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Official statement from Scott Hubble concerning the Air8 air conditioner

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    VernaVerna Member Posts: 6,878
    edited June 2020
    @AirBoss, you’re very welcome. I emailed some concerns to nüCamp this morning, and while they were aware of a few names, it made me think that not everyone read the entire first post on this discussion. 

    I’ve found that even a redundant reminder may help one or two owners who may not be aware of the help you can get from nüCamp. 

    @crohrbacher, I’m glad you are on the list also. 

    Good luck to all of you—nüCamp has not forgotten you. 
    Verna, Columbus, IN
    2021 T@B 320S  Boondock “The T@B”
    Towed by a white 2019 Ford F-150 4x4 Supercab, 3.5L V6 Ecoboost “The Truck”
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    AirBossAirBoss Member Posts: 740
    Indeed, @Verna! Especially as we enter into that "fine wine" stage of life!

    Just fired off my info to CS and Warranty at nuCamp. 

    Appreciate the assist...

    2020 T@B 400 "OTTO" (build date 08/19)
    Factory Victron Solar; Norcold 3-way fridge
    '04 Chevy Tahoe Z71 DinoKiller
    San Diego, CA
    www.airbossone.com
    https://fineartamerica.com/profiles/owen-ashurst/shop


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    Denny16Denny16 Member Posts: 5,445
    Between the new larger Air 8A unit  and the thermostat move, it should do a lot better. TNOutback, if I were in your shoes, I would be making the 9-hr drive, you should try to get on nuCamp’s service schedule, tell them the dealer is out of his depth, and bungled the simple fixes.
    cheers
    2018 TaB400 Custom Boondock,  Jeep Gladiator truck, Northern California Coast.
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    AirBossAirBoss Member Posts: 740
    @Denny16
    I hope your right, sir. And I believe when it's all said and done, nuCamp will have done everything they can to make it right. Don't doubt that. 

    I'm certainly no HVAC guru...but using a couple different calculators to determine BTU's required it would seem the 7500BTU of the new unit would be sufficient.

    Interestingly, one calculation indicated that at 150sf (more than the 400 interior I suspect), 6.5 ceiling (which we know is not the case for the entire length) on a sunny day in a hot climate with average insulation, it would require 5800BTU's to cool the space "adequately." Put another way, given those dimensions, it would take just over 5000BTU's to cool/heat the space by 25 degree (+/-) from the ambient outside tempurature. 

    Don't know how accruate those clac's are but there they are. I believe the current Air 8 comes in at 6000BTU's so it's right at the upper limits. Bit like towing the 400 with a TV that has a 4000#/400# tow/tongue capacity! 

    Thanks again for all your contributions here!   
    2020 T@B 400 "OTTO" (build date 08/19)
    Factory Victron Solar; Norcold 3-way fridge
    '04 Chevy Tahoe Z71 DinoKiller
    San Diego, CA
    www.airbossone.com
    https://fineartamerica.com/profiles/owen-ashurst/shop


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    IrisIris Member Posts: 2
    Has anyone gotten a new "wiring harness" from NuCamp and did it work to help the AC problem?
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    AirBossAirBoss Member Posts: 740
    Not yet. Don't believe they are available yet. When I spoke with Elwell (manufacturer of the Air 8) a week or so ago, they were hoping to push it out by the end of the month. 
    2020 T@B 400 "OTTO" (build date 08/19)
    Factory Victron Solar; Norcold 3-way fridge
    '04 Chevy Tahoe Z71 DinoKiller
    San Diego, CA
    www.airbossone.com
    https://fineartamerica.com/profiles/owen-ashurst/shop


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    rh5555rh5555 Member Posts: 487
    edited June 2020
    When I communicated with Josh Elwell on 3rd June, he said:
    We are aiming at the mid-end of June to start shipping out extender harnesses to end customers and dealerships.
    If you want to get a harness to install yourself, I'd suggest contacting Josh directly (jwelwell@elwellcorp.com).  He put me on a list for direct shipment when they arrive.
    Regarding the unit upgrade, he said:
    Thankfully I can tell you that there is an upgraded unit coming in the future that will have stronger output of BTU. I don’t have a final number regarding the BTU. I do know they will be coming in the next few months. We were supposed to have stock months ago, but our supplier has just started back production after COVID. I am hoping to have some more updates soon but that is the knowledge that I have at this moment.
    Based on these data, my conjecture is that Elwell will be addressing issues with their existing AIR8 (like the harness and a programming change to have the fan run continuously in cooling mode, while NuCamp will be footing the bill for replacement units for those who've lodged a warranty claim.  Just my conjecture (and yes, I tow a TAB400 with a TV that has a 4000#/400# tow/tongue capacity) so judge accordingly!
    Roger and Sue Hill | 2020 T@B400 Boondock (Cryst@bel) | 2022 Land Rover Defender 110 - P400 | San Juan Island, WA
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    VernaVerna Member Posts: 6,878
    Elwell will be footing all of the bill on this adventure says a reliable source.....
    Verna, Columbus, IN
    2021 T@B 320S  Boondock “The T@B”
    Towed by a white 2019 Ford F-150 4x4 Supercab, 3.5L V6 Ecoboost “The Truck”
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    AirBossAirBoss Member Posts: 740
    @rh5555, yep. That's essentially what I heard from Elwell, as well ( sorry, that was too easy to pass up!).

