to decay. If decay is a concern, it should be pressure-preservative treated to an appropriate standard. The detailed description of veneer grades and Marine-grade plywood is contained in Voluntary Product Standard PS 1-95 Construction and Industrial Plywood.

Marine grade should be used where bending strength is important, such as boat hulls. Basic Exterior-type plywood may be used for most other applications in boat construction. Plywood panels rated as Exterior but not Marine, such as A-B, A-A or C-C Exterior, may contain any other permissible species and contain C-grade veneer. Unless specially improved, C-grade veneer is permitted to contain knots and knotholes up to approximately 1-1/2 inches across, and the inner plies may have core gaps up to 1-inch wide.

• Slow growth inland Douglas Fir and Western Larch yield fine-grained, smooth faces
• All Group 1, Struc 1 species Faces
• "A" grade faces shall be limited to a total of nine repairs in a 4'x 8' panel. Backs, Centers & Cores All backs, centers and inner plies shall be "B" grade or better and shall be full length and full width. Neither edge of a panel shall have any cross band gap or edge splits in excess of 1/8" wide or 4 in number. No inner ply laps are allowed.

APA MARINE
Specially designed plywood panel made only with Douglas-fir or western larch, solid jointed cores, and highly restrictive limitations on core gaps and face repairs. Ideal for boat hulls and other marine applications. Also available with HDO or MDO faces. EXPOSURE DURABILITY CLASSIFICATION: Exterior.

No untreated plywood is rot resistant as such.  Not sure Imwould want a chemical treated ply floor under my sleeping and living space either.  So you are left with doing what home boat builders do, and use two -part epoxy to seal the Engels and exposed surfaces before painting or applying a floor laminate on top.The bottom should be sealed and painted with a good oil based exterior paint.  This may buy you 5-10 more years of use, depending on the conditions.

Cheers

HoBo

Resurrecting this post to let everyone know I DID IT! I dropped Buttercup off last week for floor replacement. I picked up the camper today and I couldn’t be happier. Happier because of a few different things. First off it wasn’t nearly as bad as I thought. Also, the structural aspects (walls and trailer) which usually tack on costs were all in great shape. So, it cost less than estimated. They took the time to answer all my stupid questions and explained everything thoroughly. So with all that being said, this was an extremely difficult decision. I’m so thankful for all your input and can finally enjoy camping without worrying about falling throughthe floor! 🤣

I also have to thank Mark, the service technician who completed the work. 👏🏻👏🏻Also Austin, the service manage, for his help in making it happen. 👏🏻👏🏻

Mellow_Yellow

Verna said:

@HoBo, with a T@B named “Buttercup”, please be aware the yellow trim color is no longer made for the T@B’s—new or older. 

They still made the yellow trim in 2014: I'm the 2nd owner of a 2014 320 S "Sunny" and it's fabulous! 2014 models have the Alde and were still made with the wooden floor, but hopefully mine will last as long as Buttercup's did! 

Mouseketab

Glad to see you got the new floor!!! Having your T@B for a long time is awesome!!!

Tabnero

too many comments to read them all. My take is this: get the factory to repair the floor irrespective of a new purchase in the future. Quality repair leads to a quality item no matter who owns it. The value will go up with the better floor and and you can sell it proudly as you know the factory did the repair.

KAR

I would get a second quote.
We had another trailer earlier and the person I got a quote from was super upfront. Yes, you could fix this issue but then the next 3 items are X,Y and Z.
He recommended we release it as it wasn't worth the cost of repairs .
He said if we could make the repairs ourselves then he'd recommend keeping and repairing ourselves.
I love this group because they bring up so many pros and cons.
I'd make a list and add the $ as a con and then see how it weighs out.
Good Luck!
We have a 2015 T@B.
Happy Holidays and Happy Camping!