    This month for the harness,  sometime later this summer or fall for upgraded unit. 
    2020 T@B 400 "OTTO" (build date 08/19)
    Factory Victron Solar; Norcold 3-way fridge
    '04 Chevy Tahoe Z71 DinoKiller
    San Diego, CA
    www.airbossone.com
    https://fineartamerica.com/profiles/owen-ashurst/shop


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    johnfconwayjohnfconway Member Posts: 291
    Sounds like there will be an Elwell Tech person available to do replacement/modifications in cases where the Dealer is not up to the job. That could get pretty expensive for Elwell when owners (like us) live in the middle of nowhere. To anyone's knowledge, will there be a list of Dealers qualified and willing to do the work? Maybe Elwell Tech person at Dealership by appointment for specific days?
    2020 T@B 400 BDL towed with 2019 Nissan Frontier Pro-4X  Silver City, NM
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    Dutch061Dutch061 Member Posts: 765
    They will need to come to me, as I am not surrendering my camper to leave at the dealership for an extended period of time. Otherwise it can be added to the list of things for December when it ends up back in OH for warranty work.
    2020 400 BDL aka "Boonie"
    2022 Black Series HQ19 aka "Cricket"
    2021 F-250 Tremor with PSD aka "Big Blue"
    Concord, NC 
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    johnfconwayjohnfconway Member Posts: 291
    edited June 2020
    We're new at this. I take it that repair or warranty work at dealer is not "same day" as with many auto repairs?
    2020 T@B 400 BDL towed with 2019 Nissan Frontier Pro-4X  Silver City, NM
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    AirBossAirBoss Member Posts: 740
    @johnfconway
    It varies from dealer to dealer but it also depends on the level of work required. I've been fortunate that I've only had one warranty repair to switch the lines for the Black Water Tank Flush. Made an appt., work was completed in 1.5 hours. 

    I suspect the replacement of the Air 8 may take a bit longer that 1.5 hours. Dunno. 

    Dutch061 said:
    They will need to come to me, as I am not surrendering my camper to leave at the dealership for an extended period of time. Otherwise it can be added to the list of things for December when it ends up back in OH for warranty work.
    I'd think it likely that if you're on the list for warranty repair for Air 8, it will be your discretion as to timing and dealer/nuCamp schedule. 
    2020 T@B 400 "OTTO" (build date 08/19)
    Factory Victron Solar; Norcold 3-way fridge
    '04 Chevy Tahoe Z71 DinoKiller
    San Diego, CA
    www.airbossone.com
    https://fineartamerica.com/profiles/owen-ashurst/shop


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    Dutch061Dutch061 Member Posts: 765
    For me it is not a huge deal, I can work around it for the most part because we typically head to the higher country in the summer anyway for cooler weather overall. I would like them to send me the fix for the temperature sensor and re-evaluate after I have proper temperature control.

    I even said "I don't think it is fair to judge the efficiency of the unit until proper temperature control is put into place". The reply was they would add me to the replacement unit list, I guess to cover it in a "one and done" manner.

    Brad
    2020 400 BDL aka "Boonie"
    2022 Black Series HQ19 aka "Cricket"
    2021 F-250 Tremor with PSD aka "Big Blue"
    Concord, NC 
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    Sharon_is_SAMSharon_is_SAM Administrator Posts: 9,500
    I wonder if this device might help until the Air8 issues are resolved.
    Sharon / 2017 T@B CSS / 2015 Toyota Sienna Minivan / Westlake, Ohio
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    AirBossAirBoss Member Posts: 740
    @Sharon_is_SAM I was looking at that myself. Going to try the small USB type fan to help circulate the air around. See how that works out. 

    It certainly couldn't hurt. Be a shame if it helped out so much that I could turn off the Air 8!  ;)
    2020 T@B 400 "OTTO" (build date 08/19)
    Factory Victron Solar; Norcold 3-way fridge
    '04 Chevy Tahoe Z71 DinoKiller
    San Diego, CA
    www.airbossone.com
    https://fineartamerica.com/profiles/owen-ashurst/shop


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    Sharon_is_SAMSharon_is_SAM Administrator Posts: 9,500
    I am thinking it is a small enough space that with a fan to circulate, it may help.
    Sharon / 2017 T@B CSS / 2015 Toyota Sienna Minivan / Westlake, Ohio
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    Denny16Denny16 Member Posts: 5,445
    My thoughts also.
    cheers
    2018 TaB400 Custom Boondock,  Jeep Gladiator truck, Northern California Coast.
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    AirBossAirBoss Member Posts: 740
    Might be worth it @ $90. Essentially a battery powered swamp cooler from the looks of it. Not a true A/C unit as far as I can tell. But adding cooling and humidity may help. 
    2020 T@B 400 "OTTO" (build date 08/19)
    Factory Victron Solar; Norcold 3-way fridge
    '04 Chevy Tahoe Z71 DinoKiller
    San Diego, CA
    www.airbossone.com
    https://fineartamerica.com/profiles/owen-ashurst/shop


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    VictoriaPVictoriaP Member Posts: 1,492
    AirBoss said:
    Might be worth it @ $90. Essentially a battery powered swamp cooler from the looks of it. Not a true A/C unit as far as I can tell. But adding cooling and humidity may help. 
    From everything I’ve read on those units, don’t waste your money. A good fan with a bucket of ice in front of it is cheaper, and about as effective.
    2019 320s BD Lite, white with blue (“Haven”)
    2015 Subaru Outback 3.6r (unsafe 200lb tongue weight limit until 2020 models)
    2020 Subaru Outback XT
    Pacific NW
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    AirBossAirBoss Member Posts: 740
    Good point, @VictoriaP
    Now that you mention it, that was the way we cooled off when I was just a pup. bucket of ice and the old "Zero" room fan! 
    2020 T@B 400 "OTTO" (build date 08/19)
    Factory Victron Solar; Norcold 3-way fridge
    '04 Chevy Tahoe Z71 DinoKiller
    San Diego, CA
    www.airbossone.com
    https://fineartamerica.com/profiles/owen-ashurst/shop


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    VictoriaPVictoriaP Member Posts: 1,492
    AirBoss said:
    Good point, @VictoriaP
    Now that you mention it, that was the way we cooled off when I was just a pup. bucket of ice and the old "Zero" room fan! 
    Having dealt at home with an undersized portable AC for several years, my Vornado fans are absolute game changers. They are the difference between AC that barely chills one corner of the bedroom versus AC that circulates all around the room and clear out into the hallway. I won’t buy any other brand now, they’re worth the extra money to me. 

    Fingers crossed that the new Elwell makes a difference for all those affected!
    2019 320s BD Lite, white with blue (“Haven”)
    2015 Subaru Outback 3.6r (unsafe 200lb tongue weight limit until 2020 models)
    2020 Subaru Outback XT
    Pacific NW
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    Dutch061Dutch061 Member Posts: 765
    AirBoss said:
    Might be worth it @ $90. Essentially a battery powered swamp cooler from the looks of it. Not a true A/C unit as far as I can tell. But adding cooling and humidity may help. 

    Yes, a miniature swamp cooler (humidifier) is exactly what it is. In southern CA it might be okay but with the humidity we have in NC it would be worthless.

    Brad

    2020 400 BDL aka "Boonie"
    2022 Black Series HQ19 aka "Cricket"
    2021 F-250 Tremor with PSD aka "Big Blue"
    Concord, NC 
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    crohrbachercrohrbacher Member Posts: 24
    After running the Air8 in my T@b 400 for 5 hours. Top is inside, bottom is outside.
    Charles / 2020 T@B 400BDL / 2019 Ford Ranger / Cibolo, TX
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    TNOutbackTNOutback Member Posts: 633
    @VictoriaP we too love our Vornado fans in the house.  I measured their amperage and was surprised to find Low only uses 0.4A, Medium 0.53A, and High 0.59A.  More than a USB fan, but reasonable to use boondocking if you want to move more air.  It sure puts out a lot of wind for that low power!  I did put one in the camper on the floor, pointed up at the ceiling to see if it helped the Air8.  I could not tell that it helped cool down the camper any better, but it did seem to keep the thermostat reading a bit higher (preventing premature shut off).  if the camper is in the sun, the a/c just cannot overcome the heat gain.  Until the sun got off the camper, the best it could do (with the fan running on the floor) was bouncing between 84-86 degrees, on an 87 degree afternoon.
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    VictoriaPVictoriaP Member Posts: 1,492
    TNOutback said:
    @VictoriaP we too love our Vornado fans in the house.  I measured their amperage and was surprised to find Low only uses 0.4A, Medium 0.53A, and High 0.59A.  More than a USB fan, but reasonable to use boondocking if you want to move more air.  It sure puts out a lot of wind for that low power!  I did put one in the camper on the floor, pointed up at the ceiling to see if it helped the Air8.  I could not tell that it helped cool down the camper any better, but it did seem to keep the thermostat reading a bit higher (preventing premature shut off).  if the camper is in the sun, the a/c just cannot overcome the heat gain.  Until the sun got off the camper, the best it could do (with the fan running on the floor) was bouncing between 84-86 degrees, on an 87 degree afternoon.
    I did wonder if a Vornado would help as a short term solution; sounds like the answer is, “Not much.” Bummer. I really hope Elwell gets this resolved for everyone affected before the current camping season concludes!
    2019 320s BD Lite, white with blue (“Haven”)
    2015 Subaru Outback 3.6r (unsafe 200lb tongue weight limit until 2020 models)
    2020 Subaru Outback XT
    Pacific NW
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    TampakayakerTampakayaker Member Posts: 554
    Sharon_is_SAM said:
    I wonder if this device might help until the Air8 issues are resolved.
    Aldi had a similar device on sale last week for $19.99
    2006 RAM 1500 4 door, 2016 T@B 320 MAX S 
    Tampa FL
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    Dutch061Dutch061 Member Posts: 765
    crohrbacher said:
    After running the Air8 in my T@b 400 for 5 hours. Top is inside, bottom is outside.

    If this was in full sunlight; 14 degrees difference is reasonable, I say that for a few reasons.

    1. The Delta between inlet and outlet temperatures on an air conditioner is 15 to 20 degrees any given day. This applies to most residential units also. The theory being as it gets cooler inside that the lower inlet temperatures will result in lower outlet temperatures.

    2. I had a 36 foot 5th wheel with a 13.5K BTU that wouldn't have done that well, I added a 2nd 13.5K BTU unit and could barely get 18 to 20 degrees cooler in direct sunlight with both of them running continuously.

    3. The 2017 Tab 320S we had, would never get that cool with the Danby running in direct sunlight.

    Adding another 1K or 1.5K BTU with the upgraded unit that is coming may get it another 1 or 2 degrees cooler but I sincerely doubt you are going to see much more than that. Time will tel, as I am on the list too.

    Brad
    2020 400 BDL aka "Boonie"
    2022 Black Series HQ19 aka "Cricket"
    2021 F-250 Tremor with PSD aka "Big Blue"
    Concord, NC 
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    ChrisFixChrisFix Member Posts: 725
    edited June 2020
    @Dutch061
    I have a 2021 T@B 400 with the Coolcat and it has no problem getting to 70 degrees sitting in full sun in central NC...The inside trailer temp can be over 100 (104 this afternoon) and literally, 15 minutes of air conditioning, it is comfortable in the trailer. The Air 8 is under performing by leaps and bounds for the folks reporting about it here compared to what the Coolcat does.
    After two years of looking and considering...finally the proud owner of a 2021 T@B 400 Boondock!
    2023 Honda Ridgeline RTL-E with Redarc Trailer Brake Controller
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    Dutch061Dutch061 Member Posts: 765
    ChrisFix said:
    @Dutch061
    I have a 2021 T@B 400 with the Coolcat and it has no problem getting t 70 degrees sitting in full sun in central NC...The inside the trailer temp can be over 100 (104 this afternoon) and literally, 15 minutes of air conditioning, it is comfortable in the trailer. The Air 8 is under performing by leaps and bounds for the folks reporting about it here compared to what the Coolcat does.

    This is good to know, as I also live in NC in the Charlotte area. I now have a target that NuCamp will need to be able to reach. I wonder what the actual BTU Rating is for the Coolcat?

    Brad


    2020 400 BDL aka "Boonie"
    2022 Black Series HQ19 aka "Cricket"
    2021 F-250 Tremor with PSD aka "Big Blue"
    Concord, NC 
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